Welcome to the Wizard101 Message Boards


Player Guide
Fansites
News
Game Updates
Help

Follow important game updates on Twitter @Wizard101 and @KI_Alerts, and Facebook!

By posting on the Wizard101 Message Boards you agree to the Code of Conduct.

Double Smoking... Fan? or Ban?

2
AuthorMessage
Explorer
Mar 26, 2011
83
PvPFair on Nov 6, 2014 wrote:
I do a lot of tournaments and PVP and the double smoking has gotten ridiculous! If you're going second against a double smoking team, it's nearly impossible for you to get a spell off before their hitter blades, infalls, shrikes and massacres your entire team. I've tried enchanting my spells with "unstoppable" and "extraordinary" but it rarely, if at all, works against double smoke screen. And not all spells let you enchant them, so then what? Basically you pray that your pet casts a may cast spell and takes off your smoke so you can get your spell off... but that's not likely to happen unless you've been hit, and by then, its usually too late.

My friends and I emailed KI to ask them to look into this and do something. They told us to come here and voice our concerns and see what others have to say about it. Personally, I think this is a silly way to handle customer complaints, but HEY, I'll put it out there.

So... you a fan of double smoking? Or like me and wish KI would do something about it? Thanks for reading and your input.
BAN Everytime SIRENS, SMOKE, SMOKE Whats the point of tourneys?

Delver
Jun 02, 2010
222
Joshua Starflame on Nov 24, 2014 wrote:
To be fair. The "from second" problem is a whole lot worse than just smoke screeners and I'll admit that. It's hard to make a come-back if you start from second for reasons that were stated before and unfortunately it's never going to really be a fair place. And admittedly accuracy decreasing is a devastating strategy no matter which game you play. Pokemon is a prime example of this. Some teams are built around increasing their own evasion or just slamming the opponents accuracy and it's very frustrating especially if your own team is slower than your opponents.

If we're going to get to the bottom of the problem, it's pretty clear that the turn system is what needs to be messed with. That's where quite a few of the arena's problems currently lie.

Thanks for clarifying that it was a different problem you were addressing.
I might be more in favor of this if the accuracy on all gear was much higher, but the thing is one just won't see that on the lower level gear. I really do not like to complain about spells and I am not the whiny type who comes to forums declaring war on spells and strategies after losing, but the way I see it is:

If was to go into a 4v4 tournament right now. The only way I would be able to win is by bringing a smoke screening team and going first otherwise I would probably lose.

Defender
Jun 24, 2009
193
Alex Stormlight on Nov 30, 2014 wrote:
I might be more in favor of this if the accuracy on all gear was much higher, but the thing is one just won't see that on the lower level gear. I really do not like to complain about spells and I am not the whiny type who comes to forums declaring war on spells and strategies after losing, but the way I see it is:

If was to go into a 4v4 tournament right now. The only way I would be able to win is by bringing a smoke screening team and going first otherwise I would probably lose.
There's probably quite a few other strategies to be invoked but now you bring up a point that I just realized. I believe that one of the reasons that Smoke Screen is just now getting backlash is because of how accessible it is and how easy it is to cast. Smoke Screen is one of those anyone can train and when it's only one pip it's fairly easy to pull out of a hat. And yes to me it is just now getting hit. Last month at about this point in it, it was TC getting attacked like usual.

You do have a point on the gear. When you go lower level you don't get that good of boosts and that's gonna become a pain at points. I don't really know how to advise on that point as I never dealt with that before.

Geographer
Sep 19, 2013
839
Ban it. I'm no OP whiner, but this is OP. Going second against this means an 85% or whatever voodoo math KI uses reduction in accuracy. You're not going to be able to counter this because you can't do anything. The only counter is to bring your own smokes and hope for first. At that point, PvP devolves into "team going second automatically loses". 3v3 and 4v4 are meaningless because you're either smoking or being smoked. Spamming accuracy debuffs is, for all intents and purposes, chain stunning, which was removed by KI because it was gamebreaking.

Survivor
Jan 21, 2011
6
Survivor
Dec 26, 2010
1
Double smoking is a real pain, you cannot cast a single spell, it's a cheap nasty trick but it works. I'm not someone who uses smokescreen but I will defend it and here's why:

  1. First of all, it's entirely legitimate. It's just a nasty tactic, but it works within the rules.
  2. Also, it pushes players to think 'How could I change my strategy to work against a smoking team,' It puts their minds to work trying to find a way to stop it.
  3. Last of all, you only want to ban it because it's an effective tactic, you only want to ban it because you can't win, and there is always going to be a cheap tactic that works really well. Even if KI ban double smoking, people will move on to other cheap ways to win.
There will always be people like this who find a good strategy in PvP and use it. There is nothing you can do. That is why I think that the pan shouldn't happen.

Thanks for reading my point of view.

Survivor
Oct 27, 2008
5
Delver
Jun 02, 2010
222
"Last of all, you only want to ban it because it's an effective tactic, you only want to ban it because you can't win,"
This is not the reason I vote on banning them. Ik there are ways to beat such a strategy, but the way I look it is that if I was to go into 4v4 pvp the only way to win would be to smoke screen spam, and it if I came second I would probably loser. Lets not also forget that along with spoke screen spams people can also stack on dispels plagues and a lot of other things. I don't like game play that is so fixed and like black and white. I like open ended game play.

"Even if KI ban double smoking, people will move on to other cheap ways to win."

So long as these cheap op strategies at least make the game interesting and allow room for flexible open ended gameplay I am okay with it. If not then I will be right back here to voice opposition to it. Fair gameplay for everyone.

Fan. Can't beat them, join them. Duh

Who says we can't be them lol.

Geographer
Mar 12, 2013
923
The problem with "can't beat 'em join 'em" is that then, team pvp devolves into a lot of mirror matches involving chain smoking.

With very little variety, emphasis on a single tactic, and a built-in insurmountable inequality in the turn system, this is already the case and has killed team pvp. Where once you could see pages of team matches in the queue, now it's a ghost town. Except for the chain smokers.

Maybe it's time to make tc smoke no-PVP. You can still use trained, enchanted trained, pet, maycast, and clothing item. But that imposes a numeric limit on the types of smoke stacks you can make. Yes, you can still chain smoke this way, but at some point it will end and "normal" pvp will resume.

I have used chain smoking to defeat enemy teams and have had it used against me, so it's not like I don't understand these things. I do, and I have to say pvp was simply more fun with more strategic variety. A healthy arena is a fun arena.

Survivor
Aug 25, 2009
1
I am fire and i think it's fair. our level 38 spell is not much because when people get accuracy gear they only get around 10 accuracy off. i know this will be unfair for storm but think about it fire can only reduce so much with it and now the new gear gives them enough to counter one smoke screen. If we double Smoke we are only doing so as a strategy to cut the advantage of accuracy gear and make it less. It is used to make people fizzle right? It still gives people a chance unless fire wizards use the spells like Krampus or if an Ice wizard uses Handsome Fomori or the storm spell Catalan. Yes Loremaster is one too. People Only do this because the learned one is not enough. i used it in pvp against someone in practice using only the trained one. When he casts a spell that is not like a wand or anything just a attack the opponent didn't fizz so i do not agree with banning the double smoke screen. Level 62 Pyromancer

2