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Double Smoking... Fan? or Ban?

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AuthorMessage
Survivor
Feb 14, 2014
1
I do a lot of tournaments and PVP and the double smoking has gotten ridiculous! If you're going second against a double smoking team, it's nearly impossible for you to get a spell off before their hitter blades, infalls, shrikes and massacres your entire team. I've tried enchanting my spells with "unstoppable" and "extraordinary" but it rarely, if at all, works against double smoke screen. And not all spells let you enchant them, so then what? Basically you pray that your pet casts a may cast spell and takes off your smoke so you can get your spell off... but that's not likely to happen unless you've been hit, and by then, its usually too late.

My friends and I emailed KI to ask them to look into this and do something. They told us to come here and voice our concerns and see what others have to say about it. Personally, I think this is a silly way to handle customer complaints, but HEY, I'll put it out there.

So... you a fan of double smoking? Or like me and wish KI would do something about it? Thanks for reading and your input.

Survivor
Dec 31, 2011
10
Survivor
Dec 29, 2011
1
imo...double smoking is for players who cant win if their opponents are able to fight back. But I get that everyone is doing it now because it's a "smoke or be smoked" pvp world. Still, it's cowardly and cheap and shouldn't be allowed.

Survivor
Jun 02, 2012
1
Going to have to say most definitely ban the double smoking from pvp and tourney. Not sure how its been on the pvp side of things but on 3v3 and 4v4 tourney everyone double smokes now. Its not fair at all for teams going second. You might get lucky going second and get a spell through but most likely not. Going second, If you don't get lucky and get a spell through then you pretty much just wasted your crowns.

Banning double smoke would give everyone a fair chance at winning. I know back when chain stunning was the thing kingsisle corrected this by giving stun blocks to make things fair. I think double smoke is another one of those methods that kingsisle should step in and try to correct to makes things fair for all.

In my opinion double smoke is a cheap method to win and not based on skill at all. It doesn't really make you think or learn to cast a double smoke does it?

BAN DOUBLE SMOKE!

Survivor
Sep 12, 2013
1
Ban it. I agree it isn't fair for teams from 2nd.

Survivor
May 12, 2011
20
In general, I don't have a problem with schools using their spells. I don't have an issue with tc either. I will say though, going second really limits your ability to even participate in the actual fight. I join lots of tournaments because I really enjoy it. This is beginning to ruin my experience though. I feel like some smokes should definitely be allowed. It is an actual fire spell after all. At some point though, it does need a limit. Too much is too much! I have often given question to joining when I never would have before for fear of wasting my crowns. Heaven forbid you go second and not even get one spell out. This is very upsetting especially when I have the crafted gear with accuracy, a decent healing pet and enchanted spell cards. At times I can't even get infallible on. Not to mention if my team has been lucky enough to go first and i have used infallible, with all those items cited above and infallible, i still fizz every single turn. Is that even a fight? I don't think ban, but I def do think some revision is necessary. Either that or there are just some people who really enjoy pvp and tournaments that will no longer be using their crowns for such items in the game. I have often considered this myself. I love pvp and what it adds to the game, but I do feel the smokes have become an extreme annoyance. Thanks for listening. Hope this brings upon some changes :)

Defender
Jun 24, 2009
193
Ok this topic has been addressed before. Admittedly it was not about smokescreening twice but only once. However they cannot regulate a tactic such as this and like anything in PVP a counter will be found for it. However instantly saying that it's unfair and should be banned is, in essence, unfair as well.

In the arena there are no rules save for no hacking. Your opponents will not care what your notions of fair play are and will throw everything at you and the kitchen sink to assure their victory. Now what can you do? Well think of how their tactics are working and try to use them yourself. That or try to find a counter for it. However I can guarantee KI cannot and will not ban this(seriously finding the proper code for it would be a pain).

As for the "not fair from 2nd". That could apply to half the things in PVP. Second is a hard position to win from in this day and age.

Survivor
Aug 30, 2009
3
I to do allot of tours and I use a fire wiz, I would love for ki to band the double smoking it has taken the fun out of pvp. I'm close to not doing the tours any more because I don't like wasting my crowns. The double smoking has just gotten out of hand, and if you are going first or second doesn't really make a difference unless you start to double smoke, so it should not be allowed in the arena.

Survivor
Jan 05, 2011
2
BAN for sure. Doesn't require any pvp skill, just a cheap trick

Survivor
Aug 30, 2009
3
definitely make so the smoke treasure cards are eliminated from pvp andtournaments

Delver
Jun 02, 2010
222
This is something that should have been banned A LONG time ago. I even have made a topic on this once. Insane bolt and polymorph tc where made no pvp, but smoke screen tc and stacking weakness and plagues should be banned. This is exactly why I never do 2v2 3v3 or 4v4 pvp unless it is practice pvp or at homes.

Survivor
Jan 05, 2011
1
Definitely not a fan of double smoking. If there was a way KI could limit how many tc smokes could be used. Or not allow them to be cast consecutively? I don't know, but its a waste of time to tourney any more.

Survivor
Nov 15, 2009
3
Ban it, please. It is the essence of unfair. It is the means by which the other team does not allow their opponents a chance to play.

Survivor
Aug 02, 2011
7
It seems that nearly EVERYBODY has the same opinion : double (or triple if you add sirens) smoke is killing 3v3 and 4v4 ranked and tourney PVPs...

It should be very easy for the staff of Wizard101 to solve the question : if they change the rating of the fire TC multiple smoke to 40 % (instead 45 %) so there shoulf be only one possibility to smoke : at 40 %, except sirens.

It would be a great improvement.

Can the staff of wizard101 pay attention to the fact that on this point (the end of double smoke) nearly everybody have same opinion? Thanks by advance...

Survivor
Jan 19, 2011
1
My first post didn't get added to the message boards, so I'll post again.

I vote ban.

Fact is... 3v3 and 4v4 pvp and tourney is suffering and I'm positive its because of the excessive double smoking. It doesn't take a genius to see that participation is down. When tournaments first came out, there were anywhere from 6 to 10 teams signed up for every 3v3 and 4v4 match. Now, you're lucky if you get enough teams to sign up at all. Cant tell you how many times I've gotten that message "we're sorry, but Diego couldn't place you" or whatever it is exactly. And when you do get in one, double smoke takes the fun out of it.

Sure wish KI would listen to all of us.

Delver
Jun 02, 2010
222
The primary reason I never do ranked 2v2 3v3 and 4v4 is because of smoke screen spammers and plague spammers.

Defender
Jun 24, 2009
193
Jeremy Bluewhisper on Nov 11, 2014 wrote:
My first post didn't get added to the message boards, so I'll post again.

I vote ban.

Fact is... 3v3 and 4v4 pvp and tourney is suffering and I'm positive its because of the excessive double smoking. It doesn't take a genius to see that participation is down. When tournaments first came out, there were anywhere from 6 to 10 teams signed up for every 3v3 and 4v4 match. Now, you're lucky if you get enough teams to sign up at all. Cant tell you how many times I've gotten that message "we're sorry, but Diego couldn't place you" or whatever it is exactly. And when you do get in one, double smoke takes the fun out of it.

Sure wish KI would listen to all of us.
"All of us"

Issue I find with this is this:

Very few people who are ok with this will post here(me obviously being one of them). Why? Because they see no reason to. There's nothing for them to try to change and unless they see something they want changed they won't go on here. So you can't say that all of us want this changed when there's no clue how many people are ok with it. Now to claim that double smoking is the cause of the dropped participation might be partially true it is most likely only a small factor. Other factors could be people not wanting to buy crowns for participation. Some might not be able to participate at all(work, school, that stuff). And some might be dissuaded by other things(stereotyped warlords, TC, other tactics like Jade or shadow magic).

Another point is 3v3 and 4v4 ranked pvp is suffering as well. It's hard to find matches in those and I doubt it's only because of double smoking. Heck I doubt double smoking is a major factor in it judging how recently it came onto these forums.

If you wish to continue this feel free. I shall remain here for debating purposes.

Delver
Jun 02, 2010
222
Smoke tc should NOT be allowed in pvp! They are completely unfair to battle against and it is not a real strategy.

Defender
Jun 24, 2009
193
Alex Stormlight on Nov 17, 2014 wrote:
Smoke tc should NOT be allowed in pvp! They are completely unfair to battle against and it is not a real strategy.
How many times do I have to say it?

Anything short of breaking the rules is a strategy and is fair. The only real rule in the arena is anything goes. Your opponents do not care what you think is and isn't fair. They can and will do anything to win short of hacking.

The best thing you can do is realize this and work on finding a counter rather than instantly going: "This is unfair ban it!" Someone on these forums once said if KI were to listen to every complaint the only spells able to be used in PVP would be wand and item cards. Think about that.

Defender
Sep 17, 2011
143
I want to ban smoke tc and plague tc NOT Real Cards

Defender
Jun 24, 2009
193
mykola230 on Nov 18, 2014 wrote:
I want to ban smoke tc and plague tc NOT Real Cards
Keep in mind. Everyone, you included, can use these. If they're annoying to you because they're effective, try using them yourself. You might find a new strategy.

Defender
Sep 17, 2011
143
Joshua Starflame on Nov 19, 2014 wrote:
Keep in mind. Everyone, you included, can use these. If they're annoying to you because they're effective, try using them yourself. You might find a new strategy.
Who is everyone?
And no. It doesn't matter if you use it or not. They are still unfair no matter how you look at it.

Defender
Jun 24, 2009
193
mykola230 on Nov 19, 2014 wrote:
Who is everyone?
And no. It doesn't matter if you use it or not. They are still unfair no matter how you look at it.
In this instance everyone means anyone who can access the bazaar... And that means anyone who has an account really.

No matter how I look at it? Well we must be interpreting things very differently. As I see it. So long as everyone has a shot at using it it is fair. Most things in the arena, these included, have counters. My point stands that usually whenever someone wants something banned they just looked at it, thought it was unfair, and instantly cried for a ban.

Plague reduces attack and Smokescreen hits the accuracy. There's ways to work around both of them. Admittedly it might be frustrating but to me... well that doesn't make it unfair as you have the option to turn the tables on your opponents by using them as well. And once again from second it might be tough. Let's face it second is the worst position in the arena as you get hit with unknown debuffs or your opponents throw out buffs that you don't expect while they have the time to work around their current ones.

Delver
Jun 02, 2010
222
Joshua Starflame on Nov 20, 2014 wrote:
In this instance everyone means anyone who can access the bazaar... And that means anyone who has an account really.

No matter how I look at it? Well we must be interpreting things very differently. As I see it. So long as everyone has a shot at using it it is fair. Most things in the arena, these included, have counters. My point stands that usually whenever someone wants something banned they just looked at it, thought it was unfair, and instantly cried for a ban.

Plague reduces attack and Smokescreen hits the accuracy. There's ways to work around both of them. Admittedly it might be frustrating but to me... well that doesn't make it unfair as you have the option to turn the tables on your opponents by using them as well. And once again from second it might be tough. Let's face it second is the worst position in the arena as you get hit with unknown debuffs or your opponents throw out buffs that you don't expect while they have the time to work around their current ones.
This is not one of those instances where I am complaining about someone due to not being able to defeat them due to a strategy they are using, its due to the fact that I think the strategy they are using is not very open ended and does not leave much room for flexible creative interesting pvp. There are very few ways to actually deal with smoke screeners in pvp if someone is second.

Defender
Jun 24, 2009
193
Alex Stormlight on Nov 23, 2014 wrote:
This is not one of those instances where I am complaining about someone due to not being able to defeat them due to a strategy they are using, its due to the fact that I think the strategy they are using is not very open ended and does not leave much room for flexible creative interesting pvp. There are very few ways to actually deal with smoke screeners in pvp if someone is second.
To be fair. The "from second" problem is a whole lot worse than just smoke screeners and I'll admit that. It's hard to make a come-back if you start from second for reasons that were stated before and unfortunately it's never going to really be a fair place. And admittedly accuracy decreasing is a devastating strategy no matter which game you play. Pokemon is a prime example of this. Some teams are built around increasing their own evasion or just slamming the opponents accuracy and it's very frustrating especially if your own team is slower than your opponents.

If we're going to get to the bottom of the problem, it's pretty clear that the turn system is what needs to be messed with. That's where quite a few of the arena's problems currently lie.

Thanks for clarifying that it was a different problem you were addressing.

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