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Limit pet cast chance by level?

AuthorMessage
A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
Okay, so, you know how there's those level 5 opponents where their pets constantly spam heals and they never die and they can't kill you either so you go into an eternal pass-off? Well, how about in just PvP, there would be a "penalty" in the chances your pet has of healing depending on your level. Say, if you're level 10 and under, your pet won't heal as much as a wizard at level 30. Why? Simply because pet talents such as Fairy Friend, Unicorn, and Healing Current take a level 5 wizard back up to full health or nearly full health in one turn, and there aren't any Reshuffles. So this is how it should be:
Levels 1-4: All healing talents (except Batusi) will have a -50% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 5-15: Fairy Friend, Unicorn, and Healing Current have a -30% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 16-30: Fairy Friend and Healing Current have a -25% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 31-39: Healing Current has a -15% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 40+: Pet talents will have a normal chance of casting in PvP.
Sound good?

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4113
Makes no sense. Low levels already have the "penalty" of lower health to start with. If you're having trouble killing level 5 players, don't blame the pets.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
seethe42 on Jun 2, 2014 wrote:
Makes no sense. Low levels already have the "penalty" of lower health to start with. If you're having trouble killing level 5 players, don't blame the pets.
Yes, they do have low health, but they also have 54% resist do they not? Add that up with Health Gift and Health Bounty and you have one tough and annoying low level wizard. Most level 5 Warlord matches go into pass-offs because pet heal, and they don't even have Reshuffle yet. So yes, having a lower pet cast rate is needed at those levels.

Squire
Sep 07, 2011
593
NO. This has become absurd. How many threads are there now asking for game mechanics to be changed to suit your preference for PvP? Players under your level are too hard to kill? That makes no sense. You already have higher health, better gear, and stronger spells.

Pets are available to anyone who bothers to get them. Any pet with a may-cast talent has exactly the same chance of casting as any other pet with that talent. It is fair. Pet casts were already nerfed - at the expense of every PvE player in the game - to please a few PvPers (not even a majority) who whined.

Just stop. PvP is fine and fair the way it is. If you can't handle the gear, spells, pets in it now, adjust your strategy, or move on.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
Gemma Luna on Jun 3, 2014 wrote:
NO. This has become absurd. How many threads are there now asking for game mechanics to be changed to suit your preference for PvP? Players under your level are too hard to kill? That makes no sense. You already have higher health, better gear, and stronger spells.

Pets are available to anyone who bothers to get them. Any pet with a may-cast talent has exactly the same chance of casting as any other pet with that talent. It is fair. Pet casts were already nerfed - at the expense of every PvE player in the game - to please a few PvPers (not even a majority) who whined.

Just stop. PvP is fine and fair the way it is. If you can't handle the gear, spells, pets in it now, adjust your strategy, or move on.
I never said I fought players under my level in the first place, because at rank 2000+ that's never the case. The reason why I said this, is because multiple times when I see my level 10 friends doing PvP, or when I do PvP on my level 10 wizard, there's usually a pass off because pets constantly heal. I also said earlier that it would only affect PvP and has nothing to do with PvE, get over yourself and take your time to read.

Major heals from pets are too strong at the lower levels, therefore they need a lower chance at casting. Period.

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2920
Beautifully said, Gemma!

@PvP King~ my magus vet has run into those level 5 and 10 warlords with ridiculous amounts of resist. But they still die when my infallible Efreet smacks them with his big sword. And if, by some chance, that doesn't kill them, my follow-through will. And, if all else fails, I'll run them out of cards and lock them into a position where they have to choose between letting me defeat them or fleeing the match. Either way, I win.

We all have the exact-same tools available, and pet heals are easy to counter. I use infection, dispels, accuracy debuffs, etc., or I save my pips and go for an OHKO. If you can't counter a pet heal, perhaps you shouldn't pvp.

-von "if you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen" shadowsong
magus veteran

Explorer
Nov 21, 2013
78
PvP King on Jun 2, 2014 wrote:
Okay, so, you know how there's those level 5 opponents where their pets constantly spam heals and they never die and they can't kill you either so you go into an eternal pass-off? Well, how about in just PvP, there would be a "penalty" in the chances your pet has of healing depending on your level. Say, if you're level 10 and under, your pet won't heal as much as a wizard at level 30. Why? Simply because pet talents such as Fairy Friend, Unicorn, and Healing Current take a level 5 wizard back up to full health or nearly full health in one turn, and there aren't any Reshuffles. So this is how it should be:
Levels 1-4: All healing talents (except Batusi) will have a -50% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 5-15: Fairy Friend, Unicorn, and Healing Current have a -30% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 16-30: Fairy Friend and Healing Current have a -25% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 31-39: Healing Current has a -15% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 40+: Pet talents will have a normal chance of casting in PvP.
Sound good?
I don't like this idea either. Pets aren't the only thing causing lower-level Wizards to run out of cards or come to a draw. Ever fought a low-level Life Wizard that loves to use absorbs and loads their side board with heals? Small deck sizes and, for the most part, a lack of damage and stronger spells are usually the reason those matches end like that. You seem to only be interested in making PvP easier. I don't think pet heals are a problem at any level; they're just part of the game. A Life Dispel or an Infection is not hard to add to your strategy before you decide to hit or combo.

A+ Student
Jan 11, 2012
1680
PvP King on Jun 2, 2014 wrote:
Okay, so, you know how there's those level 5 opponents where their pets constantly spam heals and they never die and they can't kill you either so you go into an eternal pass-off? Well, how about in just PvP, there would be a "penalty" in the chances your pet has of healing depending on your level. Say, if you're level 10 and under, your pet won't heal as much as a wizard at level 30. Why? Simply because pet talents such as Fairy Friend, Unicorn, and Healing Current take a level 5 wizard back up to full health or nearly full health in one turn, and there aren't any Reshuffles. So this is how it should be:
Levels 1-4: All healing talents (except Batusi) will have a -50% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 5-15: Fairy Friend, Unicorn, and Healing Current have a -30% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 16-30: Fairy Friend and Healing Current have a -25% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 31-39: Healing Current has a -15% chance of casting in PvP
Levels 40+: Pet talents will have a normal chance of casting in PvP.
Sound good?
If you're a PVP King, how come you keep posting topics to change PVP, without many PVP users backing you up? If PvP was as broken as you say it is, wouldnt more people be whining about it? The trend SEEMS TO BE that only people who lose whine. If you're winning, then why are you whining? Sure, the game could stand to be improved, zero arguments there, but you have a new topic for PvP fixing about 4 times a week lately.

As for the idea itself, I'm glad you're looking for fix only that which is broken instead of trying to change the whole game around.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
Matthew Raven 55 on Jun 4, 2014 wrote:
I don't like this idea either. Pets aren't the only thing causing lower-level Wizards to run out of cards or come to a draw. Ever fought a low-level Life Wizard that loves to use absorbs and loads their side board with heals? Small deck sizes and, for the most part, a lack of damage and stronger spells are usually the reason those matches end like that. You seem to only be interested in making PvP easier. I don't think pet heals are a problem at any level; they're just part of the game. A Life Dispel or an Infection is not hard to add to your strategy before you decide to hit or combo.
This, honestly, isn't from my personal experience, because I bet I could go for 100-0 no problem at level 10 PvP, but if you look at most matches and see pets healing 480 while the wizards themselves do around 200 damage, something's definitely wrong. A pet heal shouldn't heal as much as an attack that costs pips, period.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
dayerider on Jun 4, 2014 wrote:
If you're a PVP King, how come you keep posting topics to change PVP, without many PVP users backing you up? If PvP was as broken as you say it is, wouldnt more people be whining about it? The trend SEEMS TO BE that only people who lose whine. If you're winning, then why are you whining? Sure, the game could stand to be improved, zero arguments there, but you have a new topic for PvP fixing about 4 times a week lately.

As for the idea itself, I'm glad you're looking for fix only that which is broken instead of trying to change the whole game around.
Nah, I don't whine when I lose, simply because I don't in the first place. But if you do PvP at level 5 or 10 and you're Overlord fighting people at level 30-40 with their pets spamming, you'd see things my way. Go ahead and make a Storm wizard at level 5 with extremely low health, 55 resist, with a limit of 16 cards in your deck fighting somebody at level 30-40 with up to 2500 health and having their pets constantly healing off your attacks. My Storm Shark at most does 610 damage, their pet heals can heal at least 400, and they still have 2000 health left while they didn't lose any pips in the process, but I did. See my point?

A+ Student
Jan 11, 2012
1680
PvP King on Jun 4, 2014 wrote:
Nah, I don't whine when I lose, simply because I don't in the first place. But if you do PvP at level 5 or 10 and you're Overlord fighting people at level 30-40 with their pets spamming, you'd see things my way. Go ahead and make a Storm wizard at level 5 with extremely low health, 55 resist, with a limit of 16 cards in your deck fighting somebody at level 30-40 with up to 2500 health and having their pets constantly healing off your attacks. My Storm Shark at most does 610 damage, their pet heals can heal at least 400, and they still have 2000 health left while they didn't lose any pips in the process, but I did. See my point?
so really, your big beef, isnt that pets maycast, it's that they are free spells. The posts you're making currently have all had that flavor. Do you feel that maycast should cost pips in PvP?

Champion
Mar 27, 2011
403
PvP King on Jun 4, 2014 wrote:
Nah, I don't whine when I lose, simply because I don't in the first place. But if you do PvP at level 5 or 10 and you're Overlord fighting people at level 30-40 with their pets spamming, you'd see things my way. Go ahead and make a Storm wizard at level 5 with extremely low health, 55 resist, with a limit of 16 cards in your deck fighting somebody at level 30-40 with up to 2500 health and having their pets constantly healing off your attacks. My Storm Shark at most does 610 damage, their pet heals can heal at least 400, and they still have 2000 health left while they didn't lose any pips in the process, but I did. See my point?
That makes no sense. As things are now, your level 5 and the level 30-40 can have exactly the same pet. If you get the change you are asking for (which you won't) your pet would cast less than the level 30-40. You'd be at a disadvantage. That would be less fair.

Bad idea.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
dayerider on Jun 5, 2014 wrote:
so really, your big beef, isnt that pets maycast, it's that they are free spells. The posts you're making currently have all had that flavor. Do you feel that maycast should cost pips in PvP?
No, may casts should not cost pips in PvP, simply because you wouldn't be able to control your own pips that way. The easier and obvious solution to it is to make the cast rate appropriate per level.

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4113
PvP King on Jun 4, 2014 wrote:
Nah, I don't whine when I lose, simply because I don't in the first place. But if you do PvP at level 5 or 10 and you're Overlord fighting people at level 30-40 with their pets spamming, you'd see things my way. Go ahead and make a Storm wizard at level 5 with extremely low health, 55 resist, with a limit of 16 cards in your deck fighting somebody at level 30-40 with up to 2500 health and having their pets constantly healing off your attacks. My Storm Shark at most does 610 damage, their pet heals can heal at least 400, and they still have 2000 health left while they didn't lose any pips in the process, but I did. See my point?
So this whole scenario is totally counter to your proposal. Under your "solution" the level 5 gets -30% healing and the level 40 gets full healing. I still say it makes no sense. You are penalizing only the lower levels while complaining that healing pets make it too hard for them to beat higher levels. Your point is totally lost by your own posting of logical contradictions.

Astrologist
Oct 22, 2011
1073
PvP King on Jun 4, 2014 wrote:
Nah, I don't whine when I lose, simply because I don't in the first place. But if you do PvP at level 5 or 10 and you're Overlord fighting people at level 30-40 with their pets spamming, you'd see things my way. Go ahead and make a Storm wizard at level 5 with extremely low health, 55 resist, with a limit of 16 cards in your deck fighting somebody at level 30-40 with up to 2500 health and having their pets constantly healing off your attacks. My Storm Shark at most does 610 damage, their pet heals can heal at least 400, and they still have 2000 health left while they didn't lose any pips in the process, but I did. See my point?
Hmm. Level 5-10 fighting level 30-40.

And, who's fault is that? It's the player who decided to low-level PvP. You can't blame healing or anything else because someone thinks they can be all that and a bag of chips at level 5 or 10, but finds they are severely limited because of their extreme low-level.

My solution? LEVEL UP. That seems to be the easiest way to solve the problem.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
seethe42 on Jun 5, 2014 wrote:
So this whole scenario is totally counter to your proposal. Under your "solution" the level 5 gets -30% healing and the level 40 gets full healing. I still say it makes no sense. You are penalizing only the lower levels while complaining that healing pets make it too hard for them to beat higher levels. Your point is totally lost by your own posting of logical contradictions.
Lol no, it makes perfect sense, you're simply just avoiding the facts. I'm level 5 with 54% resist, while more than half the time my opponent has none. I'm able to survive without a pet heal, my opponent is too. The reason why I said that the decrease rates get lower the higher the level you are is to keep a balance between dueling somebody your own level, while where there's a level 5 wizard fighting a level 30 wizard, both pet heals are decreased anyway so the level 5 has a higher chance of winning due to the higher resist and damage boost. It's a lot more fair than having a level 5 wizard having pets spamming heals so the level 30 can't defeat him and the level 5 having to deal with massive health and a pet spamming.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
BrynnerOfReign on Jun 5, 2014 wrote:
Hmm. Level 5-10 fighting level 30-40.

And, who's fault is that? It's the player who decided to low-level PvP. You can't blame healing or anything else because someone thinks they can be all that and a bag of chips at level 5 or 10, but finds they are severely limited because of their extreme low-level.

My solution? LEVEL UP. That seems to be the easiest way to solve the problem.
I already have multiple higher level wizards and I want to do level 10 PvP. Why should I have to level up? Is it my fault that PvP is unfair?

Historian
May 15, 2009
673
even though I am almost entirely against pvp (for obvious reasons). I really have to disagree with this proposed idea. Even if it's affecting PvP only, it really isn't a viable solution. It's a terrible one that would leave a large number of players upset.

players should not get penalized because of their level, that would make things very unfair. Simply because you're having a hard time doesn't mean you get to make everyone else miserable too.

At least my suggestions to PvP were trying to compromise. One such example would be giving a player an option in pvp to filter out chat so they didn't have to see anyone's posts or set it so only friend's posts would appear.

what you are asking for is purely selfish because you're having a hard time coping with pet heals.

Hero
Feb 26, 2012
717
Gemma Luna on Jun 3, 2014 wrote:
NO. This has become absurd. How many threads are there now asking for game mechanics to be changed to suit your preference for PvP? Players under your level are too hard to kill? That makes no sense. You already have higher health, better gear, and stronger spells.

Pets are available to anyone who bothers to get them. Any pet with a may-cast talent has exactly the same chance of casting as any other pet with that talent. It is fair. Pet casts were already nerfed - at the expense of every PvE player in the game - to please a few PvPers (not even a majority) who whined.

Just stop. PvP is fine and fair the way it is. If you can't handle the gear, spells, pets in it now, adjust your strategy, or move on.
I totally agree. Well said Gemma.

Really, "PVP King" -- if you are having this much difficulty with pets in the arena, I think you picked the wrong moniker. And for someone who says he doesn't whine, you obviously aren't reading your own posts here -- one thread after another with constant whining about pets.

May-cast talents are a great and welcome part of gameplay both in PVE and PVP. They add an element of unpredictability and surprise to PVP, and they add a great element of assistance and companionship in PVE, especially for solo players. The whole Spiral does not revolve around the PVP arena -- and much less, around your version of how you want the arena to be.

The thread asking to nerf healing current was a bad one; this one is much, much worse. Give it a rest. Leave the pets alone. Move on to something more productive than this endless attempt to "spay and neuter" every pet in the spiral!

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4113
PvP King on Jun 6, 2014 wrote:
I already have multiple higher level wizards and I want to do level 10 PvP. Why should I have to level up? Is it my fault that PvP is unfair?
Then deal with doing lvl 10 PvP as it is and stop trying to change the game to make it easier for you. PvP isn't unfair, every proposal you make is unfair and only designed to make you win more in PvP. It has nothing to do with "fairness". The system as it stands is fair already. You just find something to whine about for every loss you have.

Astrologist
Oct 22, 2011
1073
PvP King on Jun 6, 2014 wrote:
I already have multiple higher level wizards and I want to do level 10 PvP. Why should I have to level up? Is it my fault that PvP is unfair?
If you don't want to level up, then that's your problem, not anyone else's. Just because you might feel restricted because of the spells or decks or pets or whatever, doesn't mean the game needs to change for you because you can't deal with it.

PvP is unfair. It has been for a very long time, especially since they started the 2nd age. Match-ups are unfair, because there aren't enough players at your level and/or accomplishment to play against. Which says to me, there aren't as many people playing ranked PvP as you think there are.

I did a lot of PvP in the 1st age (all solo battles - only one 3v3). I have not done any ranked in the 2nd age (I have done practice and home pvp parties). Not only is it more messed up in the 2nd age, but I was not about to take my level capped wizards into PvP and start the ranking system over again.

- 1st age Warlord (undefeated)
- 1st age Commander
- 1st age Warlord
- 1st age Warlord
- 1st age Commander
- 1st age Commander

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1556
Samuel Wolfe on Jun 6, 2014 wrote:
even though I am almost entirely against pvp (for obvious reasons). I really have to disagree with this proposed idea. Even if it's affecting PvP only, it really isn't a viable solution. It's a terrible one that would leave a large number of players upset.

players should not get penalized because of their level, that would make things very unfair. Simply because you're having a hard time doesn't mean you get to make everyone else miserable too.

At least my suggestions to PvP were trying to compromise. One such example would be giving a player an option in pvp to filter out chat so they didn't have to see anyone's posts or set it so only friend's posts would appear.

what you are asking for is purely selfish because you're having a hard time coping with pet heals.
Like I said before, this has nothing to do with me lacking strategy, spells, gear, pets, or anything, this is simply something that can never be countered at levels 1-21. I don't need lessons telling me to improve or to adjust my spells or anything like that because I'm probably already one of the tops anyway, but if there's something that can't be countered in a certain level, it shouldn't exist.

Champion
Oct 30, 2011
449
The problem of pet heals at low levels is that the heals heal a much larger percentage of health for low levels than high levels. Instead of reducing cast rate, why not just make pet heals into percentages of health rather than just one value all of the time? Since every player would have the same percentage, it would be fair. There could be maximum and minimum power of heals, in order to prevent max level ices from getting a ton of health back from each heal, or a low level storm from getting almost none. Even if the maximum and minimums were 300 and 500, it might make it fairer.

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2920
PvP King on Jun 6, 2014 wrote:
I already have multiple higher level wizards and I want to do level 10 PvP. Why should I have to level up? Is it my fault that PvP is unfair?
"Is it my fault that PvP is unfair?"

of course not. but, if you are unwilling to use the resources available to you, that's one hundred percent your fault. while pvp is broken in many ways, pet heals are not one of them.

i also have multiple high-level wizards, and that's reflected in my little pyromancer's setup; my advantage in any battle i fight is my experience at the upper levels, because i know what's available to me and how to use it most effectively, as well as how to counter those annoying things that happen.

if you truly do have multiple high-level wizard, then you should be aware of this and know how to react to the situation accordingly.

-von
exalted

Champion
Oct 30, 2011
449
Dr Von on Jun 7, 2014 wrote:
"Is it my fault that PvP is unfair?"

of course not. but, if you are unwilling to use the resources available to you, that's one hundred percent your fault. while pvp is broken in many ways, pet heals are not one of them.

i also have multiple high-level wizards, and that's reflected in my little pyromancer's setup; my advantage in any battle i fight is my experience at the upper levels, because i know what's available to me and how to use it most effectively, as well as how to counter those annoying things that happen.

if you truly do have multiple high-level wizard, then you should be aware of this and know how to react to the situation accordingly.

-von
exalted
"while pvp is broken in many ways, pet heals are not one of them." While you may consider this to be the case, pretty much everyone I know thinks the opposite. I personally do not consider it fair, no matter how much a person worked for it, for a pet to heal the player that obviously should have lost to an amount of health where they are able to win. Without sheer luck, that player would not have won. Situations like this, whether pet heals, criticals, or just none of the cards that I need showing up when I discard most of my deck, have made Wizard101 a lot less strategy based and a lot more luck based.