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ice in pvp

AuthorMessage
Survivor
May 30, 2009
47
not to increase you point or anything, they can put in 8 tower shields with the new decks, not 5.

Delver
Aug 13, 2010
234
Ice can spam shields yes, but you need 3 pips to take them away. Ice needs to use blades, Balefrost, feints, and so many buffs. Other schools can Blade once and could kill the Ice with right attack. Ice was just underpowered a year ago, now yes, they are a bit overpowered. Soon it'll be another school, Death.

Defender
Jul 12, 2009
180
and i love my frozen armor i once beat a fire ten lvls above me because of it. lol. towers resist health and absorbs never forget them.

Survivor
Sep 06, 2010
12
SantaIceBurg wrote:
Well my Ice has 50 Ice Damage, 41 resist, and 4493 health. It seems quite hard right? But shatter can take shields off, and it'll take quite a while to blade up for Ice. But in my highest opinion, Ice is a bit overpowered.

You go SantaIceBurg!

Champion
Apr 18, 2010
407
The problem with ice isn't so much their giant resist, but more so the fact that their con - low damage - is no longer a con due to blade stacking.

Armiger
Mar 18, 2009
2381
Solstice64 wrote:
The problem with ice isn't so much their giant resist, but more so the fact that their con - low damage - is no longer a con due to blade stacking.


Everyone can stack blades, so Ice doesn't have an advantage here. While Ice can take their low damage spells and increase through blade stacking, Ice will always be lower compared to most other schools when they stack their blades. If I remember correctly, only Death gets more blade stacking options than other schools.

Defender
May 29, 2011
134
JoshuaWilliam1 wrote:
It's curious how the ice wizards are assumed to have top of the line gear including crafted gear from Zafaria, and perfect pets. So ok, now that we assume we are fighting top geared and perfect pet ice wizards against run of the mill storm (cause run of the mill storm owns just fine) now the example makes sense, not really.

Do you realize how much storm criticals and how rarely wild bolt hits for the lowest damage possible? It sure seems like a lot of the criticals are unblocked...ice doesn't have high critical block nor does it have high critical compared to other classes.

In both of your scenario's ice has done nothing offensively. It has shielded and used pips for "ice armor" why storm continues the offensive. AT what point does ice run out of shields? At what point is ice bladding, trapping, putting down it's circle of ice, and ripping off a 8 pip angel or 9 pip mammoth? Lord knows we are healing our butts off just to stay alive, and if we can't find a shield and you crit on a 2 pip spell it's not good for ice or any class (it's not like everyone complains about bolts because they are ineffective and not used).

It seems like if another elemental class can't kill someone in 4 minutes, then the other class must be overpowered.

Anyways storm is going to crit on 2 or 3 of the 5 bolts and will kill an ice wizard if he just shields for 5 turns.

I'm about 25 hatches into my perfect pet and I'm still hatching.



Absolutely wrong. First of all, playing on my brothers ice, that plan would definitely fail. One, if your so busy attacking him with your lucky shots the ice can heal no problom. In fact, the only way it probably would work if if you got extremley lucky. Ice does not shield and heal 24/7, a good ice wizard will find the right time to attack and the right time to shield. By the way, most ice wizards do not use that absorb damage X spell, or at least thats what I see.

Ice will never become immortal, but possibly close. Each school has been over powered at one point, may be ice's turn. Next will probably be death. Either way, as the game changes, peoples strategy change. Then even so people will eventually find a way to kill ice even if they come up 65-70% universal resist.( which is pretty close to immortal if you ask me )

Champion
Apr 18, 2010
407
kingurz wrote:

Everyone can stack blades, so Ice doesn't have an advantage here. While Ice can take their low damage spells and increase through blade stacking, Ice will always be lower compared to most other schools when they stack their blades. If I remember correctly, only Death gets more blade stacking options than other schools.


Ice is best suited for stacking blades as they have the ability to survive while they stack. Along with that, Ice has the largest bubble in the game, so they are the best school for stacking (the only blade death has over the other schools is dark pact, which is seldom pvp viable.)

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
Solstice64 wrote:
kingurz wrote:

Everyone can stack blades, so Ice doesn't have an advantage here. While Ice can take their low damage spells and increase through blade stacking, Ice will always be lower compared to most other schools when they stack their blades. If I remember correctly, only Death gets more blade stacking options than other schools.


Ice is best suited for stacking blades as they have the ability to survive while they stack. Along with that, Ice has the largest bubble in the game, so they are the best school for stacking (the only blade death has over the other schools is dark pact, which is seldom pvp viable.)


When we say "blade stacking options", what are we talking about here? Are we talking about total boosts for a specific school of magic? If we are talking about school specific trained charm spells, then storm wins at 3 with elemental blade, stormblade, and supercharge. If we include trained spells with a generic blade, then death ties storm at 3 with spirit blade, deathblade, and dark pact. If we're talking about total "boosts" (of a charm or ward nature) which are assigned to your school, then balance wins at 7, followed by death and storm at 5. If we aren't talking about either of those things, could I get some clarification?

Survivor
May 26, 2010
15
Ice is absolutely not becoming immortal if you dont like it make your own ice like i did.

my ice now has a total of, and my intention is to brag, 65% resist to all besides fire and storm, 75% to fire and storm.

Ice isnt overpowered. It seems only my ice is

btw my pet's talents are spell proof, spell defy, fire proof and storm proof.

Squire
Jun 19, 2009
514
The thing is, I agree with you, but KI can't help it. This is why pvp never works. The higher the worlds get, the more powerful the players get and they need more powerful gear and spells, then they abuse their new abilities and power in pvp. :(

Armiger
Mar 18, 2009
2381
gtarhannon wrote:
Solstice64 wrote:
kingurz wrote:

Everyone can stack blades, so Ice doesn't have an advantage here. While Ice can take their low damage spells and increase through blade stacking, Ice will always be lower compared to most other schools when they stack their blades. If I remember correctly, only Death gets more blade stacking options than other schools.


Ice is best suited for stacking blades as they have the ability to survive while they stack. Along with that, Ice has the largest bubble in the game, so they are the best school for stacking (the only blade death has over the other schools is dark pact, which is seldom pvp viable.)


When we say "blade stacking options", what are we talking about here? Are we talking about total boosts for a specific school of magic? If we are talking about school specific trained charm spells, then storm wins at 3 with elemental blade, stormblade, and supercharge. If we include trained spells with a generic blade, then death ties storm at 3 with spirit blade, deathblade, and dark pact. If we're talking about total "boosts" (of a charm or ward nature) which are assigned to your school, then balance wins at 7, followed by death and storm at 5. If we aren't talking about either of those things, could I get some clarification?


Seems it doesn't matter. Solstice64's underlying problem is Ice's defenses, while stacking. Nothing really to do with stacking itself, since you already pointed out, that Ice loses the "stacking" battle.

Champion
Apr 18, 2010
407
gtarhannon wrote:

When we say "blade stacking options", what are we talking about here? Are we talking about total boosts for a specific school of magic? If we are talking about school specific trained charm spells, then storm wins at 3 with elemental blade, stormblade, and supercharge. If we include trained spells with a generic blade, then death ties storm at 3 with spirit blade, deathblade, and dark pact. If we're talking about total "boosts" (of a charm or ward nature) which are assigned to your school, then balance wins at 7, followed by death and storm at 5. If we aren't talking about either of those things, could I get some clarification?


Super Charge isn't pvp viable as with dark pact (well dark pact is viable, but not for blading purposes.)

Ice has: a 40% blade, a 35% elemental blade, a 35% bubble, plus treasure boosts. Along with that, they have huge resist allowing them to survive long enough to stack a huge amount of blades. They also have a DoT attack so shield don't ruin their stacked boosts.

Storm has: a 30% blade, a 35% elemental blade, a 25% bubble, plus treasure blades. Not enough to resist to last long enough to stack those anyways. No DoT to avoid shields to ruin the boosts.

Death has: a 40% blade and a 35% blade + treasures. It also has DoTs to go around shields with decent survivability. Compared to ice though, its not good enough.

Sorry, but counting blades isn't enough to prove anything about pvp.


Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
Solstice64 wrote:
Super Charge isn't pvp viable as with dark pact (well dark pact is viable, but not for blading purposes.)

What are you talking about? Both are viable, though for different reasons, and at different times. You don't get to dismiss them simply because you don't use them or their existence is inconvenient to your argument.

Solstice64 wrote:
Ice has: a 40% blade, a 35% elemental blade, a 35% bubble, plus treasure boosts. Along with that, they have huge resist allowing them to survive long enough to stack a huge amount of blades. They also have a DoT attack so shield don't ruin their stacked boosts.

Ice has a 40% blade, a 35% elemental bubble, and a 30% trap. Balance has a 35% elemental blade which is available to every elemental school just as the 35% spirit blade is available to every spirit school. Everyone has access to a variety of treasure and item boosts.

Solstice64 wrote:
Storm has: a 30% blade, a 35% elemental blade, a 25% bubble, plus treasure blades. Not enough to resist to last long enough to stack those anyways. No DoT to avoid shields to ruin the boosts.

Rather defeatist I would say...

Solstice64 wrote:
Death has: a 40% blade and a 35% blade + treasures. It also has DoTs to go around shields with decent survivability. Compared to ice though, its not good enough.

Why have you mentioned nothing at all about traps of any kind?

Solstice64 wrote:
Sorry, but counting blades isn't enough to prove anything about pvp.

So then, you're saying the burden of proof is on me somehow? I asked you to define what you meant by "blade stacking options". Clearly, you and I don't have the same definition of "options", because if we did, I most certainly would be able to "count blades" in order to prove something about PvP. Speaking of proof... what exactly are you trying to prove?

Ice has huge resist and health as a way of living long enough to stack whereas life has heavy healing to accomplish the same thing. Still other schools, such as myth and storm, have ways of removing those blades. Bubble spells, on the other hand, are a war with only the most recently cast one winning. Since only life and balance cannot compete in the bubble war, clearly, no advantage for Ice there.

If your assertion is still that Ice is "the best school for stacking" and we cannot simply count the number blades (or traps either, apparently), could you please define exactly what you mean and then detail what method we would use to resolve this conflict should I still disagree after your definition?

Survivor
Jun 22, 2011
35
Okay let me put it this way. It comes down to how the person uses it. Ice is high resist and high HP and we plan to use it to our advantage. Storm has high damage spells. We put our towers down in order to hinder you. See, thats putting your magic to good use. Now, lets stop crying and use your magic to your advantage.

Aaron WinterRiver
Transcended Thaumaturge

Defender
May 15, 2010
153
SantaIceBurg wrote:
Well my Ice has 50 Ice Damage, 41 resist, and 4493 health. It seems quite hard right? But shatter can take shields off, and it'll take quite a while to blade up for Ice. But in my highest opinion, Ice is a bit overpowered.


I've seen a level seventy with health just brimming 2,000. With twenty more levels, you'd have nearly 10,000 health. That is practically immortal. Though, the ice spells may be a wee bit weak, they can be kind of effective in a way. Like, cyclops, it's a weak spell, but it's effective

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
953
I would like to add in just one question, how many of you have faced a Trancended Ice, with full gear, double resist pets, Warlord status and that knows what they are doing (in the last four months)?

Plus let me add, my Ice has Zafaria crafted gear, the WW boots, Double resist pet with Acc and hit. His health is around 4200, resist at 48 and 65, and a hit close to 50%. He has the Life Amulet, plus a solid wand. He is an absolute bear to kill in PvP.

I have faced many Warlord Ice on my Balance and even a few on my Death.
Let me tell you, Ice is a monster to kill, especially if they have their Deck setup correctly, know how to use Minions, and they plan on winning the Aura war.
Earthquake is the only way to keep them down, but if planned correctly, even that can't stop them for long.

Is Ice immortal, no, my Balance can still take them down, my death can soemtimes take them down, and I expect my Myth could do well against them in 1v1.

So, Ice is not immortal, but they are a Bear to kill in PvP.

Just my thoughts,
Joe.




Survivor
May 30, 2009
47
We do a lot of complaining. First it was Storm was dominating the arena. Now KI has listened ... and apparently reversed it.

I'm going to do a lot of writing.

Let's take Ice's best gear:
(Comparing Resist/health to attack)
Frostbit Hood:12%
Celestian Snow Smock(Controversy! Snow Smock, +5 resist, Frostbit +166 health. If ice has 4,400 health, 44 is 1%. Therefore, 5% is equal to 220, therefore, Snow Smock would keep you alive longer. This is pure survival here, not damage)17%
Frostbit Boots +10%
Elissa's Chill Band +3%
I can't find stuff for Athame!
Spell-proof+10%
59% resist
Tower, treasure and item, plus storm shield and and volcanic(?)
Storm has Supercharge +140%
item blade, blade, treasure
gargantuaned Levy(1335)
Spirit, treasure, feint, treasure
+20 from Electric Chieftain's Helm, plus +26 from Chief's Garb of Gale, +20 from Skyscream Boots, +9 claw +9 amethyst +8 storm giver. thats 94%.
math time: Levithan does base 1335. Gear Boosts amount to 94%. thats 2,590 damage. Then, supercharge, 6,216. three storm blades, that is+more

42,562

Storm has taken damage already, I would say around 1000, so he has around 1500 health left.

The Damage Ice takes is: 4,696!!!! It kills and storm winds. [Note, this is purely hypothetical, and it is possible for other variations for ice just to blade up ect.. Usually, the one who goes first wins due to them being about equal]


Survivor
Mar 25, 2011
6
Ice can go up to 70% resistance I dont really think thats fair. Kingisle should kinda lower it down to 50% or something really getting unfair

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
953
CodyVector wrote:
Ice can go up to 70% resistance I dont really think thats fair. Kingisle should kinda lower it down to 50% or something really getting unfair


CodyVector,

Ok, but only to Storm and Fire, none of the others. Now Heckhound can do over 6000 over three rounds on their constant criticals, how fare is that.
Even with 70 resists, that does over 1800 damage, for one attack.
I normally see Fire hit Criticals about once every three rounds.

Now Ice counters with their extremely weak attack, with 70 resist, on a fire that normally has 42 to 45 resist.
See, it's a balance, the high Ice resist counters the Fire high attack.
The Ice weak attack is countered by the Fire lower resist.

Joe.

Mastermind
Jul 08, 2011
305
face it ice is way to overpowered.

i have seen ice wizards with almost 5000 health along with over 40% resist
now lets take an average ice wizard lets say they have 4500 health or so. now with standard waterworks gear they would have 34% resist, but since a lot of people use the level 58 gear that gives the 17% universal resist over the frostbitten cape, with about 200 less health or so. i havent really memorized the stats for it anyways with the 17 resist cape thats 39 resist. Now many players have spell proof on their pets and or spell defy, so we will factor in that we now have 4500 health plus 43% resist assuming the spell proof is 9% with the frostbitten cape, and 4300 health plus 48% resist with the level 58 cape which is essentially a tower shield on every attack

Now i am a storm wizard so that is especially insane thats not even accounting for the spell defy on a pet, or the resist you can get that i saw on a ring.

something needs to be done because every other school is rather powerless against stopping that.

Kevin Deaththorn level 70 storm
Chase Lifegiver level 36 life
Jack Seastalker level 32 death

Geographer
Nov 26, 2011
865
sugarbear114 wrote:
Think of the storm the most powerful school and ice the most highest health school

Ice can simply put 5 tower shields into his deck if he is level 60 so there he can use many tower shields WHILE there blades are giving them lots of power the storm wizard at level 60 has a shield for fire and ice but its more difficult because the ice has snow angel plus they can simply power up easily and use there wooly mammoth at level 70 this is not good the tower shield is ruining it for the storm wizards so is there resistance plus there spells such as frost giant stun but do low damage at the same time that card is so effective when it criticals simply the storm wizards are powerful and can pwn the ice but not possible with there resistance about 65% and the tower shield making the resistance 80% so then the critical for the leviathan or storm lord will only help it up to 50% while that 20% goes to the ice that 20% should be for the storm

Your just jealous of Thaumaturges (ice wizard). Face it, we are better!

Elizabeth Winterthief
Level 26
Thaumaturge

I agree, a diviner is jealous of us thaumaturges (well i am more like pyromancer now) Anyways, Jessica Sparklegem lvl 70 ice and Jasmine Fireblade lvl 70 pyromancer

Hero
Sep 08, 2008
716
One thing that REALLY irks me here is that Ice wizards have a relatively cheap minion that will spam Ice BATS and Ice SHARK on a regular, bladed basis.

ICE ..... KI was sure to quickly take away the Storm shark that my Myth minion *used* to have.

Granted, you'd simply have to find a way to quickly take out a minion with a quick spell...

BUT when you are a level 30 balance wizard, this will not always be easy considering you only have 50% power pips chance, while at the same time, shielding from opponents attacks.

It still continues to baffle me.... A Ice wizard with a minion casting BATS and SHARKS. My hair turns gray as we speak!

Mastermind
Jul 08, 2011
305
Shiningfantasia wrote:
One thing that REALLY irks me here is that Ice wizards have a relatively cheap minion that will spam Ice BATS and Ice SHARK on a regular, bladed basis.

ICE ..... KI was sure to quickly take away the Storm shark that my Myth minion *used* to have.

Granted, you'd simply have to find a way to quickly take out a minion with a quick spell...

BUT when you are a level 30 balance wizard, this will not always be easy considering you only have 50% power pips chance, while at the same time, shielding from opponents attacks.

It still continues to baffle me.... A Ice wizard with a minion casting BATS and SHARKS. My hair turns gray as we speak!


yes that sounds pretty bad but it is a hundred times better than storms water elemental that will shield itself when nothing is attacking it and it has sprite but seems to only want to use it on itself when it is at full health. All of the minions are pretty bad except for the forest sprite that will actually use a heal on another thing. The only other move it really ever uses is taunt all enemies...

so this would be its moveset for its battle

first turn elemental shield on itself
second turn sprite itself with full health
third turn taunt all enemies, and start the cycle over and over again until it dies

Armiger
Mar 18, 2009
2381
thejordanator wrote:
first turn elemental shield on itself
second turn sprite itself with full health
third turn taunt all enemies, and start the cycle over and over again until it dies


Exactly, that's what it is suppose to do.

How you interact with your minion is more important, than what your minion actually casts.