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Collection of our Best Ideas to Improve PvP

AuthorMessage
Defender
Apr 01, 2011
153
When I clicked on page 3 of this thread it would not let me see the thread, it would just say that "this thread is awaiting moderation" - so I am trying to see if i can post on this. The thread is an answer to "What should get fixed" - a new question thread on page 1.

Delver
Jul 04, 2010
294
I'm sorry if I'm far too casual of a PvP'er for me to see why some these are needed, but, to me it seems like the players need to change as much as the system supposedly needs to change.

While yes, I can see how it's important that players of of equal level and rank should be restricted to fighting each some of the other stuff I don't. And I can understand down rank problems.

Explain to me how stacking smoke screens is worse than stacking shields? Stacking shields reduces damage taken while smoke screen reduces their chance of a successful casting. One attacks damage received and the other attacks accuracy. While I can understand stun shields and dispel shields, but just because you've reduced their accuracy doesn't mean they've lost all or most of their pips or can not do anything at all.

How is a team of myth, balance, fire and ice attack every other round with sandstorm, meteor and blizzard and myth using earth quake every third round any better or worse than a group of storm wizards using tempest every other round? Yes, they're spells are weaker but they are still over whelming the other team with a constant stream of attacks, keeping them on the defensive. Then with quake, it prevents the other team from even having any blades up. Maybe you need the smoke screens to keep from being completely over whelmed in the first place?

Even better yet, a storm, a myth, a fire and a life. Myth clears the field of shields and blades, storm attacks constantly, fire smoke screens and life rebirths every 4 rounds. Total control of the field, right? Specially if they go first.

What would really help, imho, is if you could into a pvp forum and not see people constantly mentioning how the system is broken and needs to be fixed. If you were a new player, would you want to try it with such negativity? Or would you want to keep PvP'ing if your opponents and people watching kept yelling insults at you for not fighting their way? Yes I know, levis and genies will break my bones but words will never hurt me, but, still, it's such a positive atmosphere.

Defender
Apr 01, 2011
153
Smoke screen chains are a cheap ploy used by say a legendary wizard (who doesn't know how to win otherwise) with two downranked level 1 (rating zero) - gets matched up with 3 low levels. His two puppets put two smoke screens on the opposite team every round (so the strategy works from first OR second because its a double smoke screen) and the legend pretty much critical strikes without getting once.

That's the problem - as for the rest of your post. Will answer tomorrow when I'm more rested.

Delver
Jul 04, 2010
294
laurawatersong wrote:
Smoke screen chains are a cheap ploy used by say a legendary wizard (who doesn't know how to win otherwise) with two downranked level 1 (rating zero) - gets matched up with 3 low levels. His two puppets put two smoke screens on the opposite team every round (so the strategy works from first OR second because its a double smoke screen) and the legend pretty much critical strikes without getting once.

That's the problem - as for the rest of your post. Will answer tomorrow when I'm more rested.


Okay - full commander gear gives 16%( which is on par with my fire wizard in his full level 56 crafted gear before sharp shot), add in 12% accuracy boost from a pet with sharp shot and school shot (balance it, death-shot, etc) and enchant your cards with unstoppable which adds 25% accuracy to any non-utility (and heal spell, I don't have a life to check for heals).

Now a diviner will have an attack card in their hand with 95% that is actually getting cast at 123% accuracy if I am doing my math right. With a single 40% smoke screen, you're casting at 83%. If you're stacked then you're only casting at 38%. But if you can infallible off and if a life wizard can get their accuracy boosting spell off, suddenly the diviner with two smoke screens is casting at 53% accuracy.

A death/balance wizard in full commander gear is already casting at 101% before any other boosts. So, 138% accuracy. 1 smoke is 98% and stacked smokes is 53%. Which is still pretty reasonable to me?

A life wizard would be casting at 143%, so a single smoke would drop them to 103%. 2 smokes is 58%.

And if you can get enough attacks off to break their chain, it's not completely unbeatable, right?

Unless I'm not doing my math the same way the game does the math then never mind

Survivor
Aug 17, 2010
18
Conner Ogrehorn says= I used to be good at this(well, i was corporal)and I lost my reputation.What I'm saying is he was a low level.Treasure cards should be banned from pvp. Talon Mythpants says= I dont care what u do as long as you do the above. Caleb Duskrider says=There should be an option to choose what ranks you want in the duel. Noah Hawkfist says=I dont care at all! Now go

Defender
Apr 01, 2011
153
random1self wrote:
laurawatersong wrote:
Smoke screen chains are a cheap ploy used by say a legendary wizard (who doesn't know how to win otherwise) with two downranked level 1 (rating zero) - gets matched up with 3 low levels. His two puppets put two smoke screens on the opposite team every round (so the strategy works from first OR second because its a double smoke screen) and the legend pretty much critical strikes without getting once.

That's the problem - as for the rest of your post. Will answer tomorrow when I'm more rested.


Okay - full commander gear gives 16%( which is on par with my fire wizard in his full level 56 crafted gear before sharp shot), add in 12% accuracy boost from a pet with sharp shot and school shot (balance it, death-shot, etc) and enchant your cards with unstoppable which adds 25% accuracy to any non-utility (and heal spell, I don't have a life to check for heals).

Now a diviner will have an attack card in their hand with 95% that is actually getting cast at 123% accuracy if I am doing my math right. With a single 40% smoke screen, you're casting at 83%. If you're stacked then you're only casting at 38%. But if you can infallible off and if a life wizard can get their accuracy boosting spell off, suddenly the diviner with two smoke screens is casting at 53% accuracy.

A death/balance wizard in full commander gear is already casting at 101% before any other boosts. So, 138% accuracy. 1 smoke is 98% and stacked smokes is 53%. Which is still pretty reasonable to me?

A life wizard would be casting at 143%, so a single smoke would drop them to 103%. 2 smokes is 58%.

And if you can get enough attacks off to break their chain, it's not completely unbeatable, right?

Unless I'm not doing my math the same way the game does the math then never mind


This is ranked PvP, not a tournament, when you sign up you don't know that you are fighting a chain smoking team. Using your ideas which assume we already know we are fighting a chain smoking team, the fair playing team still has low chances of winning. You'll have to see this strategy in action sometime to understand it. I'm a storm caster with 98% accuracy - storm shot and sharp shot on my pet. Believe me I know what I'm talking about.

Delver
Jul 04, 2010
294
I have seen it in action. And, if it's really bad enough to be posting about it, then shouldn't you be expecting it all the time anyways?

Defender
Apr 01, 2011
153
random1self wrote:
I have seen it in action. And, if it's really bad enough to be posting about it, then shouldn't you be expecting it all the time anyways?


If you have seen it in action and you don't think it's an exploit, it's because you are the guy using it. Take it away, Watson.

Explorer
May 15, 2009
55
I think removing treasure cards from ranked PvP would serve the arena well. As treasure cards aren't necessarily needed in a ranked match, and really should just be used in questing or practice PvP. If someone wants to use a spell outside their school of choice in ranked PvP, They should train it, and/ or find gear that provides it.

Hero
Jun 11, 2010
729
It would be nice if you could see the level of your team and the other team so that way you can deny if you are 30 levels lower than all of the other team.

Delver
Feb 18, 2010
252
1) I really like the idea of crit block gear for low levels, but what should be the block rating? maybe 30-40%?

2) the suggestions for beguile and earthquake-N O. these suggestions i've heard sound like the people who asked for the changes want to use it against other players, but when they have weaknesses and whatever else and the "new earthquake" doesn't remove them, they're going to beg for the old one back. And as for beguile, is it really that hard to just pass until the effect wears off?

3) I think I'm with the timer bubble idea, as well as the Triage one. Not so sure about the treasures though. If Triage becomes 3 pips to cast, won't the treasures become 3 pips too?

4) About the Snow Angel, how about in the actual game it taunts, while in parenthesis is says something like "casts a Balanceblade(or Tower Shield) on caster"? That seems like a reasonable compro.

5) The Smokescreen shield thingy seems like a good idea too.

6) WHO DROPS THE ALL MASTERY AMULETS? are they tradeable for the shared bank?

7) Darn, I thought I was going to say something else, but I FORGOT! :x I hate it when this happens!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oh yeah, now I think I remember. Instead of the current matching system for Ranked PvP, how about we make it like Practice? You can choose how to make your matches like you can there, but you still get rank points and/or tickets or whatever. Anyone agree? :D

I don't really have a legend view of PvP, even though I have a legend,(I don't PvP much) but I hope these are some good ideas! And crystalwizard12345...no offense but your ideas most likely won't happen. Unless KI makes a special spot for PvPer's who want to fight like that. They could unequip all pets and treasures, but it would take forever to find another person willing to do the same. So i doubt it will happen. That's all i got for now! ttfn: ta ta for now! :D

Delver
Feb 18, 2010
252
And another thing...what exactly is downranking? Sounds stupid, I know, but I honestly don't understand it much.

Delver
Feb 18, 2010
252
travisAk wrote:
kingurz wrote:
travisAk wrote:
Upping the pip cost. People would be less inclined to chain the spell if it became more costly, say three pips? Even with a fire amulet (dangerous move) the chainers would be opening themselves up

Your idea is good though about having a block that goes away the next round after But if it were only one block it could be exploited in larger group battles. It would have to successfully block every smokescreen in the rest of the round and the one following then disappear right? It's early -_-zZ I think I have an accuracy reduction going on in my brain right now.


Upping the pip cost is unfair to those fire wizards who primarily PvE. Choke is by far a better all enemy debuff and it costs 2 pips. I would prefer the temporary smoke block over the increased pip. Remember, the issue is chain smoking, not the spell itself. Dissuading PvPers from using it will also dissuade fire wizards from using it in PvE. Why keep a useless spell at that point?
Good point. I warned you my brain had an accuracy reduction spell on it at the time, I shall drink more coffee in the future. ;)


You should try some kind of tea or something with long lasting carbs, coffee can cause all kinds of probs and make you crash later. Plus it tastes nasty :x

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
can we add tea to the list of things to improve pvp? Mental alertness is a good thing no? ;)

Hey Laura do you remember fighting a level 10 fire dressed in white and losing from second? If not it was your clone, saw your Ice wiz pics on central story... Quite entertaining :) See you in the circle, don't forget the conviction ;) lol



Explorer
Feb 18, 2009
84
Personally, I think that the 'can't pvp with the same school' is a little ubsurd.

Defender
Oct 15, 2009
132
I have posted my idea before and KI has never answered it so I guess they dont like it. It would only add an extra 10 seconds to the match which is not much.

It addesses the issue of going first. I dont think any will disagree that going first gives a huge advantage. It seems the higher in levels we increase so does the probability that we will win if we go first.

The structure of the game dictates that someone goes first. There is really no way around that makes sense. The game is designed to randomly choose who will go first. So its 50/50 right? Is it? So if the computer is making the choice would it be that difficult to give the players the feature of having a hand in their own fate. Instead of letting the computer do a virtual "coin toss" that we never see, give us a stake on such an important aspect of the match.

Heres how it would work: Right after you press the button to go to the arena the screen is split into two sides. Digits 1-100 are circulating fast. Each side has 10 seconds to click the mouse or it clicks for you. The person with the higher score goes first. If its a tie you go again. Four multiplayer duels the screen would be split up accordingly.

Yes its the same happens when the computer does it. Someone still goes first. It would increase our chances I dont think. I think the reasons are obvious why people want to have a say in their chance to go first.

Defender
Jul 10, 2009
115
My ideas:

1. whenever smokescreen or other accuracy loss thing is on you, you get an accuracy loss shield

2. whenever beguile is cast on you, you get a beguile shield

3. there should be a scoreboard or something so the spectators can see the people battling health

that's all i have

Blaze Duskstone legendary conjurer

Defender
Dec 21, 2008
187
These are my ideas to improve PvP.

A treasure card level restriction.

Earthquake not removing traps, weakness, etc.

To decide which team goes first, I think there should be a little mini event before game.

The point system should be changed because a level 20 warlord facing a level 40 private who beats the level 20 would gain 20-30 points just for beating a level 20 warlord! I think the level 20 should only lose maybe 5-15 points. So I think that would improve pvp a lot.

Luke ThunderShade Level 60 Conjurer

Mastermind
Jun 06, 2009
398
I simply must disagree with the idea of implementing a cap on the number of different Schools per team.

One reason I object to this is that it is a poor strategy to do this willingly at any rate. It's a good idea to get Wizards of one or two Schools to fight a boss that is weak to their particular brand of magic, but the boss fight has two fatures that PvP lacks. Firstly, no equipment or natural disadvantage will make a Wizard more vulnerable to a certain School. Also, you will not know which magical discipline the opposing team follows until it is much too late.

Also, you may be an extremely helpful member of the team, but god forbid you expend a series of Traps another team member wanted to implement. This is a probable outcome: a scramble to use Traps before others can. This would foment both resentment of other players (who used Traps you were going to use) and the wrong kind of competition: competition within the team.

Thirdly, it would present far fewer chances to strategize. In my opinion, one of the best aspects of PvP is the chance it offers to concoct detailed strategies. (You are all at liberty to disagree, of course.) The eight slots offer 2401 combinations of Schools for your team alone (5,764,801 overall). If you assume that your team contains your School (which, of course, it would) under the suggested system, that would diminish to 7 for your team (343 overall for any battle you are in).
This may seem like an odd rant, but only dealing with seven combinations of Schools for the entirety of your time in the Arena will certainly make things duller. Put bluntly, it will be more repetitive (since the odds of running into the same combinations are much higher) and less fun. (Also, I did actually calculate those numbers using rational formulas.)

In short, I believe that limiting the number of Schools per team to two will be detrimental to the PvP experience.

Now, on a lighter note, I agree wholeheartedly with adding a turn limit to globe spells. I believe that this would balance the game in PvP as well as PvE (as to pay a mere four Pips to obtain a bonus for the entire match is, frankly, ludicrous).

Furthermore, the idea of paying a variable amount of Pips for a Dispel is interesting. I'd like to know a bit more about this.

Finally, my opinion on Beguile. I propose a few somewhat radical changes to the Spell.
Firstly, that the Pip cost be somewhat higher, and that the target gains a few Pips (thereby using a smaller amount of their own Pips);
Secondly, that the user of Beguile be forced to forfeit his own turns while Beguile is in effect;
Thirdly - this is the spellcaster's reimbursement for those limitations - that the beguiler, not the beguiled, select the Spells and targets. Please let me know what you think of this.

Defender
Jun 14, 2010
152
I think that the rating system should be fixed so that losing against a person who severely downranked wouldn't be so brutal and winning against a commander at private (yes, that actually happens) isn't so terrible to the commander and isn't such a huge bonus to the private.

The amount of points you get should be set in stone, so that this doesn't happen. The first paragraph is literally the story of my roughly 200 match pvp career.

I suggest getting maybe 15 points for winning a match, regardless of your rank, and losing ten points per match should you lose.

As for beguile, I'm a legendary necromancer and I never use it, save for when it pops up when i'm using the death ninja pig polymorph.

I don't use it because it's just about useless if you go second during a match, which happens a lot. I don't really think that there's any issue with it. Sure, it can cost you the match if you critical some really powerful spell then attack yourself with it because of beguile, but every other school has something that's really powerful about it.

Fire has Smokescreen, and DoT makes shielding useless.

Ice has Tower Shield, and to a lesser extent Steal Ward, both of which are nasty going second against.

Storm has Wildbolt, which is great at breaking shields, as well as Leviathan, which is easy to win with.

Balance has Black Mantle, Judgement, Spirit and Elemental Shields, Balanceblade, Bladestorm, Weakness, etc, ...

Life has Satyr, Sanctuary, Regenerate, Rebirth, and Forest Lord.

Myth has Medusa, stuns, Talos, double hitting spells, and a lot of minions.

And death has Beguile and Skeletal Dragon.


Historian
Jan 05, 2011
658
My ideas for pvp:
1. If critical block isn't put onto arena gear, then each player starts with a 4 turn conviction which would be replaced if the player casts a star spell in that time.
2. Team one starts with a 25% weakness and a 30% tower shield. Team 2 starts as normal.
3. Stun spells should be 100% accuracy, but each player should have a 20% chance to resist being stunned.
4. The Conviction spell should be buyable with either training points or arena tickets. -A.Dd, pvp 'veteran'