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Ban certain cards

1
AuthorMessage
Defender
Aug 03, 2015
137
To help fix the unpleasantness that PVP has caused lately, i'm creating a thread on which I want you guys to comment as to what spells you want banned from PVP.

My suggestions are as followed:

STORM:

. Insane bolt
. Wild bolt
. Iron sultan

FIRE:

. Burning rampage
. Fire beetle
. Efreet
. Scorching scimitars

ICE:

. Abominable weaver
. Winter moon

DEATH:

. Qismah's curse
. Bad juju
. Poison
. Sacrifice
. Beugile

MYTH:

. Snake charmer
. Earthquake
. Medusa

LIFE:

. Guardian spirit
. Brown spider
. Luminous weaver
. Llamasu

BALANCE:

. Loremaster
. Supernova
. Mana burn
. Gaze of fate
. Judgement

Survivor
Jan 05, 2015
23
Personally, I think it's ridiculous to ban any spell from PVP. There will always be ways around certain spells that you deem unpleasant, but it doesn't mean that these spells are unfair to the point of banning them completely.

Historian
Jun 19, 2010
652
I'm not against banning any cards. But I would love spells that reverse, negate, and neutralize them. This way no one is penalized, but everyone has additional workaround options.

Survivor
Jan 29, 2011
16
I believe this thread could head in the right direction for pvp, however I do not agree with most details listed. I believe insane bolt is a big issue, however more so ramp, guardian and lore. Ramp and lore are both great attributes to each school, however there needs to be minor fixes with each spell. Ramp is to overpowered and lore needs to be 5 pips, possibly decreasing the accuracy or weakness charm. However I will agree shadow spells need to be issued and guardian spirit needs to only be available for life at the level it was intended for.

Delver
Dec 08, 2016
249
This is in no way to offend the developers, but I believe they've made the mistake of releasing all these broken spells we have in the first place. Nerfs shouldn't have to happen, but unfortunately, with every new spell release, they always seem to be forgetting how it may affect PvP as well. PvP exists too, not just PvE. One perfect example is Bad Juju. I am extremely happy about the new upcoming nerf since it will finally put an end to the era of Juju spammers, but I am also extremely saddened that Death hitters have to suffer the punishment as well. I don't see the fairness in that. Sure, it may have made it fair for everyone else now, except for the Death wizards themselves. This school has already suffered so many nerfs to the point where it has gotten ridiculous. No changes should have had to happen if only the developers considered how our spells would affect PvP in the beginning. They should perhaps invite a group of open-minded PvP-ers from each school first to test any new spells they are planning to implement and take notes from their feedback. From this new update, I feel as though my opinion and people with similar opinions to mine did not go into consideration at all, and it also seems that Deaths are no longer of any value to the PvP community in any way because too often do we get neglected and lumped in with these unethical players nowadays. I feel so let down.

Delver
Dec 08, 2016
249
If spells were to be nerfed/banned, I reckon they should always come up with an idea to counter the loss of that school rather than turning a blind eye.

Survivor
Apr 11, 2009
10
I think rather than banning spells, schools that don't have so many OP spells like death or myth should get stuff to be on par with the other schools. Just my opinion.

Squire
May 10, 2013
505
So you just want to stop max PvP?

This is pretty much the only good cards that these schools have in PvP.

And Beguile doesn't help you in a 1v1, so Beguile is irrelevant.

Love it or hate it, these spells are here to stay.
If you can't beat them, just do what they do.

Survivor
Aug 03, 2011
17
If some spells were nerfed, that would suck for people like me who focus on PvE and not PvP

Survivor
Jul 12, 2016
36
I like your idea, to add this, I think that instead of there just being spells creatures can cast but not players, there should be a big amount of spells that go for the other way around too. I think the spells in the main post of this topic should be available to players only as well as maybe banned from PVP

that reminds me of something:
what do you get when you cross a sketched picture, and getting out a treasure card? a drawing

Explorer
Sep 15, 2013
83
I think for balance that Lore and Manaburn are the two that need to be fixed. Now that Ki has fixed dispel so that you can only dispel once per round, unless you have the time to take of the shield, Ki now needs to deal with manaburn in the same way. You can't compete with balance when they are constantly pulling your pips. Loremaster I think needs to be worth five pips, or they need to do away with one of the charms, either, the weakness, or the accuracy charm. But in general, I don't think we need to do away with everyone's spells. But I do think, to make it a more offensive match on both sides, it should be turn based, not like the turn based we see in tournaments. One player starts and the second player gets back to back turns, and then back to player 1 for back to back turns and so on. Both sides should be able to sort through their decks during rounds.

Survivor
Mar 02, 2010
5
Honestly, the only spell that really causes a problem for me is Loremaster. There is no way to counter that spell except for dispels, which now we have blocks for. I would be perfectly fine with it if it wasn't way more op than ANY other spell. It gives you a weakness, -55 or -50% (I forget which), and then does like massive amounts of damage. They shouldn't allow that spell in Pvp.

Saying if you can't beat them, join them, isn't a solution either. The people who say that are the people who rely on that spell for pvp. Most balance warlords with high rank just lore spam, and that's not pvp at all. It's a cowards way to win. There are plenty of other balance spells that are really good, you just have to save up pips for them. There is no problem with that.

If its not taken out, then it should be the majorly nerfed. Remove the weakness and mantle, OR make it 6 or 8 pips that way it can't be so easily spammed. But in all honesty, it should just be no pvp. That would make the game more fair for everyone.

Survivor
Mar 02, 2010
5
PlayHard101 on Jul 9, 2018 wrote:
So you just want to stop max PvP?

This is pretty much the only good cards that these schools have in PvP.

And Beguile doesn't help you in a 1v1, so Beguile is irrelevant.

Love it or hate it, these spells are here to stay.
If you can't beat them, just do what they do.
This isn't a good way to argue the point. From this message we can deduce that most likely you these spells a lot, which is fine, but it seems that if these spells were removed from pvp or nerfed, then your strat may not work anymore. I understand if you need these spells, but you can always find another strategy. So what, you might have to save up more than 6 pips in ranked or tourney, but some of these spells aren't fair for other schools. The game will still be the same, just have a more fair advantage for schools going against, lets say, balance.

And these aren't the only good spells in max pvp. If you have good damage, resist, or crit and pierce, then any spell can become very powerful. It just might take a little more time and effort, which I'm sure that anyone who loves Pvp can put in without a problem.

Survivor
Oct 29, 2010
38
he one card that is giving many issues is the guardian life spell where they can keep coming back every time and can go to full health after and use that card again and again after defeat, my opinion they shouldn't be able to use it so many times after defeat, stinks when they have a life pet on top of jade gear, and some have the mana burn also, so makes it worse when in rank

Explorer
Jan 12, 2013
62
Why not go one step further and ban all spells?
Matches could all be set in the Pigswick arena, and each round could consist of players choosing their best looking gear and doing a dance (including the new floss dance). After three rounds the Pigswick academy teachers confer and then give both players a participation trophy without actually declaring a winner. While players with crown gear would obviously have an advantage in choosing the best looking gear, the fact that no winner is declared should reduce complaints a little bit.

Explorer
Jan 12, 2013
62
You seriously need most of these spells. PvP becomes broken if people can sit there with high resist and heal. Nobody wants 1-6 hour PvP battles decided by who runs out of cards or loses patience first. There are already people who will pack 6+ reshuffles, very few attack spells, and try to outlast opponents.

Maybe e.g. lore is too strong - it should do less damage, or have the accuracy or damage effects nerfed, but in cases like this I would adjust the damage or effects rather than ban it completely.

Explorer
Sep 15, 2013
83
Trigon101060 on Jun 26, 2018 wrote:
To help fix the unpleasantness that PVP has caused lately, i'm creating a thread on which I want you guys to comment as to what spells you want banned from PVP.

My suggestions are as followed:

STORM:

. Insane bolt
. Wild bolt
. Iron sultan

FIRE:

. Burning rampage
. Fire beetle
. Efreet
. Scorching scimitars

ICE:

. Abominable weaver
. Winter moon

DEATH:

. Qismah's curse
. Bad juju
. Poison
. Sacrifice
. Beugile

MYTH:

. Snake charmer
. Earthquake
. Medusa

LIFE:

. Guardian spirit
. Brown spider
. Luminous weaver
. Llamasu

BALANCE:

. Loremaster
. Supernova
. Mana burn
. Gaze of fate
. Judgement
I don't agree that all of these spells should be banned from PvP, but there are some I definitely agree with.

- Insane Bolt! It's the most unfair spell in the entire game. Yes, I know there is a chance that the storm will be defeated if it backfires, but if it doesn't, you could be defeated in two hits, especially from second. There is no other school that has that kind of power behind one (1) pip! It needs to be banned from PvP!

- I don't think you can take any of these spells away from fire, it's their only line of offense. Fire has to have pips to play, they can't kill you in a mere two hits with 3 pips to start. Most other schools can. Fire has to conserve pips until they can form a complete combo. Taking away any of those spells really kills the school. Fire spells are set up for the way PvP should be played, the other schools need to follow their example. In my opinion, fire school is the only school that requires real skill to play with the exception of myth, that school also requires a great deal of skill to compete with.

- I don't ever play with ice, but again I think this is unnecessary. The real problem with ice is not their spells, but their stats. They are overpowered, they have a high amount of resist, they have extremely high health, great accuracy, a lot of pierce, and plenty of pips and spells that don't require pips. KI really kinda gave it all to ice wizards. Again, it's not really their spells, it's their stats, you fix that by adjusting other wizards stats.

- The only one I could see removing is beguile, but that really only affects 2v2 and over, though I think Ki has already made the right adjustments for death school wizards. Fixing Ju Ju was the greatest thing to happen to PvP thus far. Cheating is not competition. But I don't see that much else needs to happen to death school right now, they've already suffered a tremendous blow

Continued...

Explorer
Sep 15, 2013
83
Trigon101060 on Jun 26, 2018 wrote:
To help fix the unpleasantness that PVP has caused lately, i'm creating a thread on which I want you guys to comment as to what spells you want banned from PVP.

My suggestions are as followed:

STORM:

. Insane bolt
. Wild bolt
. Iron sultan

FIRE:

. Burning rampage
. Fire beetle
. Efreet
. Scorching scimitars

ICE:

. Abominable weaver
. Winter moon

DEATH:

. Qismah's curse
. Bad juju
. Poison
. Sacrifice
. Beugile

MYTH:

. Snake charmer
. Earthquake
. Medusa

LIFE:

. Guardian spirit
. Brown spider
. Luminous weaver
. Llamasu

BALANCE:

. Loremaster
. Supernova
. Mana burn
. Gaze of fate
. Judgement
- Myth and fire are really where they need to be in order to compete in PvP as it stands, with the exception of Medusa, possibly. Yeah, I know, I've been stunned for two rounds many-a-time now, and it does stink when I can't find a stun block in time, but I've lost to it and I've overcome it. I think to be fair to everyone, yes, they could make the stun for one round, but, at the same time, it's part of their strategy and combo. I don't feel it's right to completely deny them that. I don't get a lot of myth wizards in the arena, but, if you're that worried about it, I'd suggest packing more stun blocks and/or convictions, it's not impossible to overcome.

- Guardian Spirit either needs to go bye-bye, for PvP, or it needs to be controlled and limited, or the reshuffles need to be limited and tc reshuffles need to be banned. I truly do hate playing a match for 4-6 hours, 3 is my max on patience. I'm all about competition, but there becomes a point where it's no longer a competition and just plain cheating. I've defeated some level 125 life warlords 5 times in a match, but because of guardian spirit have lost everyone of those matches. I think by the third time, the spell should fail, it's just not fair. Third Times a Charm

- And finally, we come to my least favorite school in the Spiral, Balance Why is it that balance is the most unbalanced school in the game? Was it for the sake of irony? I'm not going to suggest that we get rid of all of their spells, but something does have to give. The Lore spam is just the most irritating thing to try to compete with. That in combination with manaburn, forget it I've already posted on this thread about how I feel about balance and what needs to be done, look up and read to see if you agree, but I can't stress enough, something has got to be done to help us defend against balance magic A -80% shield would be very nice I'll even settle for -75%

Continued...

Explorer
Sep 15, 2013
83
Trigon101060 on Jun 26, 2018 wrote:
To help fix the unpleasantness that PVP has caused lately, i'm creating a thread on which I want you guys to comment as to what spells you want banned from PVP.

My suggestions are as followed:

STORM:

. Insane bolt
. Wild bolt
. Iron sultan

FIRE:

. Burning rampage
. Fire beetle
. Efreet
. Scorching scimitars

ICE:

. Abominable weaver
. Winter moon

DEATH:

. Qismah's curse
. Bad juju
. Poison
. Sacrifice
. Beugile

MYTH:

. Snake charmer
. Earthquake
. Medusa

LIFE:

. Guardian spirit
. Brown spider
. Luminous weaver
. Llamasu

BALANCE:

. Loremaster
. Supernova
. Mana burn
. Gaze of fate
. Judgement
In closing I'd like to stress that there are clearly some spells that need to be rethought for PvP. Every player entering the arena should have the opportunity to truly compete, but I genuinely do not think it's all due to spells, it's more about game play and stats. PvP should be turn based, plain and simple. There's no other way to make it fair. Allowing one person to dominate the entire round is not competition, in most cases, it's a slaughter What worked for lower ranks does not work for higher ranks which is why you only see 1v1 battles going on in arena. Occasionally you'll see a 2v2 with two life jade wizards, full of guardian spirits and 2 other wizards from any given school, sighing, not knowing whether to scratch their watch or wind their noses, but people don't play it because there can be no real competition. At higher levels it's really about health and unless KI plans on continuing this game until level 350, some schools will never have enough health to be able to really compete. I think all wizards should get a significant health raise, again, unless wiz plans on continuing worlds and the length of the game, which I seriously doubt will go much further.

One other thing I'd like to see happen is a better deck system. I think your side bar should always be available to you or at least a certain amount of cards from them. Ideally, I'd like to see your main deck show as it always does with seven cards showing, then a separate pile for you tc allowing five options at a time, and then your side bar showing 2 at a time. This probably would only be necessary if KI doesn't go with the turn based system; I don't think you'd need this if they changed the playing format of the rounds.

But I think this is the recipe for a good start and then let's see where we're at until the next age, but this age really is broken, in my opinion, for higher level PvP, that is. It's not that I want PvP to be easy, I just want a real competition.

Thanks, Jeremy Firestaff

Explorer
Sep 15, 2013
83
Trigon101060 on Jun 26, 2018 wrote:
To help fix the unpleasantness that PVP has caused lately, i'm creating a thread on which I want you guys to comment as to what spells you want banned from PVP.

My suggestions are as followed:

STORM:

. Insane bolt
. Wild bolt
. Iron sultan

FIRE:

. Burning rampage
. Fire beetle
. Efreet
. Scorching scimitars

ICE:

. Abominable weaver
. Winter moon

DEATH:

. Qismah's curse
. Bad juju
. Poison
. Sacrifice
. Beugile

MYTH:

. Snake charmer
. Earthquake
. Medusa

LIFE:

. Guardian spirit
. Brown spider
. Luminous weaver
. Llamasu

BALANCE:

. Loremaster
. Supernova
. Mana burn
. Gaze of fate
. Judgement
One other thing I forgot to mention, that I think could be of tremendous help, is introducing two school training options without the use or need for a medallion or training points. I think by the time you reach graduation, you should then get the option to select a separate school of study gaining all trainable spells from the school you select, for free, and then being able to quest the extra spells that go along with that school. I mean think about it, when a person graduates college they usually have a major and a minor degree. A fire wizard is going to major in fire, but he should also get a minor degree, no? If you decide you no longer want that particular school you can have a school buy back for X amount of crowns and try something else. I'm not suggesting that the wizard also get all of the stats that go along with the school, just access to their trove of spells and pip advantage. PvP would become much fairer had we the right spells that didn't cost us more pips. What does anyone think of that idea?

Geographer
Dec 14, 2009
874
Most cards don't need to be banned or nerfed; a simple solution exists to solve the main culprit which is card "spamming". KI needs to implement a four (4) card max solution to pvp matches. Simply, no card can be played more than that. It would stop every "spammer" in their tracks, and force the use of strategy instead. It would also solve the problem of PVP affecting spells in PVE. Another huge plus would be the time and resources dedicated to the researching, and "nerfing" of cards could be better spent elsewhere. Similar games have tried this with great success. I think it would work here as well.

Explorer
Oct 04, 2012
51
I don’t do pvp but I understand these cards might be OP but honestly if you have trouble with pvp maybe do low leveled pvp?

Survivor
May 28, 2011
16
Some of these spells i agree with but the problem is when you take away both loremaster and judgement from balance. Balance already doesn't have a solid solid hit, so i agree loremaster is broken, but i wouldn't remove it. Also removing judgement would cripple the balance school if they do end up removing lore, because then all balance would have is chimera. If i were kingsisle i would increase the pips of loremaster, or take away the weakness of it, but not fully remove it.

Blaine ThunderHammer, 125
Andrew, 62

Survivor
Mar 02, 2010
5
blainethunderhamme... on Aug 26, 2018 wrote:
Some of these spells i agree with but the problem is when you take away both loremaster and judgement from balance. Balance already doesn't have a solid solid hit, so i agree loremaster is broken, but i wouldn't remove it. Also removing judgement would cripple the balance school if they do end up removing lore, because then all balance would have is chimera. If i were kingsisle i would increase the pips of loremaster, or take away the weakness of it, but not fully remove it.

Blaine ThunderHammer, 125
Andrew, 62
I completely agree with you. They shouldn't remove Judgement at all because it is easily countered with a tower shield or high resist. Loremaster on the other hand should be either no pvp or have the weakness or mantle removed if not both. Otherwise I have no problems with balance, besides lore.

Survivor
Aug 02, 2018
3
I personally think part of the strategy is knowing how to counter these spells using shields and such. I see no real point in banning these cards. Every PvP game is going to have annoying metas you just have to learn to deal with them.

1