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no more cheats in main quest line (rant alert)

AuthorMessage
Delver
Dec 30, 2012
277
I would have to disagree.
Cheating makes a challenge and shows that not all battles are fought diligently by the opposing force.
Morganthe, for one, was easy due to lack of cheats. I personally don't mind, as long as the entire game does not run on like this. It isn't much work to just hit up the wiki or Duelist101 where they literally hand feed you everything about the battle.
I understand where you are coming from but it just is not happening. The game is still enjoyable and doable, but if you feel life is getting in the way, perhaps you should focus on life for right now and have fun games put to the side until everything is adjusted. Easier said than done, I know.

Delver
Dec 30, 2012
277
Intrepidatius on Apr 30, 2014 wrote:
There is a simple solution to this problem,which I have posted about several times; dungeons should have a difficulty selection from easy to insane. When a person/group enters a dungeon, they would make their selection of easy, medium, hard, or insane,and the drops/mobs/bosses would be adjusted accordingly. By doing this you have satisfied players of all skills/ranges. AD&D uses this with amazing success,and there is no reason to assume it wouldn't work here.

*** Please not however that if you are after that incredibly awesome/rare item, it is only attainable from the harder settings***
No.
Should I get rewarded the same amount of experience and badges and accomplishment on insane as someone on easy?
Sorry this doesn't seem to work out. Keep the game as it is. Games are suppose to get harder as you progress.

Survivor
Nov 11, 2009
39
Okay all of you need to stop complaining and think for a minute. yes i know the cheating bosses are annoying and stuff but still, if the game was just straight up fighting 100% then it wouldnt be challenging and it would get boring after a while. If they take the cheating bosses out of storyline quests then nothing in nthe game would be hard since you could solo it. The cheating bosses are there to make the game harder. Belloq and everyone need to be there or else no quest would be difficult and the games difficulty would not increase. if doesnt make a difference in the effort of players cuz one way or the other, your typing on the computer. ooh its so hard to go to a website and type in the boss's name and god forbid, READ o: then all the rare drops from cheating boss's wouldnt be rare anymore since the boss itself is not hard.

Astrologist
Oct 22, 2011
1077
sliver moon wolf on May 4, 2014 wrote:
well long as they move the cheating bosses into a side quest or something so i can still fight them i fine with it
if you guys want to ruin the game by making these happen go ahead if we don't have cheating bosses in the main story line then were not going have much of a challenge but o well i guess just because some people don't like having to really work for there level is to much of a problem so just move the cheating bosses to the side quest and replace them with lame bosses i guess

100 wizard
Challenge comes in many forms, and should not be restricted to having cheating bosses in the main storyline. It's narrow-minded to think that people don't want main-line cheating bosses because they don't want to work for their level.

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2926
sliver moon wolf on May 4, 2014 wrote:
well long as they move the cheating bosses into a side quest or something so i can still fight them i fine with it
if you guys want to ruin the game by making these happen go ahead if we don't have cheating bosses in the main story line then were not going have much of a challenge but o well i guess just because some people don't like having to really work for there level is to much of a problem so just move the cheating bosses to the side quest and replace them with lame bosses i guess

100 wizard
as previously stated, we are not asking for the game to be nerfed, or that the cheats be removed~ if those bosses are in optional dungeons, for those who wish to do them and have the time for it, that is fine by me.

fortunately for my storm wizard, brynnerofreign is a good friend of mine (though i don't get to see her, or anyone, much because of the time-zone difference). she was nice enough to help me out with ghost dog last night, and we died a total of 4 times between us, lost all of our xp because we weren't "allowed" to shield; the whole time, we pondered the fact that some people consider this "fun", and i conjured up a mental list of things i would rather do: i could go to the dentist, do calculus, or stick my head in a blender, and all of those would be less painful and less of a time vampire than having to slog through this sort of instance.

i don't understand why people equate cheats with "challenge"; it's possible to make something challenging without stonewalling people who don't play at peak hours or have the resources (infinite amounts of time, money, and friends) to complete such quests.

you need to stop assuming that casual players "don't like having to work for their level". i already have a full-time job: i don't have time for a second one.

-von "death by blender" shadowsong
exalted promethean legendary grandmaster magus veteran

Hero
Feb 26, 2012
717
Dr Von on May 2, 2014 wrote:
and, on a slightly-unrelated-but-still-related (and less rant-y) note:

MMOLuvr said:
You and so many others like "Finn", and "Northlite" contribute to these boards, and I thank you all for that. If I can assist you perhaps we can arrange a meet and greet to "Friend" our wizards and perhaps ease up some of the progression stress you are feeling, or perhaps I can assist you in a lower level wizard's progression.

You're welcome, Gabriel, and thank you for your kind words~ I would love to meet your wizard (and Finn and Mary, too).

If anyone wants to meet in-game, I'm on Central as Von Shadowsong. Feel free to stop by my page and say hi!

-v.
Thank you Von and MMOluvr! I have only ever just glanced at the Central site, never registered. Seems I already spend enough time here -- I might wind up too caught up if I started there as well. Perhaps I will have to take another look. Either way, I'm usually happy to help out, so if anyone is running into trouble let me know and we can set a time and place to meet. I live in Eastern US time zone, but I play at odd hours depending on work and family schedules -- sometimes during day, sometimes at night, sometimes early morning. With enough advance notice, though, I can usually work out a time.

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4118
Dr Von on May 4, 2014 wrote:
as previously stated, we are not asking for the game to be nerfed, or that the cheats be removed~ if those bosses are in optional dungeons, for those who wish to do them and have the time for it, that is fine by me.

fortunately for my storm wizard, brynnerofreign is a good friend of mine (though i don't get to see her, or anyone, much because of the time-zone difference). she was nice enough to help me out with ghost dog last night, and we died a total of 4 times between us, lost all of our xp because we weren't "allowed" to shield; the whole time, we pondered the fact that some people consider this "fun", and i conjured up a mental list of things i would rather do: i could go to the dentist, do calculus, or stick my head in a blender, and all of those would be less painful and less of a time vampire than having to slog through this sort of instance.

i don't understand why people equate cheats with "challenge"; it's possible to make something challenging without stonewalling people who don't play at peak hours or have the resources (infinite amounts of time, money, and friends) to complete such quests.

you need to stop assuming that casual players "don't like having to work for their level". i already have a full-time job: i don't have time for a second one.

-von "death by blender" shadowsong
exalted promethean legendary grandmaster magus veteran
You claim you don't want the game nerfed and don't mind working for stuff but you are asking for exactly the opposite. You are saying that you should be able to level and finish the game quests without doing the challenges. Again, if you do not enjoy playing the game, if you find that you would rather stick your head in a blender... WHY do you keep doing it? You keep going on and on about how much you hate it. It seems to be your goal to make it so that other people hate it too by removing challenges and enjoyment that others have.

Champion
Feb 29, 2012
488
I can offer up two viewpoints on cheating bosses, my own point of view and my brother's.

I am by no means a hardcore gamer, but I have enough gold to buy decent school resist gear. Oftentimes this, along with a little research on the specific cheats, allows me to solo most cheating boss fights quite easily. However, I still have time limitations and I'm finding it harder to complete the final dungeons in each world.

I love this game, I really do, but as a student and a family-oriented person, I often have a hard time arranging time for these dungeons and boss fights. I'm making more and more trips back to where most of my family lives to visit them and with the travel time as it is and with the amount of homework I get, finding the time to do these dungeons is hard. I do wish that there was a difficulty setting to make it easier and quicker for me to finish. I'd get to see the storyline and progress instead of just sitting around outside the dungeon, waiting for a group. I wouldn't mind if the drops were reduced, I don't really use the drops from bosses anyways.

I see this as a way for some of the difficulty to be retained for those who wish to have it while it could be easier for those who don't have the time or patience for long, drawn out fights.

That is just my view though. While I'm not sure my brother has any suggestions on how to fix this issue, I know that he is getting frustrated at the difficulty of this game.

As others before me have said, this game is advertised as a FAMILY game. And yet, I can't think of it as that when I see how disinterested from this game my brother has become. I know it's not because he hates it though, because he occasionally logs on. When he does, however, he often has me play for him, as it is too difficult for him to handle.

I miss being able to quest and joke around with him without him becoming annoyed by how complex a boss fight can be. He's young and he can't fully grasp what to do for certain bosses. Not all players can.

Champion
Feb 29, 2012
488
*continuations from my last post*

So please, I agree with the other players who encourage difficulty settings. If we had these, maybe some of the younger players who just couldn't handle the harder monsters and bosses would come back. That would mean more money for Kingsisle, the people who like challenges could have their challenges on a difficult setting and those who don't have the time or patience for those challenges could go on questing with their friends in a casual game.

Now, I agree with the drops and experience being proportional to difficulty. However, I find the one thing that makes a true solution so hard to implement is the level cap. Maybe if the max level was increased in the harder settings that could help. They'd get more experience and be higher leveled than others and they'd also get better drops. I think that would be fair.

In the end though, this is all just an idea. It's KI's decision of whether to implement it or not and until then, I'll stick by the game.

I guess the hardest part about this is knowing that it's going to be very hard, if not impossible, to please everyone with every change.

Scarlet Nightdreamer, level 97 Diviner

Historian
May 06, 2009
630
I personally don't mind Cheating bosses in the main content, as long as they aren't ridiculous cheats or have had little to no warning, preparation, or build-up. Examples are Belloq (Zf & Azt), Jabberwock, Black Annie, Belosto Toebiter, Tymen Whiteflame, Young Morganthe etc.

Cheating bosses first originated from Briskbreeze Tower during KI's long wait between Dragonspyre and Celestia. It was used to give content-hunger Level 50's something to do until Celestia. Somehow, the idea of adding this hard side-quest challenge concept to main questlines became appealing to the devs.

After the Spiral Georgraphic Warehouse, KI added more cheating to the main quest line with each of them having no warning to them and/or had the best of both worlds (two minions, average-to-high health, passive cheats (interrupt shields, utility, heals, etc.) and aggressive cheats (interrupt buff, attacks, etc.)).

Again, I have few problems with cheating bosses. I don't really care for them, but I understand some of their reasonings. What I don't like is cheatings bosses got introduced with immense powers to a relaxed game. They came in swinging and there was little warning. Now, the Waterworks, Briskbreeze Tower, and Warehouse all have an NPC state that the bosses here wouldn't play fair. I don't understand why such percautions weren't taken in Celestia. Why send players into the blood and fire without handing them a shield?

I also don't know why cheatings bosses came in as strong as the did when no such challenge happened in the 1st Arc. Astreaus and Ptolemos both had about 2-3 cheats and their Tower Shield were -90%. Where was that in prior content? Why not a treasure card version? All I'm saying is in would've been better if cheating bosses in main content would have gradually built off of current content and not optional obviously-challenging side instances.

[To Be Continued]

Historian
May 06, 2009
630
Let's forget Celestia for a second as most of the cheating bosses in that world were removed and reserved for the ending. The current conent in Celestia has few cheating stonewalls for players. Zafaria on the other hand introduced Nergal and Belloq and many more cheaters well before the end.

Belloq was a major cheating boss that is the bane of most players. Don't attack him every round, he hits you with a beefed up Ra. First off, Ra just came out in the last world. I get the rule is new spells come out in a previous world a future world will use them. But if you're going to make cheaters more of the norm, were is the warning and foundation for this battle? Why Ra and an improved one at that? You would think Ra might be replaced with a interrupt regular Sandstorm considering the level. The templet of hitting him every round would've been there but not such a high penalty. Same would go for bosses like Jabberwock.

I'm not suggestioning a nerf, but questioning why these other options weren't taken which could have lend up to what we see today.

I would agree with something Silver Moon Wolf said. If bosses are going to have these major power ups, shouldn't they suffer a drawback for the increased power. Some getting more minions or the same health or passive and aggressive cheats just make them overpowered. Yet, when it comes to gear KI will make sure we get a boost some where, they'll take something away or make the more powerful gear ridiculous hard to get.

So as far as the 3rd Arc or side arcs go, I think cheating bosses should stay in the main arc, but be thinned out to much later in the world and have obvious warnings and have more simplified cheats (which we can't deny Khrysalis Part 1 and 2 did accomplish). They should also have an occassional drawback (fewer health or minions, but not both). I also would agree that KI should remove their hesitation to add difficult cheating bosses in side questions.

[Final Continuation]

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2926
Anthony said: It isn't much work to just hit up the wiki or Duelist101 where they literally hand feed you everything about the battle.

That's not the point. The point is that a game, which is supposed to be fun, should not require any research or more work than my actual job; if that's the case, then KI should pay me by the instanceor market the game aswork (at least it's honest).Icey said: Oh, it's so hard to go to a website and type in the boss's name and, god forbid, READ.

I read for fun, but I digress. What makes you think that someone who already works 60 hours a week wants to come home and unwind from a crappy day at the office by doing more work?@Finn~ you're only one hour behind me. If your schedule is anything like mine, we may be able to get together in the Spiral at some point; I'm around most weekends, and some weeknights after10 PM Atlantic time, and I'd love to meet your wizard.



-vonexalted

Historian
May 06, 2009
630
I believe the only reason KI includes cheating bosses in no side quests of main worlds because not many players will or are willing to do side quests. They seem them as just "busy work" and useless collect quests so if a cheating boss was hidden behind many collect quests or defeat quests, KI would know few players would try and seek them out.

My assumption is forcing them into the main content makes them more noticed and will have an incentive, such as finishing the story, will get players to beat them as well as give players a challenge and reason to adapt (as devs like Ratbeard over in Pirate101 have implied they like doing).

This is though faulty because we have dungeons like Waterworks and Tower of the Helephant, but that's the thing. They're dungeons. Players know the dungeons generally hold unique and powerful loot to come back and do again. A side boss with only cheats will not excite players because more players will endure the challenge for an epic item. Doing it only for the challenge is not something I see as the only thing players will return to them for.

But I believe KI should give it a try in at least one main world where multiple cheating bosses can be found with there own special itmes and the main arc has fewer cheating bosses but apparent. We've seen in Aquila that players will go fight side cheating bosses if they have powerful rewards (Gladiator Dimachaerus, Cronus). I don't see how a few min worlds wouldn't be just as successful.

Hero
Dec 16, 2009
773
I agree with Dr Von here, I see no reason why the mainline cannot be cheat free and the sideline filled with cheating bosses. To be clear I do not mind the occasional cheating boss in the main line but if this dynamic is causing frustration for the majority of players then it should be moved to the side.

Two main points to add

I agree with Gtarhannon that the mainline could expand in challenge without cheats as expounded here: Defining Challenge.

I also mostly agree with Brynnerofreign that regular dropped gear should provide valuable statistics as expounded here: A Thank You and a Plea

Squire
Sep 07, 2011
596
I like cheats and unexpected turns from time to time. I don't want them taken out. AZ & AV got nerfed. KR1 is quite easy. KR2 bosses have already been toned down from test. The balance in the game is fine.

All cheats have counters, and part of the fun of the game is finding them even if it takes some fails. It would be very dull if we never had to think or push ourselves.

Squire
Sep 07, 2011
596
It's good that KR has short dungeons. If we are defeated in a boss fight we can get right back to it, rather than have to gind through a long instance. That helps a lot with time. I'd rather do 3 hard but short dungeons than one super long one.

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2926
seethe42 on May 5, 2014 wrote:
You claim you don't want the game nerfed and don't mind working for stuff but you are asking for exactly the opposite. You are saying that you should be able to level and finish the game quests without doing the challenges. Again, if you do not enjoy playing the game, if you find that you would rather stick your head in a blender... WHY do you keep doing it? You keep going on and on about how much you hate it. It seems to be your goal to make it so that other people hate it too by removing challenges and enjoyment that others have.
Keeping cheats optional is not nerfing the game; it is keeping it enjoyable for those of us who no longer find it so, due to the insanity of the cheats that people like you insist makes it "enjoyable".

Until very recently, I have enjoyed the game. Why should my continued enjoyment be at your whim? You insist that I must agree with your opinion of what's enjoyable, or else I'm a "weak" player (your words) who "doesn't want to work for her level" (as another so eloquently put it).

I get that some people enjoy the madness, and that's fine. Not once did I say that you can't have your "challenge"; I simply said that not everyone enjoys (or has time for) it, and that a game marketed as family-friendly should be playable by everyone. Punishing those who are inexperienced or cannot find groups makes no sense; as aforementioned, stuck players are frustrated players, and frustrated players leave.

But I haven't given up on this game yet. I continue to play the game because of the friends I've made here. If (and that's a big if) I'm able to meet up with them in-game, it makes all of the ridiculousness somehow worth it; misery loves company. And, if we're all miserable, it's not as unpleasant. Heck, it can even be fun.

(Really, it could be worse: I could be stuck in that same cheat dungeon with some jerk who insults me and demands my stuff.)

Demanding that I leave the game and keep quiet won't solve anything~ if everyone just sat back and accepted that "this is how it is", then I'd still be considered property, have 15 kids, and be stuck in an arranged marriage to some jerk I can't stand but have to tolerate because he's rich. Thank goodness for progressive thinking!

-von

Delver
Mar 17, 2011
278
Dr Von on May 7, 2014 wrote:
Keeping cheats optional is not nerfing the game; it is keeping it enjoyable for those of us who no longer find it so, due to the insanity of the cheats that people like you insist makes it "enjoyable".

Until very recently, I have enjoyed the game. Why should my continued enjoyment be at your whim? You insist that I must agree with your opinion of what's enjoyable, or else I'm a "weak" player (your words) who "doesn't want to work for her level" (as another so eloquently put it).

I get that some people enjoy the madness, and that's fine. Not once did I say that you can't have your "challenge"; I simply said that not everyone enjoys (or has time for) it, and that a game marketed as family-friendly should be playable by everyone. Punishing those who are inexperienced or cannot find groups makes no sense; as aforementioned, stuck players are frustrated players, and frustrated players leave.

But I haven't given up on this game yet. I continue to play the game because of the friends I've made here. If (and that's a big if) I'm able to meet up with them in-game, it makes all of the ridiculousness somehow worth it; misery loves company. And, if we're all miserable, it's not as unpleasant. Heck, it can even be fun.

(Really, it could be worse: I could be stuck in that same cheat dungeon with some jerk who insults me and demands my stuff.)

Demanding that I leave the game and keep quiet won't solve anything~ if everyone just sat back and accepted that "this is how it is", then I'd still be considered property, have 15 kids, and be stuck in an arranged marriage to some jerk I can't stand but have to tolerate because he's rich. Thank goodness for progressive thinking!

-von
i read each of you post and yup you are contradicting you self because you say yes we don't wanna ruin the game then you talk about making it were everybody else gets what we work hard to get

so the real thing is ether you just wanna ruin the game and make everybody not have to work and get all are rare rewards that we work are buts off to get and make it unfair to some of us who has played these game for a long time and cause some people to be mad all at you because we don't want that update

1 it not fair to old players who already did it

2 it makes it no fun because the main quest would not be hard no matter who you put in it in less they had 2000000 heath then it be a real boss

3 moving it to a side quest and making it say would you like to skip it or do it well if you skip it you get no rewards if you going do that to everyone you don't get the rare stuff or anything from there because you skip it but you can always go back but you don't get the xp from it ether you just can move onto you next quest no bage ether

i not going lie the cheat bosses making it fun and by the way you don't got to look up everything just go in there test it the first time so you know the cheats then flee get you mana then go back really not that hard

but you will ruin the game by doing these you trying to take out the challenge in the fighting really only other challenges in the game are rank that is mess up right now because kl has not made a update to make it were 100 are vs 100 not level 70 the only other one is pet rank and that's just who ever pet runs faster the really good challenges to have fun with are stuff like elephant boss and none of the cheating boss are as bad as the helephant tower they all there to make the game hard not easy so solo player can just pass them these is not a game to solo if you want to play a solo game try something that not online because every game gets these hard you can complain all you want but kl knows better then to ruin the game and i do mean every online game that you could think of will one day get these hard depending how much money they have that is the goal of online games to make there game harder so you get more challenges not to make it easier so people can just pass by and get to level 100 with no real work they don't line up the cheating boss they give you a break with the week boss and the others but why being a level 100 is a big deal on these game because everybody knows you work hard for that level that is wizard101 you have to work for your level for you spell and prove you are worth that spell there nothing wrong with the boss is in less they have a bug so leave them alone about cheating boss is and make up you mind Dr van you can't be on both side because take in out the cheating boss will ruin the game but not doing it save kl money and time to focuses on bigger things that are already mess in up these game like it or not but your ideal will make these game lame sorry

level wizard

Explorer
Jun 16, 2011
60
I for one like cheating bosses. ( i also like defeat and collect quests) i cheating bosses by getting help from friends, and if i cant find some one to help me, i jest work on my pets, and wait for a different day.
i don't think they should be moved to side quests.(not shur if this made any sence, but i tride)

Delver
Mar 05, 2013
241
Seethe finally called someone condescending. That's an expert opinion if I've ever seen one.

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2926
sliver moon wolf on May 7, 2014 wrote:
i read each of you post and yup you are contradicting you self because you say yes we don't wanna ruin the game then you talk about making it were everybody else gets what we work hard to get

so the real thing is ether you just wanna ruin the game and make everybody not have to work and get all are rare rewards that we work are buts off to get and make it unfair to some of us who has played these game for a long time and cause some people to be mad all at you because we don't want that update

1 it not fair to old players who already did it

2 it makes it no fun because the main quest would not be hard no matter who you put in it in less they had 2000000 heath then it be a real boss

3 moving it to a side quest and making it say would you like to skip it or do it well if you skip it you get no rewards if you going do that to everyone you don't get the rare stuff or anything from there because you skip it but you can always go back but you don't get the xp from it ether you just can move onto you next quest no bage ether

i not going lie the cheat bosses making it fun and by the way you don't got to look up everything just go in there test it the first time so you know the cheats then flee get you mana then go back really not that hard

but you will ruin the game by doing these you trying to take out the challenge in the fighting really only other challenges in the game are rank that is mess up right now because kl has not made a update to make it were 100 are vs 100 not level 70 the only other one is pet rank and that's just who ever pet runs faster the really good challenges to have fun with are stuff like elephant boss and none of the cheating boss are as bad as the helephant tower they all there to make the game hard not easy so solo player can just pass them these is not a game to solo if you want to play a solo game try something that not online because every game gets these hard you can complain all you want but kl knows better then to ruin the game and i do mean every online game that you could think of will one day get these hard depending how much money they have that is the goal of online games to make there game harder so you get more challenges not to make it easier so people can just pass by and get to level 100 with no real work they don't line up the cheating boss they give you a break with the week boss and the others but why being a level 100 is a big deal on these game because everybody knows you work hard for that level that is wizard101 you have to work for your level for you spell and prove you are worth that spell there nothing wrong with the boss is in less they have a bug so leave them alone about cheating boss is and make up you mind Dr van you can't be on both side because take in out the cheating boss will ruin the game but not doing it save kl money and time to focuses on bigger things that are already mess in up these game like it or not but your ideal will make these game lame sorry

level wizard
Nope, not what I asked for at all. I'm not expecting Crowns drops or anything here~ I do, however, expect that I am able to complete quests within a reasonable time frame and be fairly rewarded for the work I put in.

So here's a question for you: would I be frustrated if the result was worth it? If I hadn't already done the work a thousand times and discovered that it's pointless? Why would I continue to work for something that I am not fairly rewarded for?

The example you gave, Helephant Tower, is optional, meaning that those who choose do it do so because they want to, rather than they have to. It's not required to progress in-game... like Belloq, and Ghost Dog, and that nightmare boss with the free mana burn are. For someone who's got limited resources, it's about as fun as having teeth pulled.

-

Since you are young (based on the tone of your post), I will put it into a context you may relate to:

Your Science teacher hates you. You spend weeks slaving away on a project, but the teacher rewards your hard work and effort with a D minus, repeatedly. No matter how hard you try, you get a D- every time.

After a while, you realize that the teacher will never give you the A you deserve. You become frustrated and annoyed, and stop putting in the effort because it's a waste of time: if you're going to get a D minus anyway, why bother?

Oh, but the people with lots of money or friends in high places can buy their grades and breeze right through, no problem; it's not an obstacle for them, because they don't have to try as hard. In fact, they tease you for finding it hard- if it's easy for them, then it must be easy for you as well, or else you're stupid.

Now apply that same scenario to the game.

Of course the hardcore player finds it easy. His casual counterpart has to put in a lot more effort and work twice as hard to reach the same end-result, especially since she does not have the resources (time, money, friends) that he does and is often stuck going it alone or with people who are unreliable. Whether it's due to empty servers or or working odd hours, some of us solo these things because it's the only choice we have.

Keeping cheats (at least the ridiculous ones) out of the main quest line will not make the game "lame"; it will restore faith in justice and bring the magic back, for those of us who want so desperately for it to be fun again.

That, to me, is worth fighting for.

Champion
Mar 27, 2011
403
I like the game exactly the way it is now. KR2 is making me play more because the fights are more interesting and the story is really unfolding. Cheat bosses are awesome, and fights like in Radiance where we are someone else and have to adapt our style. I hope there is more content like that in the future.

I'm not finding any "insane" cheats. It's more like "find a way to work around one thing".So one boss I can't shield, one i can't trap, one I have to pierce shields, or heal off a DoT or whatever. It's fun to get creative and not just do the same thing every time.

Delver
Mar 17, 2011
278
Dr Von on May 8, 2014 wrote:
Nope, not what I asked for at all. I'm not expecting Crowns drops or anything here~ I do, however, expect that I am able to complete quests within a reasonable time frame and be fairly rewarded for the work I put in.

So here's a question for you: would I be frustrated if the result was worth it? If I hadn't already done the work a thousand times and discovered that it's pointless? Why would I continue to work for something that I am not fairly rewarded for?

The example you gave, Helephant Tower, is optional, meaning that those who choose do it do so because they want to, rather than they have to. It's not required to progress in-game... like Belloq, and Ghost Dog, and that nightmare boss with the free mana burn are. For someone who's got limited resources, it's about as fun as having teeth pulled.

-

Since you are young (based on the tone of your post), I will put it into a context you may relate to:

Your Science teacher hates you. You spend weeks slaving away on a project, but the teacher rewards your hard work and effort with a D minus, repeatedly. No matter how hard you try, you get a D- every time.

After a while, you realize that the teacher will never give you the A you deserve. You become frustrated and annoyed, and stop putting in the effort because it's a waste of time: if you're going to get a D minus anyway, why bother?

Oh, but the people with lots of money or friends in high places can buy their grades and breeze right through, no problem; it's not an obstacle for them, because they don't have to try as hard. In fact, they tease you for finding it hard- if it's easy for them, then it must be easy for you as well, or else you're stupid.

Now apply that same scenario to the game.

Of course the hardcore player finds it easy. His casual counterpart has to put in a lot more effort and work twice as hard to reach the same end-result, especially since she does not have the resources (time, money, friends) that he does and is often stuck going it alone or with people who are unreliable. Whether it's due to empty servers or or working odd hours, some of us solo these things because it's the only choice we have.

Keeping cheats (at least the ridiculous ones) out of the main quest line will not make the game "lame"; it will restore faith in justice and bring the magic back, for those of us who want so desperately for it to be fun again.

That, to me, is worth fighting for.
first off i got friends but they never want to help so i know it limited resores on the game number to is if you really want these so bad make it were everybody can relate
one make a butten that say would you like to skip and move onto the next quest you can go back and do the
quest anytime for cheating boss is that way they stay in main quest for some of to fight but keep the last fight of the world the same because then everybody would skip it and it make it were everybody did not have to face them but if they wanted to test them self later go back with friends and do it but taking them out of the main quest i say would make the game lame there apart of it and it cost kl less money just to make a thing to ask you would you like to skip and when you skip it the quest would still be stored in you book but the new quest would pop up and you quest arrow would be set on it amoticmaticlee man my spelling stinks

last thing is don't talk to me like a little kid it vary rude
level100

Astrologist
Oct 22, 2011
1077
sliver moon wolf on May 7, 2014 wrote:
i read each of you post and yup you are contradicting you self because you say yes we don't wanna ruin the game then you talk about making it were everybody else gets what we work hard to get

so the real thing is ether you just wanna ruin the game and make everybody not have to work and get all are rare rewards that we work are buts off to get and make it unfair to some of us who has played these game for a long time and cause some people to be mad all at you because we don't want that update

1 it not fair to old players who already did it

2 it makes it no fun because the main quest would not be hard no matter who you put in it in less they had 2000000 heath then it be a real boss

3 moving it to a side quest and making it say would you like to skip it or do it well if you skip it you get no rewards if you going do that to everyone you don't get the rare stuff or anything from there because you skip it but you can always go back but you don't get the xp from it ether you just can move onto you next quest no bage ether

i not going lie the cheat bosses making it fun and by the way you don't got to look up everything just go in there test it the first time so you know the cheats then flee get you mana then go back really not that hard

but you will ruin the game by doing these you trying to take out the challenge in the fighting really only other challenges in the game are rank that is mess up right now because kl has not made a update to make it were 100 are vs 100 not level 70 the only other one is pet rank and that's just who ever pet runs faster the really good challenges to have fun with are stuff like elephant boss and none of the cheating boss are as bad as the helephant tower they all there to make the game hard not easy so solo player can just pass them these is not a game to solo if you want to play a solo game try something that not online because every game gets these hard you can complain all you want but kl knows better then to ruin the game and i do mean every online game that you could think of will one day get these hard depending how much money they have that is the goal of online games to make there game harder so you get more challenges not to make it easier so people can just pass by and get to level 100 with no real work they don't line up the cheating boss they give you a break with the week boss and the others but why being a level 100 is a big deal on these game because everybody knows you work hard for that level that is wizard101 you have to work for your level for you spell and prove you are worth that spell there nothing wrong with the boss is in less they have a bug so leave them alone about cheating boss is and make up you mind Dr van you can't be on both side because take in out the cheating boss will ruin the game but not doing it save kl money and time to focuses on bigger things that are already mess in up these game like it or not but your ideal will make these game lame sorry

level wizard
Sorry, but it's really hard to understand what you are trying to say, exactly. I do get the gist of it, but because your typing is so bad, it hurts my eyes trying to get a better understanding of what you are trying to say.

Taking cheating bosses out of the main storyline will not ruin the game. There are many of you out there who play the hardcore console games and computer games, and it seems to me, you expect all games you play to be all the same in terms of how hard it is. Not all games are or should be designed this way. W101 is a turn-style, story-based game, and it's original design is to make it casual and fun for the entire family.

The first arc is a great example of casual play. You're not overloaded with a bunch of extra buff spells you have to pack in your deck, you don't need a perfect/super pet to help you get through battles, the storyline is fun to follow, and there is dropped gear that you can actually wear that will help you. As you progress, your stats raise as well as the difficulty of the area/world.

In the second arc, the difficulty of the bad guys start to increase more than your wizard. Decent gear drops become worse and worse, until you get to the point where bazaar and dropped gear is useless. Here is where you start the extra, more challenging spells you need to defend against.

At the end of the second arc, it's come to this: Every time you go into battle you have to adjust your deck. As much as you would like what you need to be easily accessible, it just doesn't happen any more. Colossal, mend, sharpen, potent, a variety of heals, shields, etc, are clogging up decks. Now we have shadow spells. It's become so convoluted that most can't see straight. What happened to the casualness we started with?

The gap between the bad guys and wizards have increased exponentially. The gear I see people wear is frighteningly bad. Do I mock them as others of you do? No. Not everyone can spend the money or amount of time to get the best of the best, so they must do what they can with what they have.

I am a hardcore player, I freely admit it. BUT, I do not think the game should cater to me, it needs to cater to as many casual players as possible so they don't leave the game out of frustration. I see both sides of the coin, and I will stick up for those who can not speak here on the boards themselves, and for those who are afraid to, (because of the way some of you mock them).

So, please take the blinders off and take a look at those around you and understand that not everyone plays like you do.

Defender
Jun 02, 2013
167
I can appreciate those that argue to keep Wizard101 as is and retain the "cheat" duels in place for the purpose of a good challenge. The monotonous steps of "Blade", "Trap" and then build enough Pips to potentially one-shot your enemy gets old well before the zone of Avalon.

However, I would like those who feel so strongly in favor of leave it as is to momentarily consider this please. I have multiple family members who play this game. One of them is too young to formulate strategies that would insure them a victory over some of the content I have completed as a solo player. The other is far too busy to endure hours of game play after a full day of RL (Real Life).

I have played other MMOs that required much more of my time and energy, and I'm very happy to have left that type of gameplay. the theme/format of Wizard101, in my opinion, is not the best choice for those that prefer a high level of constant intensity/challenge. In a game rated for Ten year olds, having a turn-based style combat system, with a maximum of 4 vs .4, ask yourself, how much of a challenge were you expecting?

Teens to adults with the ability to formulate strategies and/or research others who are kind enough to post their methods insuring victory will do well in this genre of game. A young child who is limited on play time and internet access would perform considerably less favorably when faced with a "cheat" duel scenario.
The older player who comes to Wizard101 for an escape from RL, (as these games should just be a hobby and not dominate our lives ), is aware of certain beneficial gear/items, but may not have the time, or energy to obtain them, or progress as fast.

I truly don't feel there can be a hardcore player in this game, just those with more time/money on their hands.

Best of luck to all of us in the Spiral, and may we get "most" of what we wish for

Gabriel