Welcome to the Wizard101 Message Boards


Player Guide
Fansites
News
Game Updates
Help

By posting on the Wizard101 Message Boards you agree to the Code of Conduct.

Why Can You Spawn Minions In 1v1,2v2 And 3v3

1
AuthorMessage
Survivor
Feb 21, 2013
4
I was wondering why can people spawn minions in pvp It is weird like it ruins the battle say its 2v2 it becomes 3v2 it is so weird why is that Please Tell Me

Hero
Nov 22, 2010
749
samdunc3 on Apr 13, 2013 wrote:
I was wondering why can people spawn minions in pvp It is weird like it ruins the battle say its 2v2 it becomes 3v2 it is so weird why is that Please Tell Me
This has been an issue for a very long time

It's been pointed out to KI many times that it's unfair and ruins the matches

They have declined to do anything about it so apparently they don't care.

Just fight fire with fire until KI does something to balance PVP and make it fair across the board - buy minion treasures and use them too.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1557
samdunc3 on Apr 13, 2013 wrote:
I was wondering why can people spawn minions in pvp It is weird like it ruins the battle say its 2v2 it becomes 3v2 it is so weird why is that Please Tell Me
First off, minions aren't unfair at all, just enchant your rank 2 spe and it's gone, or use an all enemy rank 4 spell, bye it goes.
What I don't understand however, is why a minion is even going to help someone in a 2v2/3v3, I mean, one of you is going to use the all enemy hit, right?

Survivor
Feb 12, 2009
15
samdunc3 on Apr 13, 2013 wrote:
I was wondering why can people spawn minions in pvp It is weird like it ruins the battle say its 2v2 it becomes 3v2 it is so weird why is that Please Tell Me
I'm sorry, I'm kind of confused. Anyone can summon minions, so how is it unfair? It's not as if your opponent can and somehow you are blocked from using the same strategy, right?

Survivor
Aug 12, 2012
26
It helps. It heals you gives you traps and shields and attacks with low lvl spells. Tip: try to take the minion out first or it will come back to haunt you

Hero
Nov 22, 2010
749
Icy Wiz on Apr 17, 2013 wrote:
I'm sorry, I'm kind of confused. Anyone can summon minions, so how is it unfair? It's not as if your opponent can and somehow you are blocked from using the same strategy, right?
first of all, if the match is supposed to be 1v1, then it should be one on one. not one on one and their sidekick. that's 1 vr 2.

second, not everyone gets to summon minions at the same level. nor does every one that has them get them in their hand at the same time.

third, and this is usually a problem for the low levels where minions are rife, the minions are treasures - meaning fairly large amount of hp

fourth, having an extra person on one side of the battle means that someone is getting an extra move. If we're 1v1 and I summon a minion, I effectively have 2 moves every round and you only have 1. That extra move might be 2 attacks. Do you feel it's fair if I get to attack you 2 every round while you get to attack me once?

Fifth, while you are frantically trying to get rid of my minion, and thus not hitting me, I am trashing you. Once you get rid of my minion, you've used your pips and have to let them rebuilt. Giving me even more time to take more of your health away.

Minions are highly unfair in any ranked PVP match. I use them because they are so unfair, and almost a guarentee that the other person is going to lose until we're in a high level match. BUt even in a high level match, a minion that casts me few pips still gives me a pretty big, unfair advantage over the other guy.

Main point though, is that if the match is supposed to only be between 2 players - 1 on each side, or 4 players, 2 on each side, then it should BE between that number. Minions turn a 1v1 into a 1v2, a 2v2 into a 2v3, a 3v3 into a 3v4.

Survivor
Feb 12, 2009
15
crystalwizard12345... on Apr 18, 2013 wrote:
first of all, if the match is supposed to be 1v1, then it should be one on one. not one on one and their sidekick. that's 1 vr 2.

second, not everyone gets to summon minions at the same level. nor does every one that has them get them in their hand at the same time.

third, and this is usually a problem for the low levels where minions are rife, the minions are treasures - meaning fairly large amount of hp

fourth, having an extra person on one side of the battle means that someone is getting an extra move. If we're 1v1 and I summon a minion, I effectively have 2 moves every round and you only have 1. That extra move might be 2 attacks. Do you feel it's fair if I get to attack you 2 every round while you get to attack me once?

Fifth, while you are frantically trying to get rid of my minion, and thus not hitting me, I am trashing you. Once you get rid of my minion, you've used your pips and have to let them rebuilt. Giving me even more time to take more of your health away.

Minions are highly unfair in any ranked PVP match. I use them because they are so unfair, and almost a guarentee that the other person is going to lose until we're in a high level match. BUt even in a high level match, a minion that casts me few pips still gives me a pretty big, unfair advantage over the other guy.

Main point though, is that if the match is supposed to only be between 2 players - 1 on each side, or 4 players, 2 on each side, then it should BE between that number. Minions turn a 1v1 into a 1v2, a 2v2 into a 2v3, a 3v3 into a 3v4.
I don't see you offering any ideas to balance out taking away minions. For example, if KI takes away the Rank 0 Minion from Myth for PvP, what of equal value will they take away from each and every one of the other schools? Will they take Ghoul away from Death? Because some people think Ghoul is unfair because it not only damages, it heals the caster and that's pretty valuable in low-level PvP. Will they take away some accuracy percentage from Life spells, some damage from Storm spells, some health points from Ice?

As to the argument that it turns 1v1 into 1v2, etc.? Everyone knows that every match could include minions. If you want that extra support, summon one up. If you choose to not use minions, then don't cry foul. You have the same opportunity as everyone else. I choose not to use blades (because of weakness), but I can't go around saying blades are unfair because other people use them. The turn that person uses to cast the minion is a turn they weren't attacking/healing/buffing/shielding. What if I put up a trap and the minion pops it with a one-pip spell? That's the chance I take of using a minion. It isn't always the smartest strategy.

Not to offend, but people seem to be saying minions are "unfair" when what minions really are is a "pet peeve." There will always be PvP strategies that make us want to scream (mine is level 5 players with a level 78 school/hybrid pet). Have a friend do some practice PvP with you and cast minions in order to help you come up with strategies to outsmart people who use minions.

Illuminator
Feb 24, 2009
1359
Minions are fair game... They are not actual players, so it doesn't count... If you can't beat em, join em. Nuff said.

Hero
Nov 22, 2010
749
Icy Wiz on Apr 19, 2013 wrote:
I don't see you offering any ideas to balance out taking away minions. For example, if KI takes away the Rank 0 Minion from Myth for PvP, what of equal value will they take away from each and every one of the other schools? Will they take Ghoul away from Death? Because some people think Ghoul is unfair because it not only damages, it heals the caster and that's pretty valuable in low-level PvP. Will they take away some accuracy percentage from Life spells, some damage from Storm spells, some health points from Ice?

As to the argument that it turns 1v1 into 1v2, etc.? Everyone knows that every match could include minions. If you want that extra support, summon one up. If you choose to not use minions, then don't cry foul. You have the same opportunity as everyone else. I choose not to use blades (because of weakness), but I can't go around saying blades are unfair because other people use them. The turn that person uses to cast the minion is a turn they weren't attacking/healing/buffing/shielding. What if I put up a trap and the minion pops it with a one-pip spell? That's the chance I take of using a minion. It isn't always the smartest strategy.

Not to offend, but people seem to be saying minions are "unfair" when what minions really are is a "pet peeve." There will always be PvP strategies that make us want to scream (mine is level 5 players with a level 78 school/hybrid pet). Have a friend do some practice PvP with you and cast minions in order to help you come up with strategies to outsmart people who use minions.
>I don't see you offering any ideas to balance out taking away minions.

Oh I have.

Would you like ranked to be about skill instead of tricks and gimicks? Then here's what KI should really do:

To start with, ensure that only people within five levels of each other can team.

Once a match is put together, as the players are placed in the arena:

1. Strip everyone of their gear
2. strip everyone of their pets
3. disable the side board
4. ensure that

Now you, I and everyone else in the match have only the cards in our deck and no treasures. Now we are dependent on our skills in using those cards and putting that deck together. now we are also evenly matched.

Now let's see who the real PVP pros are.

Survivor
Feb 12, 2009
15
crystalwizard12345... on Apr 23, 2013 wrote:
>I don't see you offering any ideas to balance out taking away minions.

Oh I have.

Would you like ranked to be about skill instead of tricks and gimicks? Then here's what KI should really do:

To start with, ensure that only people within five levels of each other can team.

Once a match is put together, as the players are placed in the arena:

1. Strip everyone of their gear
2. strip everyone of their pets
3. disable the side board
4. ensure that

Now you, I and everyone else in the match have only the cards in our deck and no treasures. Now we are dependent on our skills in using those cards and putting that deck together. now we are also evenly matched.

Now let's see who the real PVP pros are.
You should go over to Central and see if you can organize a tournament with those rules. It would be interesting for sure (not being sarcastic). Although you didn't mention pulling minion cards from decks, so it's getting pretty much impossible to keep up with what you're after.

Champion
Aug 20, 2010
403
All teams have minions,so it makes it fair that all can use them, for example, why do they let the other person heal? Instead of even number of hit points, it turns into more and less, say 3000 vs 4000.

Explorer
Aug 23, 2012
84
Wow, it saddens me that people actually think they are unfair. The only "unfair" one is Talos, and that was made non pvp. People rarely use the animate full power pips minion, so thats rid of our worries. People use minions to get rid of shields, and in balance and lifes case, assist.

Explorer
Aug 23, 2012
84
Icy Wiz on Apr 19, 2013 wrote:
I don't see you offering any ideas to balance out taking away minions. For example, if KI takes away the Rank 0 Minion from Myth for PvP, what of equal value will they take away from each and every one of the other schools? Will they take Ghoul away from Death? Because some people think Ghoul is unfair because it not only damages, it heals the caster and that's pretty valuable in low-level PvP. Will they take away some accuracy percentage from Life spells, some damage from Storm spells, some health points from Ice?

As to the argument that it turns 1v1 into 1v2, etc.? Everyone knows that every match could include minions. If you want that extra support, summon one up. If you choose to not use minions, then don't cry foul. You have the same opportunity as everyone else. I choose not to use blades (because of weakness), but I can't go around saying blades are unfair because other people use them. The turn that person uses to cast the minion is a turn they weren't attacking/healing/buffing/shielding. What if I put up a trap and the minion pops it with a one-pip spell? That's the chance I take of using a minion. It isn't always the smartest strategy.

Not to offend, but people seem to be saying minions are "unfair" when what minions really are is a "pet peeve." There will always be PvP strategies that make us want to scream (mine is level 5 players with a level 78 school/hybrid pet). Have a friend do some practice PvP with you and cast minions in order to help you come up with strategies to outsmart people who use minions.
All of us have pet peeves in pvp. Mine is most likely efreet against fires in 1v1, especially if they go first. Oh, mana burn is ridiculous too. I faced a balance in 1v1 yesterday. This was his deck: Balanceblade, judgement, scorpion, mana burn, and a reshuffle. Thats literally it.I won because he ran out of cards. He was expecting easy kills all day, (he was a knight), but I wouldnt give it to him ;D

Defender
Jan 18, 2013
195
If you think that is unfair then why don't you do the same thing? We are all playing the same game, we are all playing the same rules. Everyone is capable of summoning minions, if you choose not to that is your loss.

Survivor
Mar 05, 2011
41
ilI just ignore most minions unless they can tower. Being lvl 90 they wont do much damage to me. so yeah.

Wolf Nightcaller balance lvl 90 1st age warlord

Defender
Jan 02, 2011
140
Wizgamer105 on Apr 28, 2013 wrote:
All teams have minions,so it makes it fair that all can use them, for example, why do they let the other person heal? Instead of even number of hit points, it turns into more and less, say 3000 vs 4000.
>All teams have minions

um, no.

Not only do the different schools not get their minions at the same time, some minions are useful in pvp and some are worthless.

Myth is the only school that gets a minion at a low level. And it costs nothing to cast. And it does heavy attacks for the level. No one else gets a 0 pip minion.

Storm's minion is designed to get taunt the enemies into hitting it, then shield and heal itself so that it stays alive while the enemies hit it. But players don't react to taunts.They don't automatically start hitting the minion the way that the computer controlled ememies do - so storm's minion is worthless in pvp,

Balance's mander gives out pips, shields, blades and once in a while attacks.

Treasure card minions are available, but you can't guarantee you'll draw a minion unless that's all you put in your tc slots - meaning you can't carry reshuffles or anything else there.

>Minions are fair game... They are not actual players, so it doesn't count

Yeah? They do everything the real players do - they attack, they shield, some heal, some do other things. How does that not count?

If you get hit with 2 attacks for 500 points each, does it really matter which came from a player controlled deck, and which came from a computer enemy controlled deck? You still lost 1000 points of health.

Survivor
Dec 31, 2011
33
crystalwizard12345... on Apr 23, 2013 wrote:
>I don't see you offering any ideas to balance out taking away minions.

Oh I have.

Would you like ranked to be about skill instead of tricks and gimicks? Then here's what KI should really do:

To start with, ensure that only people within five levels of each other can team.

Once a match is put together, as the players are placed in the arena:

1. Strip everyone of their gear
2. strip everyone of their pets
3. disable the side board
4. ensure that

Now you, I and everyone else in the match have only the cards in our deck and no treasures. Now we are dependent on our skills in using those cards and putting that deck together. now we are also evenly matched.

Now let's see who the real PVP pros are.
That would basically say that Storm is no better than Life. So basically whoever has higher health would win that match, no big questions. Minions are EXTREMELY unfair in 1v1, unless your going to use it and sacrifice it for health (These sacrifice minion for health can be found on TOP of Krok SECRET shop)

The only thin all schools would have going for them are

Life: Heals :D and Triage
Death: Feint and Attack/Heal spells
Ice: Shields (Which all people can purchase, no not a huge advantage.)
Storm: Supercharge
Fire: Long Period Hits (Rein, Dragon, elf, scald)
Myth: 2 hit things (Minotaur, Orthrus)
Balance: Blades

Most of these things can be overcome, but for heals, life mastery amulet would be the only way you could use it without pip wasting

Geographer
Nov 26, 2011
865
Minions are not unfair and can be wiped out easily. If your fire for example, use a fireblade and a meteor shower and BAM! Minion is dead. You as well can summon a minion too.

Survivor
Feb 02, 2013
47
With some people saying that not every has minions, note not everyone should. Yes, myth has 0 pip minions, did you notice they have way more than other schools as well? Minions are a PART of the myth school. Also, minions are fair, and they are a good strategy to use. They can attack for you, blade for you, shield for you, and its very useful. To take out this tactic wouldn't be sensible. Its a fine addition to the game.

Defender
Sep 19, 2010
178
tanda1 on Apr 29, 2013 wrote:
>All teams have minions

um, no.

Not only do the different schools not get their minions at the same time, some minions are useful in pvp and some are worthless.

Myth is the only school that gets a minion at a low level. And it costs nothing to cast. And it does heavy attacks for the level. No one else gets a 0 pip minion.

Storm's minion is designed to get taunt the enemies into hitting it, then shield and heal itself so that it stays alive while the enemies hit it. But players don't react to taunts.They don't automatically start hitting the minion the way that the computer controlled ememies do - so storm's minion is worthless in pvp,

Balance's mander gives out pips, shields, blades and once in a while attacks.

Treasure card minions are available, but you can't guarantee you'll draw a minion unless that's all you put in your tc slots - meaning you can't carry reshuffles or anything else there.

>Minions are fair game... They are not actual players, so it doesn't count

Yeah? They do everything the real players do - they attack, they shield, some heal, some do other things. How does that not count?

If you get hit with 2 attacks for 500 points each, does it really matter which came from a player controlled deck, and which came from a computer enemy controlled deck? You still lost 1000 points of health.
All minions are useful in their own little way. Even on my storm, it's nice to have that random sprite or elemental shield on me every 20th turn or so. All teams do have minions, unless your playing as a level 6 or so. If your doing that then please don't complain, level up.

Yea myth is kind of supposed to be a minion school. Golem Minion costs a turn you could have spent on blades or shields to cast. It casts RANK ONE SPELLS. And if you have ever actually faced it, you would notice the fact that it has 45 health. Link is the only spell you could use that wouldn't instantly kill it, and it would still kill it before it could attack.

Good lord, the Mander has 300 health, use a hit all.

Again, you have a minion unless your completely low leveled and not myth. If you don't have one, start leveling.

If you want to see when it counts, then lets petition to Kingsisle to allow us to ask friends to join matches in progress. Seriously, main thing actual players have that minions don't; about 5-12x the health.

Only way your gonna get minion to hit 500 damage is if your fighting an ice, and you let them use balefrost, you don't shield, and you feint spam. Honestly, minions are one of the things in Kingsisle that must stay, go pick on us Jade armor folk and Ice immunity.

Champion
Oct 30, 2011
449
If everyone can summon a minion, it is an advantage for no one. It is not really a 2v1 if one player has a minion and the other doesn't. Minions have less health and randomly use their spells. They can help. They could hurt. They could just not use the spell you needed them to at all. They do not have strategy, so they do not really count as a player.

Survivor
Apr 18, 2013
44
Wizard Samdunc3,

Minions actually help other duelist in Pvp, like me. I understand and agree with you that there are many things I dislike about minions because they assist in duels and make the match even more difficult in an intense situation but that is why you must make the minion perish when ever you can before the assisting even begins.

When I first was a student that arrived at Wizard City, I always wanted the chance to ask Headmaster Ambrose, "Why do other schools teach how to summon minions when that's one of the main advantages for the shool: "Myth"?" Perhaps I might visit his house and ask him.

It Does make sense that in a 1v1 match, a player may summon a minion because it's an actual spell that you may cast, so the match is more of a 1v1 with an additional aid.

(Balance) Level 28, Angel Hex

I am the Avatar, also known as: "The chosen one". Here to be the Savior of Wizard City!

Champion
Dec 03, 2012
488
samdunc3 on Apr 13, 2013 wrote:
I was wondering why can people spawn minions in pvp It is weird like it ruins the battle say its 2v2 it becomes 3v2 it is so weird why is that Please Tell Me
Um... Most minions aren't very helpful and have low health. The powerful ones are banned from PVP.

A+ Student
Jan 11, 2012
1681
crystalwizard12345... on Apr 23, 2013 wrote:
>I don't see you offering any ideas to balance out taking away minions.

Oh I have.

Would you like ranked to be about skill instead of tricks and gimicks? Then here's what KI should really do:

To start with, ensure that only people within five levels of each other can team.

Once a match is put together, as the players are placed in the arena:

1. Strip everyone of their gear
2. strip everyone of their pets
3. disable the side board
4. ensure that

Now you, I and everyone else in the match have only the cards in our deck and no treasures. Now we are dependent on our skills in using those cards and putting that deck together. now we are also evenly matched.

Now let's see who the real PVP pros are.
While I don't PvP at all, I have seen what I believe is a simple, yet fair fix for PvP: Allow people to set their own conditions on matches. Once those conditions are agreed to, people have 5 minutes to switch their decks around. Once the terms are agreed to and the 5 minutes are up, the match starts. So you could choose:

1) No TC
2) No Minions
3) No gear
4) No pets
5) Nobody who isnt within X levels either way of you
6) nobody who isnt within a rank of you in PvP

Either you agree and join, or don't and look for somebody else. If you agree on the conditions, anything that can't be used is simply negated - it just would negate your pet from adding to your stats/spells/maycast or negate bonuses from gear instead of having you unequip them. Then take the matching system and look for as close to 100% conditional match as possible and give people the option of ignoring the match. If they ignore the match, try to find another match and so on.

Then if people have a problem with PvP, it's their own fault and change around their strategies and/or conditions for matches

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
953
Samdunc3,

Certain Wizards have to have Minions, they are very important in PVP.
Example, how does a Balance or Life remove shields... they have no easy way to do so?
Fire, Ice, Myth and Death can all easily remove shields, they have the spells to do so.
You take away Minions, and you put Life and Balance into a unfair situation.

A storm can use his minion very effectively, it can control the opposing minion.

Plus how to you keep your Blades, and still remove the opponent's shields....
Yep, you got it, you keep out your minion.

As already stated, minions have very low health, and no built in Resistance to other schools.
They are a easy kill, with maybe the exception of Talos, a bit harder.

Bottom line, everyone knows that Minions are very important to PVP, and when played at the
correct time, can be a real headache for the other player.

Notice the new Minions in the next world are already NO PVP... because they have such
high health. All the ones we currently have, can be killed with no problem.....

1