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50% Balance Shield needed!

AuthorMessage
Explorer
Mar 15, 2011
89
darthjt wrote:
jojowild23 wrote:
darthjt wrote:
Well, it has come to my attention, that some schools are just too powerful and that some schools just have too much resistance.

Everyone wants this game and PvP to be fair and Balanced.

So, since Balance gets a 50% shield for every school, and there is no school specific balance shield, I think one should be made and introduced.

It would of course, only be a 50% shield, since that is what they get to resist all other schools.

This shield would be perfect, not overpowered, not taken away by any random wand spell. It is the perfect balance shield for balance.


Wow, really mature. What were you saying again about objectivity and personal feelings? Lol. Again, you're too much fun...

Do Balance wizards get a school specific blade that only works with Power Nova Ra Judge Sand then?

If not, you are merely introducing something into the game to deliberately handicap Balance wizards and giving them nothing in return.

And don't even start in with that's what happened in the Zafaria update to Storm being nerfed, as if hats that give 119% critical rating, robes that give (what is it again?) 61%? Critical rating and Sirens is nothing in return. Don't even pull that little charade on me. I'm not in the mood.

If you think that a new 50% Balance only shield and nothing in return is comparable to your perceived notions of Storm being "nerfed" I have no other recourse but to laugh at you.


Don't take it so personal. I have stated in the posts above me what insentives are given, as well as this draw back. Balance needs to be Balanced.

You keep talking you want balance in the game and that you want to keep things fair, well, just because it is against your school now, don't take it personal, just keeping it real.


Sorry, I really did think you were being at least partially antagonistic. It's great you weren't.

Some actually want an 80% shield. I don't know. Naturally, I like your 50% shield idea better but some would argue it's not fair or high enough. I don't know.

I know I wouldn't want to stop at just a school-specific blade, though. Blade, trap, convert and perhaps damage bubble of some sort: All that nice stuff the other schools have...

Squire
Dec 21, 2008
563
Rihanna12 wrote:
You could just use tower shield


Oh yeah right, any school could get rid of that. Then I do think there should be a balance shield. I think you should be able to get it from Sabrina Greenstar like with all the other shields.

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
darthjt wrote:
Well, it has seemed, that no matter how many times I post, or facts I present, people post these crazy ideas and KI runs with them. So, I figure, if you can't beat them, join them.


Well its an explanation. I don't understand it, but at least I know where you stand now.

darthjt wrote:
The only thing that is lacking in this concept is a prism, which is why, I suggested a 50% shield only. Balance gets shields to all schools, unlike every other school out there, which only gets shields to 3 schools.


Yes, and they're also the only school who doesn't get a free -80% shield to their own school.

darthjt wrote:
I have also upgraded Balances boost to being universal, rather than strictly Balance, since Hydra and Chimera are not boosted.


I don't understand this bit. My balance boost already applies to both of those spells so I'm at a loss as to what you mean.

darthjt wrote:
Since some people are so set against other schools having some balance, it is only right to balance their school too.

I have been a firm supporter of Balance in the past, but with how many complaints Balance has about being too powerful, there has to be some truth to it right? Otherwise, why all the complaints?


Ah, the old "where there's smoke there's fire" idea. Personally, I disagree. After all, there are FAR more complaints about Storm being too powerful and I don't think that's true either.

darthjt wrote:
Any school can be attacked, said is overpowered, and said needs to be changed. If people can't handle someone asking for change in their school, they should not demand something of other schools.


This bit I agree with.

Mastermind
Jul 25, 2010
387
there is no shield for balance because that's one of its special qualities and its not a super powered school it has a lot of down sides that's why it doesn't have a balance shield. Plus almost every legend i face in pvp has a tower shield in stored.

Explorer
Aug 14, 2011
67
Sounds interesting, but i've heard so many people say...
1. I want Balanceblade, Bladestorm, Dragonblade, etc... to be balance only.
Reply: Yeah, thats fine, but increase them a little bit? There is a reason these blades are lower than Storm's, they don't have to deal with shields.
2. Hex should be balance only.
Reply: Then curse and feint should be death only, too... right?
3. I want a balance prism, a convert.
Reply: Great, but convert to what? Maybe it could either be convert into some random school.
(This next one is just an idea!)
As everyone knows, some people have 2 or 3 accounts, to get every school complete. Maybe, they could add another school, the opposite of balance... Chaos. (Just an idea!) Post any ideas to if you like it or not; if you like it, whats spells should be implemented?

Explorer
May 12, 2010
77
gtarhannon wrote:
darthjt wrote:
Well, it has come to my attention, that some schools are just too powerful and that some schools just have too much resistance.

Everyone wants this game and PvP to be fair and Balanced.

So, since Balance gets a 50% shield for every school, and there is no school specific balance shield, I think one should be made and introduced.

It would of course, only be a 50% shield, since that is what they get to resist all other schools.

This shield would be perfect, not overpowered, not taken away by any random wand spell. It is the perfect balance shield for balance.


Let's outline the balances that this change would add: It would now be easier to shield balance damage which is already significantly confined in terms of lower base damage, lower boost spells, and lower volume of boost options vs. every other school. The net result is that a balance wizard would have to carry a balance wand to wand off this shield.

Let's outline the imbalances that this change would add: There is no prism to an opposite school. There is no wand of an opposite school. There is no opposite school's prism from their damage to balance damage. There is no chance of using an "out of school" wand to remove this shield with the opposite school's prism. There is no way to prevent triggering one's balance blades using this fictional opposite school wand. There is no balance specific blade. There is no balance specific trap. The blades and traps that can boost balance damage are all triggered by "any random wand spell".

Yeah. Sorry. It doesn't really sound like a good idea. In fact, it doesn't even really seem remotely objective. You and I have had more than our share of disagreements, but what is going on with you lately? You seem to have hopped the fence and are suddenly appearing on the side you have been arguing against for as long as I can remember. As little as 2 or 3 months ago, you would have been all over the posterior of someone starting a thread like this...


You are forgetting Gtarhannon, that Balance is the only school that can attack using all schools. So, if a person uses any spiritual shields, Balance can simply use Hydra, Elemental Blast, or a normal Balance attack. Or, if a person uses Elemental shields, the Balance can use Chimera or a Balance attack. Also, Balance receives 50% shields to all schools.

Balance also gets nearly a 70% attack boost at Legendary, has many blade choices available. How are you saying that Darthjt's post is unbalanced?

Explorer
May 12, 2010
77
joujou11cool wrote:
darthjt wrote:
Well, it has come to my attention, that some schools are just too powerful and that some schools just have too much resistance.

Everyone wants this game and PvP to be fair and Balanced.

So, since Balance gets a 50% shield for every school, and there is no school specific balance shield, I think one should be made and introduced.

It would of course, only be a 50% shield, since that is what they get to resist all other schools.

This shield would be perfect, not overpowered, not taken away by any random wand spell. It is the perfect balance shield for balance.


Eh, this wouldn't effect me TOO much because my Balance damage boost is already higher then almost all other Balance wizards I have seen. But, it would ruin how my spells go. I play elemental mostly, and I use Judgement so finish my enemy off when they have low health. If they were to cast this "Balance Shield", then Judgement would be kicked out of the decks of most Balance wizards and same as Ra, Sandstorm and some other spells. If this were to come into the game, then Balance would have too much trouble getting rid of Ice wizards.

They would use Glacial Shield then "Balance Shield". Bye bye to all Balance spells that the wizard has planned for.

I'm not saying this because I want my school to be the best, but I'm saying this because pvp is getting better and better. Now, I did lose my strategy ever since I got to level 70, but I'm regaining it slowly, but improving it.

A bunch of Balance wizards would complain (I for one would certainly), but it this were to REALLY come into the game, then here are about all the shields that can block balance spells:
Tower Shield
Weakness (This isn't really a shield but works like one)
Glacial Shield
Volcanic Shield
Dream Shield
Ether Shield
Spirit Shield (Absorbs count as shields)
Frost Armor
Ice Armor
Plague
Virulent Plague
Thermic Shield
Legion Shield
Cheat Shield (From some bosses)
Legend Shield
Resist (Works as built-in shield)

Do I really have to name every single shield in the game? Every single whole shield in wizard101 blocks balance spells and I find it certainly annoying. Balance has to face more shields then any other school in the game, and now you're re-stating this idea up.


What other school can attack in all the other schools and get the school boost balance does? None!

If a player uses elemental shields, balance can simply cast Chimera, Ra, or Judgement.

If a player uses Spiritual shields, balance can simply cast Hydra, Elemental Blast, Ra, or Judgement.

Tower shields can be removed by any spell, including fire elf, which is why a nice 50% balance shield would be an interesting addition. It is not the power of standard school shields of 80%, but lowered as there is no prism.

Explorer
May 12, 2010
77
jojowild23 wrote:
darthjt wrote:
CorbinW wrote:
So it wont be popped off by a life wand or anything like a Tower can, which is a Universal shield. Now we are treating balance more like an element if we add this shield. Hmm. This would also change how balance blades work too! If shields for balance are intoroduced as balance only, then the blades other wizards might depend on for a little extra boost become restricted to balance attacks only as well. Why is this in PvP though?


Yes, it would change how balance blades work, or give balance another school only blade. Also, since Balance has Spiritual and Elemental spells that are Balance, I don't feel that balance should have a balance only boost. I think Balance boosts should be lowered, but be univeral. That or change Hydra, Spectral Blast, and Chimera to boost via Balance's boost.


I think you made this post under a mistaken idea of how Balance gear damage boost works. Balance gear damage boost does in fact work on Hydra Spectral Blast and Chimera. I just tested it on Lady Blackhope, and it works on the out-of-school damage spells. After that, your post stops making sense to me. First you say that Balance should not have its school-specific boost. Then you say...or it's a typo and you meant "[dont] think Balance boosts should [not] be lowered but be universal. No, universal is too much, then you could use your Balance gear damage boost toward any spell in the game and that's too much power for Balance wizards to deserve.

darthjt wrote:
Also, the Balance Elemental and Spiritual shields should be able to be trained for 1 training point. As well as the new Balance shield.


I just don't like this. Those shields are part of quest rewards, if I remember right. Besides which, for PvP, I don't really think, and especially with the Ice school and its popularity to be trained, wizards out there either need inferior versions of things they have already or in some cases could make consolidated deck space for such shields without messing up their setup.

darthjt wrote:

I have not posted this in the dorms, as this can be, or mainly is considered a PvP issue, since only PvP players have problems with Balances power.

However, if this gets enough responses, I might make it in the dorms for an actual in game change.


Cool. I was thinking of doing the same. MLHagen over on Wizard Central has a couple very interesting threads on the topic of Balance getting a shield (and everything that comes with it, lol).


I do believe, that in the fairgrounds, you can spend 1 training point and learn the shield of any school, an 80% shield to be exact.

Now that Balance has both Hydra and Chimera, the only possible way to shield all 3 of those attacks, is to be able to train in Balances shields, which are given free to own school. Fair is fair!

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
RosamaryH wrote:
You are forgetting Gtarhannon, that Balance is the only school that can attack using all schools. So, if a person uses any spiritual shields, Balance can simply use Hydra, Elemental Blast, or a normal Balance attack. Or, if a person uses Elemental shields, the Balance can use Chimera or a Balance attack. Also, Balance receives 50% shields to all schools.


No I'm not. Neither am I forgetting that everyone can learn a secondary school, with a secondary school amulet always an option for the use of power pips. I'm also not forgetting that the boosts for actual balance damage spells are few, far between, trigger on anything, and small in number by comparison. This thread is about a balance damage specific shield right? Since the only spirit damage spell that balance has is Chimera, its pretty safe to assume that when you only see balance throwing on spirit blades and traps on their way to that 9 pip Chimera that they are going to hit you with it. No real shocker there right?

RosamaryH wrote:
Balance also gets nearly a 70% attack boost at Legendary, has many blade choices available. How are you saying that Darthjt's post is unbalanced?


Why don't you go ahead and have Darthjt explain it to you because I very clearly articulated how its unbalanced in my previous post and I'm certain he understands as well. For the record, at legendary using waterworks gear and the school specific wintertusk athame (Life and Ice of course doesn't get one so I'll assume the crafted garnet bear claw for each) and ring (yes, this means I didn't include a pet) the damage totals are:

Storm - 85%
Death - 70%
Balance - 67%
Life - 66%
Fire - 60%
Myth - 59%
Ice - 43%

Interesting. So Fire, Myth, and Ice are the only schools with sizably lower differences in damage. Well who would have suspected that? I'm sure the balance blade is much bigger and therefore we need a balance damage specific shield right? No? You say its smaller than everyone else and triggers on absolutely every attack? Wow. Who would have suspected that?

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
RosamaryH wrote:
I do believe, that in the fairgrounds, you can spend 1 training point and learn the shield of any school, an 80% shield to be exact.

Now that Balance has both Hydra and Chimera, the only possible way to shield all 3 of those attacks, is to be able to train in Balances shields, which are given free to own school. Fair is fair!


That 1 training point will give a single shield which covers exactly 1 hit of a DoT. A dual shield from any spirit school gives you 70% coverage of 2/3 of the chimera attack just like a dual shield from any elemental school covers 70% of 2/3 of hydra. Fire, for instance, can hit you two rounds in a row with a DoT preventing you from shielding 2/3 of the big hit with something like heckhound followed by heckhound or fire elf. A balance shield would only shield balance damage and therefore wouldn't apply to either chimera or hyrda. All balance damage is currently single hit damage that can only be amplified by boosts which are universal just like the available reducers. But hey, fair is fair right?

Explorer
Mar 15, 2011
89
RosamaryH wrote:
jojowild23 wrote:
darthjt wrote:
CorbinW wrote:
So it wont be popped off by a life wand or anything like a Tower can, which is a Universal shield. Now we are treating balance more like an element if we add this shield. Hmm. This would also change how balance blades work too! If shields for balance are intoroduced as balance only, then the blades other wizards might depend on for a little extra boost become restricted to balance attacks only as well. Why is this in PvP though?


Yes, it would change how balance blades work, or give balance another school only blade. Also, since Balance has Spiritual and Elemental spells that are Balance, I don't feel that balance should have a balance only boost. I think Balance boosts should be lowered, but be univeral. That or change Hydra, Spectral Blast, and Chimera to boost via Balance's boost.


I think you made this post under a mistaken idea of how Balance gear damage boost works. Balance gear damage boost does in fact work on Hydra Spectral Blast and Chimera. I just tested it on Lady Blackhope, and it works on the out-of-school damage spells. After that, your post stops making sense to me. First you say that Balance should not have its school-specific boost. Then you say...or it's a typo and you meant "[dont] think Balance boosts should [not] be lowered but be universal. No, universal is too much, then you could use your Balance gear damage boost toward any spell in the game and that's too much power for Balance wizards to deserve.

darthjt wrote:
Also, the Balance Elemental and Spiritual shields should be able to be trained for 1 training point. As well as the new Balance shield.


I just don't like this. Those shields are part of quest rewards, if I remember right. Besides which, for PvP, I don't really think, and especially with the Ice school and its popularity to be trained, wizards out there either need inferior versions of things they have already or in some cases could make consolidated deck space for such shields without messing up their setup.

darthjt wrote:

I have not posted this in the dorms, as this can be, or mainly is considered a PvP issue, since only PvP players have problems with Balances power.

However, if this gets enough responses, I might make it in the dorms for an actual in game change.


Cool. I was thinking of doing the same. MLHagen over on Wizard Central has a couple very interesting threads on the topic of Balance getting a shield (and everything that comes with it, lol).


I do believe, that in the fairgrounds, you can spend 1 training point and learn the shield of any school, an 80% shield to be exact.

Now that Balance has both Hydra and Chimera, the only possible way to shield all 3 of those attacks, is to be able to train in Balances shields, which are given free to own school. Fair is fair!


You're not understanding me.

Balance gets elemental shield as tutorial quest reward. Balance gets spirit shield for completing Cyclops Lane.

Apparently no other school gets quest rewards for Cyclops Lane completion, but here are the spells that other schools get for tutorial quests:

Death trap, Minor Blessing, Golem Minion, Lightning Strike, Freeze, and Fire Blade (enrollment quest, slightly different but close enough).

My point is you are making Balance share two more free spells and not sharing with Balance wizards enough in return.

No, fair is fair would be: Cleanse charm, cleanse ward, steal charm, steal ward, guidance, and curse all being trainable (regardless of level) as well as all the schools tutorial/enrollment quests listed above. Fair is fair.

Oh and you don't need Elemental/Spirit shields to defend against hydra and chimera. All you need is Volcanic shield and Legend shield, two popular pvp-trained schools anyway.

Balance only has three attacks that do Element/Spirit damage. Fair? Hmm... Chimera has no lower pip attack to "break shields" for. Fair?

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1633
RosamaryH wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:
darthjt wrote:
Well, it has come to my attention, that some schools are just too powerful and that some schools just have too much resistance.

Everyone wants this game and PvP to be fair and Balanced.

So, since Balance gets a 50% shield for every school, and there is no school specific balance shield, I think one should be made and introduced.

It would of course, only be a 50% shield, since that is what they get to resist all other schools.

This shield would be perfect, not overpowered, not taken away by any random wand spell. It is the perfect balance shield for balance.


Eh, this wouldn't effect me TOO much because my Balance damage boost is already higher then almost all other Balance wizards I have seen. But, it would ruin how my spells go. I play elemental mostly, and I use Judgement so finish my enemy off when they have low health. If they were to cast this "Balance Shield", then Judgement would be kicked out of the decks of most Balance wizards and same as Ra, Sandstorm and some other spells. If this were to come into the game, then Balance would have too much trouble getting rid of Ice wizards.

They would use Glacial Shield then "Balance Shield". Bye bye to all Balance spells that the wizard has planned for.

I'm not saying this because I want my school to be the best, but I'm saying this because pvp is getting better and better. Now, I did lose my strategy ever since I got to level 70, but I'm regaining it slowly, but improving it.

A bunch of Balance wizards would complain (I for one would certainly), but it this were to REALLY come into the game, then here are about all the shields that can block balance spells:
Tower Shield
Weakness (This isn't really a shield but works like one)
Glacial Shield
Volcanic Shield
Dream Shield
Ether Shield
Spirit Shield (Absorbs count as shields)
Frost Armor
Ice Armor
Plague
Virulent Plague
Thermic Shield
Legion Shield
Cheat Shield (From some bosses)
Legend Shield
Resist (Works as built-in shield)

Do I really have to name every single shield in the game? Every single whole shield in wizard101 blocks balance spells and I find it certainly annoying. Balance has to face more shields then any other school in the game, and now you're re-stating this idea up.


What other school can attack in all the other schools and get the school boost balance does? None!

If a player uses elemental shields, balance can simply cast Chimera, Ra, or Judgement.

If a player uses Spiritual shields, balance can simply cast Hydra, Elemental Blast, Ra, or Judgement.

Tower shields can be removed by any spell, including fire elf, which is why a nice 50% balance shield would be an interesting addition. It is not the power of standard school shields of 80%, but lowered as there is no prism.


Ok, you don't get what Balance is. I've played on my Balance wizard for many years now. I'm not sure if you even have a Balance wizard, but making Balance suffer through more then 10 different shields is crazy! There are 5 types of universal shields: Tower Shield, Legion Shield, Weakness, Plague, Virulent Plague. Balance can attack with Hydra and Chimera yes, but a school can use their level 8 (If myth level 16) shields and then their own school shield to block 1 full Balance spell already. Even people with second schools. Then, Judgement can be blocked by: Weakness, Tower Shield, Weakness treasure, Weakness amulet, Tower Shield treasure, Tower Shield amulet, MC Tower Shield, MC Weakness, Plague, Plague treasure, Virulent Plague treasure, Virulent Plague, Legion Shield, Legion Shield amulet, Legion Shield treasure, Plague amulet, Virulent Plague amulet. And also more spells.

There are already too many ways to block Balance. 50% Balance Shield would sound fair to you, but if you had a Balance wizard, that would be like I don't want to waste 6 pips on a Shatter treasure card, no one does! Yes, the universal defenses can be activated by a wand strike, but so can a Balanceblade/Dragonblade/Bladestorm/Hex/Feint/Curse. I'm planning on training for Tower Shield to block Balance spells, but I don't want a Balance Shield. Balance wizards with level 58 gear can get 75% Balance resist! Same as any other school for resist. And then the shields would come in, the Balance wizard would be immortal to Balance. If a Balance Shield were to come out, then Hydra should be 4 pips. That would be reasonable to use before a Spectral Blast. Balance Shield isn't fair if Balance doesn't get a low pip elemental and spiritual shield removal. That's what I have to say. And remember, Balance has its own way to play, never forget that.

Explorer
May 12, 2010
77
gtarhannon wrote:
RosamaryH wrote:
You are forgetting Gtarhannon, that Balance is the only school that can attack using all schools. So, if a person uses any spiritual shields, Balance can simply use Hydra, Elemental Blast, or a normal Balance attack. Or, if a person uses Elemental shields, the Balance can use Chimera or a Balance attack. Also, Balance receives 50% shields to all schools.


No I'm not. Neither am I forgetting that everyone can learn a secondary school, with a secondary school amulet always an option for the use of power pips. I'm also not forgetting that the boosts for actual balance damage spells are few, far between, trigger on anything, and small in number by comparison. This thread is about a balance damage specific shield right? Since the only spirit damage spell that balance has is Chimera, its pretty safe to assume that when you only see balance throwing on spirit blades and traps on their way to that 9 pip Chimera that they are going to hit you with it. No real shocker there right?

RosamaryH wrote:
Balance also gets nearly a 70% attack boost at Legendary, has many blade choices available. How are you saying that Darthjt's post is unbalanced?


Why don't you go ahead and have Darthjt explain it to you because I very clearly articulated how its unbalanced in my previous post and I'm certain he understands as well. For the record, at legendary using waterworks gear and the school specific wintertusk athame (Life and Ice of course doesn't get one so I'll assume the crafted garnet bear claw for each) and ring (yes, this means I didn't include a pet) the damage totals are:

Storm - 85%
Death - 70%
Balance - 67%
Life - 66%
Fire - 60%
Myth - 59%
Ice - 43%

Interesting. So Fire, Myth, and Ice are the only schools with sizably lower differences in damage. Well who would have suspected that? I'm sure the balance blade is much bigger and therefore we need a balance damage specific shield right? No? You say its smaller than everyone else and triggers on absolutely every attack? Wow. Who would have suspected that?


Actually, Gtarhannon, you are wrong.

If I am not mistaken, balance gets 2 blades, Balance Blade 25% and Bladestorm 20% which is more blade boost than any other school!

Explorer
May 12, 2010
77
joujou11cool wrote:
RosamaryH wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:
darthjt wrote:
Well, it has come to my attention, that some schools are just too powerful and that some schools just have too much resistance.

Everyone wants this game and PvP to be fair and Balanced.

So, since Balance gets a 50% shield for every school, and there is no school specific balance shield, I think one should be made and introduced.

It would of course, only be a 50% shield, since that is what they get to resist all other schools.

This shield would be perfect, not overpowered, not taken away by any random wand spell. It is the perfect balance shield for balance.


Eh, this wouldn't effect me TOO much because my Balance damage boost is already higher then almost all other Balance wizards I have seen. But, it would ruin how my spells go. I play elemental mostly, and I use Judgement so finish my enemy off when they have low health. If they were to cast this "Balance Shield", then Judgement would be kicked out of the decks of most Balance wizards and same as Ra, Sandstorm and some other spells. If this were to come into the game, then Balance would have too much trouble getting rid of Ice wizards.

They would use Glacial Shield then "Balance Shield". Bye bye to all Balance spells that the wizard has planned for.

I'm not saying this because I want my school to be the best, but I'm saying this because pvp is getting better and better. Now, I did lose my strategy ever since I got to level 70, but I'm regaining it slowly, but improving it.

A bunch of Balance wizards would complain (I for one would certainly), but it this were to REALLY come into the game, then here are about all the shields that can block balance spells:
Tower Shield
Weakness (This isn't really a shield but works like one)
Glacial Shield
Volcanic Shield
Dream Shield
Ether Shield
Spirit Shield (Absorbs count as shields)
Frost Armor
Ice Armor
Plague
Virulent Plague
Thermic Shield
Legion Shield
Cheat Shield (From some bosses)
Legend Shield
Resist (Works as built-in shield)

Do I really have to name every single shield in the game? Every single whole shield in wizard101 blocks balance spells and I find it certainly annoying. Balance has to face more shields then any other school in the game, and now you're re-stating this idea up.


What other school can attack in all the other schools and get the school boost balance does? None!

If a player uses elemental shields, balance can simply cast Chimera, Ra, or Judgement.

If a player uses Spiritual shields, balance can simply cast Hydra, Elemental Blast, Ra, or Judgement.

Tower shields can be removed by any spell, including fire elf, which is why a nice 50% balance shield would be an interesting addition. It is not the power of standard school shields of 80%, but lowered as there is no prism.


Ok, you don't get what Balance is. I've played on my Balance wizard for many years now. I'm not sure if you even have a Balance wizard, but making Balance suffer through more then 10 different shields is crazy! There are 5 types of universal shields: Tower Shield, Legion Shield, Weakness, Plague, Virulent Plague. Balance can attack with Hydra and Chimera yes, but a school can use their level 8 (If myth level 16) shields and then their own school shield to block 1 full Balance spell already. Even people with second schools. Then, Judgement can be blocked by: Weakness, Tower Shield, Weakness treasure, Weakness amulet, Tower Shield treasure, Tower Shield amulet, MC Tower Shield, MC Weakness, Plague, Plague treasure, Virulent Plague treasure, Virulent Plague, Legion Shield, Legion Shield amulet, Legion Shield treasure, Plague amulet, Virulent Plague amulet. And also more spells.

There are already too many ways to block Balance. 50% Balance Shield would sound fair to you, but if you had a Balance wizard, that would be like I don't want to waste 6 pips on a Shatter treasure card, no one does! Yes, the universal defenses can be activated by a wand strike, but so can a Balanceblade/Dragonblade/Bladestorm/Hex/Feint/Curse. I'm planning on training for Tower Shield to block Balance spells, but I don't want a Balance Shield. Balance wizards with level 58 gear can get 75% Balance resist! Same as any other school for resist. And then the shields would come in, the Balance wizard would be immortal to Balance. If a Balance Shield were to come out, then Hydra should be 4 pips. That would be reasonable to use before a Spectral Blast. Balance Shield isn't fair if Balance doesn't get a low pip elemental and spiritual shield removal. That's what I have to say. And remember, Balance has its own way to play, never forget that.


First of all, shatter is a 3 pip spell. Secondly, if you have a myth mastery amulet, it only costs 1 power pip and 1 normal pip.

Now, every other school gets a shield, except balance.
Schools get 1 blade, except balance, which gets 2.
Balance gets 50% shields to all schools, no other school does.

Just saying the balance shields should be trainable and a balance shield of 50% added!

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
RosamaryH wrote:
Actually, Gtarhannon, you are wrong.

If I am not mistaken, balance gets 2 blades, Balance Blade 25% and Bladestorm 20% which is more blade boost than any other school!


Really? You're going to include a 1 pip school special boost in the topic of "school blades"? You're going to gloss completely over every school being able to benefit from balance blades, bladestorm, and elemental and spiritual blades? Well then, by that standard, don't forget supercharge. Balance has more blade boost than any other school huh? I guess we're both wrong.

Survivor
Mar 22, 2011
21
A Balance Shield is not needed, nor should it be implemented into the game.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1633
RosamaryH wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:
RosamaryH wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:
darthjt wrote:
Well, it has come to my attention, that some schools are just too powerful and that some schools just have too much resistance.

Everyone wants this game and PvP to be fair and Balanced.

So, since Balance gets a 50% shield for every school, and there is no school specific balance shield, I think one should be made and introduced.

It would of course, only be a 50% shield, since that is what they get to resist all other schools.

This shield would be perfect, not overpowered, not taken away by any random wand spell. It is the perfect balance shield for balance.


Eh, this wouldn't effect me TOO much because my Balance damage boost is already higher then almost all other Balance wizards I have seen. But, it would ruin how my spells go. I play elemental mostly, and I use Judgement so finish my enemy off when they have low health. If they were to cast this "Balance Shield", then Judgement would be kicked out of the decks of most Balance wizards and same as Ra, Sandstorm and some other spells. If this were to come into the game, then Balance would have too much trouble getting rid of Ice wizards.

They would use Glacial Shield then "Balance Shield". Bye bye to all Balance spells that the wizard has planned for.

I'm not saying this because I want my school to be the best, but I'm saying this because pvp is getting better and better. Now, I did lose my strategy ever since I got to level 70, but I'm regaining it slowly, but improving it.

A bunch of Balance wizards would complain (I for one would certainly), but it this were to REALLY come into the game, then here are about all the shields that can block balance spells:
Tower Shield
Weakness (This isn't really a shield but works like one)
Glacial Shield
Volcanic Shield
Dream Shield
Ether Shield
Spirit Shield (Absorbs count as shields)
Frost Armor
Ice Armor
Plague
Virulent Plague
Thermic Shield
Legion Shield
Cheat Shield (From some bosses)
Legend Shield
Resist (Works as built-in shield)

Do I really have to name every single shield in the game? Every single whole shield in wizard101 blocks balance spells and I find it certainly annoying. Balance has to face more shields then any other school in the game, and now you're re-stating this idea up.


What other school can attack in all the other schools and get the school boost balance does? None!

If a player uses elemental shields, balance can simply cast Chimera, Ra, or Judgement.

If a player uses Spiritual shields, balance can simply cast Hydra, Elemental Blast, Ra, or Judgement.

Tower shields can be removed by any spell, including fire elf, which is why a nice 50% balance shield would be an interesting addition. It is not the power of standard school shields of 80%, but lowered as there is no prism.


Ok, you don't get what Balance is. I've played on my Balance wizard for many years now. I'm not sure if you even have a Balance wizard, but making Balance suffer through more then 10 different shields is crazy! There are 5 types of universal shields: Tower Shield, Legion Shield, Weakness, Plague, Virulent Plague. Balance can attack with Hydra and Chimera yes, but a school can use their level 8 (If myth level 16) shields and then their own school shield to block 1 full Balance spell already. Even people with second schools. Then, Judgement can be blocked by: Weakness, Tower Shield, Weakness treasure, Weakness amulet, Tower Shield treasure, Tower Shield amulet, MC Tower Shield, MC Weakness, Plague, Plague treasure, Virulent Plague treasure, Virulent Plague, Legion Shield, Legion Shield amulet, Legion Shield treasure, Plague amulet, Virulent Plague amulet. And also more spells.

There are already too many ways to block Balance. 50% Balance Shield would sound fair to you, but if you had a Balance wizard, that would be like I don't want to waste 6 pips on a Shatter treasure card, no one does! Yes, the universal defenses can be activated by a wand strike, but so can a Balanceblade/Dragonblade/Bladestorm/Hex/Feint/Curse. I'm planning on training for Tower Shield to block Balance spells, but I don't want a Balance Shield. Balance wizards with level 58 gear can get 75% Balance resist! Same as any other school for resist. And then the shields would come in, the Balance wizard would be immortal to Balance. If a Balance Shield were to come out, then Hydra should be 4 pips. That would be reasonable to use before a Spectral Blast. Balance Shield isn't fair if Balance doesn't get a low pip elemental and spiritual shield removal. That's what I have to say. And remember, Balance has its own way to play, never forget that.


First of all, shatter is a 3 pip spell. Secondly, if you have a myth mastery amulet, it only costs 1 power pip and 1 normal pip.

Now, every other school gets a shield, except balance.
Schools get 1 blade, except balance, which gets 2.
Balance gets 50% shields to all schools, no other school does.

Just saying the balance shields should be trainable and a balance shield of 50% added!


First of all, you don't know that most people don't get mastery amulets for 1 spell! Shatter WILL cost 6 pips to me NO MATTER WHAT. It's 3 pips, meaning 6 pips because my power pip chance is nearly 100%. All schools get boosts. There are such things called traps.

You have many facts wrong. Balance gets 3 boosts, while many schools get 4-5. Here you go:

Fire: Fireblade, Fire Trap, Fuel, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap, Wyldfire.
Storm: Stormblade, Storm Trap, Darkwind, Windstorm, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap.
Ice: Iceblade, Ice Trap, Balefrost, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap.
Death: Deathblade, Death Trap, Curse, Feint, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Life: Lifeblade, Life Trap, Forest Lord pet trap, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Myth: Mythblade, Myth Trap, Time of Legend, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Balance: Balanceblade, Bladestorm, Hex.

See how when Balance showa up, the list is A WHOLE LOT SMALLER then all the others, even if I excluded Spirit/Elemental Blade/Trap.

All schools get shields lol. Have you not forgotten what level 8 gives?
Fire: Glacial Shield, Fire Shield-Hydra, Spectral Blast gone
Storm: Thermic Shield, Storm Shield-Hydra,Sepctral Blast gone
Ice: Volcanic Shield, Ice Shield-Hydra,Spectral Blast gone
Tower Shield, Legion Shield-Judgement, Sandstorm, Locust Swarm, Ra, Scarab, Scorpion gone.
Frost Armor, Ice Armor-All spells gone.
Death: Dream Shield, Death Shield-Chimera gone.
Plague, Virulent Plague-All spells gone.
Life: Legend Shield, Life Shield-Chimera gone.
Spirit Armor, Rebirth Armor-All spells weakened.
Myth:Ether Shield, Myth Shield-Chimera gone.

Other schools get -70% and also -80%. All Balance gets is -50% shields. Weakness is -25%.
A critical and no critical block could cover for the Elemental/Spirit Shields.

Balance is already VERY blockable while when other schools face balance, their spells are only halved, and that's IF the person decides to be defensive. If you're having trouble against Balance, that's your problem. Deal with how each school plays, that's just like complaining about Life's heals or Storm's damage or even Ice's resist! Ice can block a whole lot better then Balance, and Ice can still hit very high amounts of damage.

Fire and Myth have more resist then Balance and yet Fire and Myth hit a lot higher damage. Think before you complain about something, figure out your own strategy, don't just go on crying over something that's going to completely destroy a school.

I know, there is a come back for: If you say that other schools get blocked against Balance by 50%, then Balance should get blocked by 50% too! Well, Balance gets blocked by 70-80%!

Deal with how Balance is: Very defensive, but also blocked easily.

If the Balance Shield was created, it should be 25%.

Let me count how many spells can already fully block/weaken balance spells:
Glacial Shield
Elemental Shield
Spirit Shield
Thermic Shield
Volcanic Shield
Legend Shield
Weakness
Dream shield
Spirit Armor
Rebirth Armor
Tower Shield
Legion Shield
Plague
Virulent Plague
Fire Shield
Storm Shield
Ice Shield
Death Shield
Life Shield
Myth Shield
Frost Armor
Ice Armor
Power Nova
X3 because of amulets and treasure cards. 23 NORMAL spells can block Balance. So: 23x3=69. 69 spells can block Balance spells! TOO MANY! FAR TOO MANY! Now, 70 because of Balance Shield. And then 72 because of amulet and treasure cards. WOW. Balance only gets about:
Elemental Shield
Spirit Shield
Weakness
Power Nova
X3 because of treasure cards and amulets. 4x3=12. 12 vs. 72. What do you think wins? All other schools, exactly. And they're all much higher defenses then Balance, so remember this: There are 72 ways to block Balance, and only 12 ways for Balance to block other schools.

Explorer
May 12, 2010
77
joujou11cool wrote:


First of all, you don't know that most people don't get mastery amulets for 1 spell! Shatter WILL cost 6 pips to me NO MATTER WHAT. It's 3 pips, meaning 6 pips because my power pip chance is nearly 100%. All schools get boosts. There are such things called traps.

You have many facts wrong. Balance gets 3 boosts, while many schools get 4-5. Here you go:


Balance gets 3 boosts? Since when? Hmm, let's look closely at this.

Balance Blade, Bladestorm, Hex, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap, Spiritual Blade, Spiritual Trap.

Remember, Elemental blades and traps and Spiritual blades and traps are Balance's, not any other schools. They cost a training point for other schools to learn them.


Fire: Fireblade, Fire Trap, Fuel, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap, Wyldfire.
Storm: Stormblade, Storm Trap, Darkwind, Windstorm, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap.
Ice: Iceblade, Ice Trap, Balefrost, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap.
Death: Deathblade, Death Trap, Curse, Feint, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Life: Lifeblade, Life Trap, Forest Lord pet trap, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Myth: Mythblade, Myth Trap, Time of Legend, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Balance: Balanceblade, Bladestorm, Hex.

See how when Balance showa up, the list is A WHOLE LOT SMALLER then all the others, even if I excluded Spirit/Elemental Blade/Trap.


Fire: Fire Blade, trap, wyldfire, fuel = 4
Ice: Ice Blade, trap, Balefrost = 3
Storm: Storm Blade, trap, Darkwind, Windstorm, Supercharge = 5
Myth: Myth Blade, trap, Time of legend = 3
Death: Death Blade, trap, curse, feint, dark pact = 5
Life: Life Blade, trap = 2

Now, if you want to add Elemental blades and traps to their numbers, you can add the numbers of their schools traps to Balance, since balance has attacks that work for Life, Death, Myth, Storm, Fire, and Ice!

So, math shows correctly, that Balance has the most blades and traps in the game, is that not correct?


All schools get shields lol. Have you not forgotten what level 8 gives?
Fire: Glacial Shield, Fire Shield-Hydra, Spectral Blast gone
Storm: Thermic Shield, Storm Shield-Hydra,Sepctral Blast gone
Ice: Volcanic Shield, Ice Shield-Hydra,Spectral Blast gone
Tower Shield, Legion Shield-Judgement, Sandstorm, Locust Swarm, Ra, Scarab, Scorpion gone.
Frost Armor, Ice Armor-All spells gone.
Death: Dream Shield, Death Shield-Chimera gone.
Plague, Virulent Plague-All spells gone.
Life: Legend Shield, Life Shield-Chimera gone.
Spirit Armor, Rebirth Armor-All spells weakened.
Myth:Ether Shield, Myth Shield-Chimera gone.

Other schools get -70% and also -80%. All Balance gets is -50% shields. Weakness is -25%.


Well, considering that Balance does not get a school shield, it should not get a 70% shield to all schools, how would that be fair?

And, a 50% shield and a -25% weakness does huge amounts of protection, more than a 70% shield would.


A critical and no critical block could cover for the Elemental/Spirit Shields.

Balance is already VERY blockable while when other schools face balance, their spells are only halved, and that's IF the person decides to be defensive. If you're having trouble against Balance, that's your problem. Deal with how each school plays, that's just like complaining about Life's heals or Storm's damage or even Ice's resist! Ice can block a whole lot better then Balance, and Ice can still hit very high amounts of damage.


How exactly do you figure this? a fire elf, or death beetle, for 1 or 2 pips can eat 4 tower shields, which happens to be, the only shield that protects from Balance spells!


Fire and Myth have more resist then Balance and yet Fire and Myth hit a lot higher damage. Think before you complain about something, figure out your own strategy, don't just go on crying over something that's going to completely destroy a school.


Balance has 67% damage boost or more, while Fire and Myth are in the 50% damage boost range, how are they doing higher damage exactly?

I know, there is a come back for: If you say that other schools get blocked against Balance by 50%, then Balance should get blocked by 50% too! Well, Balance gets blocked by 70-80%!


How is Balance being Blocked by 70-80%? There is no Balance shield, now, if you sure Hydra, Elemental Blast, or Chimera, this is possible, however, one attack will not be blocked at all. And, you have the option of which spell to use, so if Elemental Shields are present, you can use Chimera, while if Spiritual shields are present, you can use Hydra, can any other schools do that and get the boost?

Deal with how Balance is: Very defensive, but also blocked easily.


Again, you have yet to prove how Balance is very defensive and blocked easily!

If the Balance Shield was created, it should be 25%.

Let me count how many spells can already fully block/weaken balance spells:
Glacial Shield
Elemental Shield
Spirit Shield
Thermic Shield
Volcanic Shield
Legend Shield
Weakness
Dream shield
Spirit Armor
Rebirth Armor
Tower Shield
Legion Shield
Plague
Virulent Plague
Fire Shield
Storm Shield
Ice Shield
Death Shield
Life Shield
Myth Shield
Frost Armor
Ice Armor
Power Nova
X3 because of amulets and treasure cards. 23 NORMAL spells can block Balance. So: 23x3=69. 69 spells can block Balance spells! TOO MANY! FAR TOO MANY! Now, 70 because of Balance Shield. And then 72 because of amulet and treasure cards. WOW. Balance only gets about:
Elemental Shield
Spirit Shield
Weakness
Power Nova
X3 because of treasure cards and amulets. 4x3=12. 12 vs. 72. What do you think wins? All other schools, exactly. And they're all much higher defenses then Balance, so remember this: There are 72 ways to block Balance, and only 12 ways for Balance to block other schools.


Actually, Balance can train any other schools, to get these 70% shields also, or even use a training point on each school specifically, gaining an 80% shield to each school, with their elemental and spiritual shields, also always allowing them to block damage from a spell!

However, the only way to block, say the Judgement spell, is by a towershield, which can be removed by any attack or spell. Like I said, a death beetle will remove 4 tower shields for 1 pip. Without the use of mastery amulet!

So, how can all of Balance's spells be blocked again?

Armiger
May 10, 2010
2080
gtarhannon wrote:
RosamaryH wrote:
You are forgetting Gtarhannon, that Balance is the only school that can attack using all schools. So, if a person uses any spiritual shields, Balance can simply use Hydra, Elemental Blast, or a normal Balance attack. Or, if a person uses Elemental shields, the Balance can use Chimera or a Balance attack. Also, Balance receives 50% shields to all schools.


No I'm not. Neither am I forgetting that everyone can learn a secondary school, with a secondary school amulet always an option for the use of power pips. I'm also not forgetting that the boosts for actual balance damage spells are few, far between, trigger on anything, and small in number by comparison. This thread is about a balance damage specific shield right? Since the only spirit damage spell that balance has is Chimera, its pretty safe to assume that when you only see balance throwing on spirit blades and traps on their way to that 9 pip Chimera that they are going to hit you with it. No real shocker there right?


Well, that is the greatest thing about Balance, you never know what they are going to be attacking with. Balance might throw up a spiritual Blade, making the opponent then use some type of spiritual shield, then wham, hit with a 10 pip Judgment spell... Or, since there were no elemental shields, it might go and hit with Hydra, or spectral blast! Balance has so many choices, how does one defend against them!

RosamaryH wrote:
Balance also gets nearly a 70% attack boost at Legendary, has many blade choices available. How are you saying that Darthjt's post is unbalanced?


Why don't you go ahead and have Darthjt explain it to you because I very clearly articulated how its unbalanced in my previous post and I'm certain he understands as well.


What am I supposed to be explaining here?

For the record, at legendary using waterworks gear and the school specific wintertusk athame (Life and Ice of course doesn't get one so I'll assume the crafted garnet bear claw for each) and ring (yes, this means I didn't include a pet) the damage totals are:

Storm - 85%
Death - 70%
Balance - 67%
Life - 66%
Fire - 60%
Myth - 59%
Ice - 43%

Interesting. So Fire, Myth, and Ice are the only schools with sizably lower differences in damage. Well who would have suspected that? I'm sure the balance blade is much bigger and therefore we need a balance damage specific shield right? No? You say its smaller than everyone else and triggers on absolutely every attack? Wow. Who would have suspected that?


As Rosamary has pointed out, which she is right Gtarhannon, Balance is given 2 blades, balance blade and bladestorm.

Only 2 other schools are given a secondary blade, storm's supercharge, which is an x pip spell and is another discussion in itself. And death's dark pact, which is a good blade, however if not casted first, it can remove all of deaths blades. Not sure why KI was not smart enough to make this moon damage.

I do agree with you though, these blades and even death's dark pact do activate on any spell.

People say that the fact that Balance does not get the same boosts as other schools, trap wise, blade wise, which they do, actually more, and Balance gets shields to all schools, something no other school gets, that a 50% balance shield be added to the game. Would it really defeat Balance that much? How many people would get it and use it?

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
darthjt wrote:
As Rosamary has pointed out, which she is right Gtarhannon, Balance is given 2 blades, balance blade and bladestorm.

Only 2 other schools are given a secondary blade, storm's supercharge, which is an x pip spell and is another discussion in itself. And death's dark pact, which is a good blade, however if not casted first, it can remove all of deaths blades. Not sure why KI was not smart enough to make this moon damage.


So then no, balance isn't the only one. While we're at it, why don't we go ahead and admit that every school but balance can not only train in the balance specific boost (elemental or spiritual blade and traps) for only one point each, but can also pay a casual visit to the library whereby they can readily pick up treasure versions which stack. There are no such easy options for balance specific damage spells.

darthjt wrote:
I do agree with you though, these blades and even death's dark pact do activate on any spell.

People say that the fact that Balance does not get the same boosts as other schools, trap wise, blade wise, which they do, actually more, and Balance gets shields to all schools, something no other school gets, that a 50% balance shield be added to the game. Would it really defeat Balance that much? Hoew many people would get it and use it?


It is ridiculous to say that balance gets "more" blades for balance specific damage after reading what I wrote above. How is it fair for there to be a balance specific shield when there are NO balance specific traps or blades or even a prism? You keep talking about the balance shields to every school. Well, it takes 2 rounds to cast them, they don't cover balance damage, and they are only 50%. In the same two rounds another player can cast an elemental set of shields and a spirit set of shields at 70% and accomplish effectively the same thing (vs. either hydra or chimera). Where's the imbalance and need for a balance specific 50% shield?

Armiger
May 10, 2010
2080
gtarhannon wrote:
darthjt wrote:
As Rosamary has pointed out, which she is right Gtarhannon, Balance is given 2 blades, balance blade and bladestorm.

Only 2 other schools are given a secondary blade, storm's supercharge, which is an x pip spell and is another discussion in itself. And death's dark pact, which is a good blade, however if not casted first, it can remove all of deaths blades. Not sure why KI was not smart enough to make this moon damage.


So then no, balance isn't the only one. While we're at it, why don't we go ahead and admit that every school but balance can not only train in the balance specific boost (elemental or spiritual blade and traps) for only one point each, but can also pay a casual visit to the library whereby they can readily pick up treasure versions which stack. There are no such easy options for balance specific damage spells.

darthjt wrote:
I do agree with you though, these blades and even death's dark pact do activate on any spell.

People say that the fact that Balance does not get the same boosts as other schools, trap wise, blade wise, which they do, actually more, and Balance gets shields to all schools, something no other school gets, that a 50% balance shield be added to the game. Would it really defeat Balance that much? Hoew many people would get it and use it?


It is ridiculous to say that balance gets "more" blades for balance specific damage after reading what I wrote above. How is it fair for there to be a balance specific shield when there are NO balance specific traps or blades or even a prism? You keep talking about the balance shields to every school. Well, it takes 2 rounds to cast them, they don't cover balance damage, and they are only 50%. In the same two rounds another player can cast an elemental set of shields and a spirit set of shields at 70% and accomplish effectively the same thing (vs. either hydra or chimera). Where's the imbalance and need for a balance specific 50% shield?


How exactly is it ridiculous? You can train for 1 training point, a school specific shield of 80% to any school except balance.

Since there is no convert, and we are not asking for an 80% shield, I don't see how a 50% school specific shield is ridiculous...

Survivor
Oct 10, 2010
29
Lots of opinion flying about here.

Question, do any of the rest of you actually play a balance mage before you propose these things, or are you simply looking at all available spells and making a decision?

Everytime a spell gets added in what ever manner, or is changed, it ripples though out the game changing tactics and game play. How it is played is most important, not what it can potentially do, or if it is available.

For you storm players, how often do you carry disarm? Not often I bet. Can you time removing that charm before he uses it, and is the loss of one pip over potential damage worth it?

For you myth players, how often do you carry shatter storm over earthquake? Rarely, why would you? For one more pip you do damage, get all charms, and hit all opponents.

For fire, triage? Except from yourself do you really have to worry about dot spells? Even mobs lean more towards single massive hit spells.

Need I go on?

But all these spells in specific situations are what is called for.

What has traditionally been the hardest school opponent for any school to deal with? There own. For six out of the seven schools that meant waiting around for your conversions to show up, then casting the attack. Balance didn't have any such option, till recently, except to use a spirit school at a loss of efficiency.

Once balance had a hey day in the arena, then everyone learned that weakness ruins balance's day. Funny how weakness is now on the must learn for pvp list. Yes, it has a 70% boost. They also have the fewest boosts, and the most easily thwarted "blades". Decent compensation I think.

Yes, balance can hit all schools. So? A balance shield isn't going to "fix" this, tell you what, go back to celestia, fight a balance shark, cast a tower shield and watch the damage totals as you go through the hydra strikes. And, did you not see that hydra attack coming from a mile away? Is not the attacks of hydra and chimera split between three school making it ridiculously easy to ward at least some of it? Did not getting a decent damage out put from that spell cost seven pips, something no other school has to pay for? Elemental blades cost a pip, storm blade is free. Sure, balance blade is free, and it is one of the weakest blades out there.

Balance is already the most difficult to master, as it should be. But would adding a shield to balance specific add a dimension to game play, or just needlessly complicate/hurt the school?

Play with your friends, and everytime you go against a balance boss. Ask your self "How would a balance mage fair if this boss cast a balance only shield here?" "Would the balance mage be forced to adjust tactics and expand as a player or would it needlessly ruin play."

That, and only that last question, I propose, is the only true
rule of thumb for if such and such spell is needed or not.

Armiger
May 10, 2010
2080
archmage987 wrote:
Lots of opinion flying about here.

Question, do any of the rest of you actually play a balance mage before you propose these things, or are you simply looking at all available spells and making a decision?


I have had 2 Legendary Balance Wizards. Balance was by far too overpowered and I knew it. So, I deleted them both. Now, while training a cool pet, I got balance it, sharp shot, spell proof, and spritely. A very good balance accuracy pet. So, I decided to make a new Balance Wizard. But yes, I in fact, know all the pro's and con's of Balance.

Everytime a spell gets added in what ever manner, or is changed, it ripples though out the game changing tactics and game play. How it is played is most important, not what it can potentially do, or if it is available.

As always, changes have effects on the game, that is nothing new. Why is it ok for changes to happen to other schools, but not for Balance?

For you storm players, how often do you carry disarm? Not often I bet. Can you time removing that charm before he uses it, and is the loss of one pip over potential damage worth it?


Disarm, should be in fact, a 0 pip spell. If it was, it would be worth storm using this spell, but in fact, using a pip to remove a blade and wasting that time and pips is not as beneficial for storm.

For you myth players, how often do you carry shatter storm over earthquake? Rarely, why would you? For one more pip you do damage, get all charms, and hit all opponents.

Actually, fyi, shatter is a 3 pip spell and earthquake is a 6 pip spell. The use of these spells vary on how many oppenents you have. If vs a multiplayer, myth would use Earthquake over shatter most of the time. However, if several shields were in place and several traps were placed, shatter would be more effective, especially if a friend is attacking that same round!

For fire, triage? Except from yourself do you really have to worry about dot spells? Even mobs lean more towards single massive hit spells.

Triage is not as widely used as you might think, especially not in PvP. It is nice to have, but does not always help you, or save you.

Need I go on?

Please do, I find this fascinating!

But all these spells in specific situations are what is called for.

What has traditionally been the hardest school opponent for any school to deal with? There own. For six out of the seven schools that meant waiting around for your conversions to show up, then casting the attack. Balance didn't have any such option, till recently, except to use a spirit school at a loss of efficiency.


Really? What is spectral blast and hydra?


Once balance had a hey day in the arena, then everyone learned that weakness ruins balance's day. Funny how weakness is now on the must learn for pvp list. Yes, it has a 70% boost. They also have the fewest boosts, and the most easily thwarted "blades". Decent compensation I think.

As I stated before, balance has a balance blade 25% and bladestorm 20% how is that less of a boost than most schools? Balance can also learn feint, have feint amulet, treasure feint, pet feint. balance blade, treasure balance blade, equipment balance blade, hex, treasure hex, dragonblade.

Oh, and for that weakness, I do believe there is a treasure card called, remove charm. It is a storm treasure card, but if memory serves me correctly, it can remove those pesky weakness charms! Now, add all those boosts I just gave you, and put a 14 pip Judgment spell with colossal boost and vengeance boost with Balances Critical chance. What can live?
Oh, and, just so you know, fine, you can use the treasure tower shield, the tower shield and a pet tower shield.

Now, how many possible ways can you shield a storm attack? 2 different possible dual storm shields of 70%, an 80% storm shield, a treasure card 90% storm shield, treasure card dual storm shields, and all of those possible tower shields.

And you want to complain about a simple 50% Balance school only shield?

Yes, balance can hit all schools. So? A balance shield isn't going to "fix" this, tell you what, go back to celestia, fight a balance shark, cast a tower shield and watch the damage totals as you go through the hydra strikes. And, did you not see that hydra attack coming from a mile away? Is not the attacks of hydra and chimera split between three school making it ridiculously easy to ward at least some of it? Did not getting a decent damage out put from that spell cost seven pips, something no other school has to pay for? Elemental blades cost a pip, storm blade is free. Sure, balance blade is free, and it is one of the weakest blades out there.


First of all, Balance sharks do not get the Boosts or Critical chances that a Balance Player has! Secondly, Most start with more power pip chance than players do. And I did say that Balance's elemental and spiritual shields should be allowed to be trained by all schools.

Now, however, if those sharks had the Boosts of an actual Balance Player at 70% and the critical points, with their starting pips, and any attack can remove those tower shields, would you not then in fact want a balance shield? And I already covered the Blades, not sure how you get 2 blades weaker than one blade, but ok.

Balance is already the most difficult to master, as it should be. But would adding a shield to balance specific add a dimension to game play, or just needlessly complicate/hurt the school?


Balance is actually one of the easiest schools to play. Any school is only as difficult to master as you make it to be.

Play with your friends, and everytime you go against a balance boss. Ask your self "How would a balance mage fair if this boss cast a balance only shield here?" "Would the balance mage be forced to adjust tactics and expand as a player or would it needlessly ruin play."


Balance Bosses generally have huge resistance to Balance. Take Luska for instance. Try using Judgment on luska and then using Chimera or Hydra on Luska, major difference. However, if you are facing player vs player, which is where this post is located, Players do not automatically resist as much as Luska does.

That, and only that last question, I propose, is the only true
rule of thumb for if such and such spell is needed or not.


I have thoroughly countered every single one of your objections and concerns. I have shown perfectly clear how and why a 50% Balance shield would be Balanced in the game.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1633
RosamaryH wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:


First of all, you don't know that most people don't get mastery amulets for 1 spell! Shatter WILL cost 6 pips to me NO MATTER WHAT. It's 3 pips, meaning 6 pips because my power pip chance is nearly 100%. All schools get boosts. There are such things called traps.

You have many facts wrong. Balance gets 3 boosts, while many schools get 4-5. Here you go:


Balance gets 3 boosts? Since when? Hmm, let's look closely at this.

Balance Blade, Bladestorm, Hex, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap, Spiritual Blade, Spiritual Trap.

Remember, Elemental blades and traps and Spiritual blades and traps are Balance's, not any other schools. They cost a training point for other schools to learn them.


Fire: Fireblade, Fire Trap, Fuel, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap, Wyldfire.
Storm: Stormblade, Storm Trap, Darkwind, Windstorm, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap.
Ice: Iceblade, Ice Trap, Balefrost, Elemental Blade, Elemental Trap.
Death: Deathblade, Death Trap, Curse, Feint, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Life: Lifeblade, Life Trap, Forest Lord pet trap, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Myth: Mythblade, Myth Trap, Time of Legend, Spirit Blade, Spirit Trap.
Balance: Balanceblade, Bladestorm, Hex.

See how when Balance showa up, the list is A WHOLE LOT SMALLER then all the others, even if I excluded Spirit/Elemental Blade/Trap.


Fire: Fire Blade, trap, wyldfire, fuel = 4
Ice: Ice Blade, trap, Balefrost = 3
Storm: Storm Blade, trap, Darkwind, Windstorm, Supercharge = 5
Myth: Myth Blade, trap, Time of legend = 3
Death: Death Blade, trap, curse, feint, dark pact = 5
Life: Life Blade, trap = 2

Now, if you want to add Elemental blades and traps to their numbers, you can add the numbers of their schools traps to Balance, since balance has attacks that work for Life, Death, Myth, Storm, Fire, and Ice!

So, math shows correctly, that Balance has the most blades and traps in the game, is that not correct?


All schools get shields lol. Have you not forgotten what level 8 gives?
Fire: Glacial Shield, Fire Shield-Hydra, Spectral Blast gone
Storm: Thermic Shield, Storm Shield-Hydra,Sepctral Blast gone
Ice: Volcanic Shield, Ice Shield-Hydra,Spectral Blast gone
Tower Shield, Legion Shield-Judgement, Sandstorm, Locust Swarm, Ra, Scarab, Scorpion gone.
Frost Armor, Ice Armor-All spells gone.
Death: Dream Shield, Death Shield-Chimera gone.
Plague, Virulent Plague-All spells gone.
Life: Legend Shield, Life Shield-Chimera gone.
Spirit Armor, Rebirth Armor-All spells weakened.
Myth:Ether Shield, Myth Shield-Chimera gone.

Other schools get -70% and also -80%. All Balance gets is -50% shields. Weakness is -25%.


Well, considering that Balance does not get a school shield, it should not get a 70% shield to all schools, how would that be fair?

And, a 50% shield and a -25% weakness does huge amounts of protection, more than a 70% shield would.


A critical and no critical block could cover for the Elemental/Spirit Shields.

Balance is already VERY blockable while when other schools face balance, their spells are only halved, and that's IF the person decides to be defensive. If you're having trouble against Balance, that's your problem. Deal with how each school plays, that's just like complaining about Life's heals or Storm's damage or even Ice's resist! Ice can block a whole lot better then Balance, and Ice can still hit very high amounts of damage.


How exactly do you figure this? a fire elf, or death beetle, for 1 or 2 pips can eat 4 tower shields, which happens to be, the only shield that protects from Balance spells!


Fire and Myth have more resist then Balance and yet Fire and Myth hit a lot higher damage. Think before you complain about something, figure out your own strategy, don't just go on crying over something that's going to completely destroy a school.


Balance has 67% damage boost or more, while Fire and Myth are in the 50% damage boost range, how are they doing higher damage exactly?

I know, there is a come back for: If you say that other schools get blocked against Balance by 50%, then Balance should get blocked by 50% too! Well, Balance gets blocked by 70-80%!


How is Balance being Blocked by 70-80%? There is no Balance shield, now, if you sure Hydra, Elemental Blast, or Chimera, this is possible, however, one attack will not be blocked at all. And, you have the option of which spell to use, so if Elemental Shields are present, you can use Chimera, while if Spiritual shields are present, you can use Hydra, can any other schools do that and get the boost?

Deal with how Balance is: Very defensive, but also blocked easily.


Again, you have yet to prove how Balance is very defensive and blocked easily!

If the Balance Shield was created, it should be 25%.

Let me count how many spells can already fully block/weaken balance spells:
Glacial Shield
Elemental Shield
Spirit Shield
Thermic Shield
Volcanic Shield
Legend Shield
Weakness
Dream shield
Spirit Armor
Rebirth Armor
Tower Shield
Legion Shield
Plague
Virulent Plague
Fire Shield
Storm Shield
Ice Shield
Death Shield
Life Shield
Myth Shield
Frost Armor
Ice Armor
Power Nova
X3 because of amulets and treasure cards. 23 NORMAL spells can block Balance. So: 23x3=69. 69 spells can block Balance spells! TOO MANY! FAR TOO MANY! Now, 70 because of Balance Shield. And then 72 because of amulet and treasure cards. WOW. Balance only gets about:
Elemental Shield
Spirit Shield
Weakness
Power Nova
X3 because of treasure cards and amulets. 4x3=12. 12 vs. 72. What do you think wins? All other schools, exactly. And they're all much higher defenses then Balance, so remember this: There are 72 ways to block Balance, and only 12 ways for Balance to block other schools.


Actually, Balance can train any other schools, to get these 70% shields also, or even use a training point on each school specifically, gaining an 80% shield to each school, with their elemental and spiritual shields, also always allowing them to block damage from a spell!

However, the only way to block, say the Judgement spell, is by a towershield, which can be removed by any attack or spell. Like I said, a death beetle will remove 4 tower shields for 1 pip. Without the use of mastery amulet!

So, how can all of Balance's spells be blocked again?


Ok, you really didn't get the part when I listed Balance's boosts. Those were boosts for Balance spells specifically because the Balance Shield blocks Balance spells. Also, can you please tell me how to quote some of the person's post instead of all.

I never said or even brought up the idea or was even close to bringing up the idea that Balance should get a 70% shield to all schools.

Balance gets the most blades for their other spells, but any shield can block them. Many wizards have elemental as main school and spiritual as second, even reversed. So, they can easily block Balance's spells. I never use Judgement unless it's a finisher and I don't want to start spamming it. No Balance wizard at level 70 uses it without getting the damage decreased.

A 50% shield and Weakness does block more then 70-80%, I know, but chances are that a Balance wizard would just find one at a time. Or, they'd be willing to waste a round for a decrease of their opponent's damage.

Death Beetle isn't a DoT, so it wouldn't break 4 Tower Shields. Trust me, I have the pet and it's at ancient, so it gives me the spell. Also, I wouldn't waste 4 pips on a Fire Elf! 2 Power Pips=4. Also, I'm not about to waste 20$ on a Fire mastery amulet for a Fire Elf

Wow. I'm not kidding, you don't know how Balance is easily blocked? I posted about 2 posts with the reasons! Any shield effects ANY of Balance's spells!

No, Balance wizards are actually starting to have 63% damage boost. And also, Fire and Myth have spells that hit 300 damage stronger then Chimera, so a 13% damage boost wouldn't put account for making Chimera do more then their spells.

I'm not going to waste my money to buy my training points back, for an 80% shield! I'm not a money-waster. I don't want to pay real money just to be able to block schools even more. Also, I spend my training points on Astral spells, not the shields to take up 8 spaces in my deck.

Too many people have forgotten about Legion Shield. Don't keep on repeating Tower Shield is the only spell! You have your facts wrong! Reassure then to make sure you have them right! I'll show you spells that can block Judgement already:
Weakness
Tower Shield
Legion Shield
Plague
Virulent Plague
Power Nova Weakness

6! Times 3 because of treasure cards and amulets:18! Already 18 ways to block Judgement.

Again, for the trillionth time, not every Balance wizard is a Judge-Spammer. I use elemental and spirit spells, period. Many people use elemental and spirit spells more on a Balance wizard, period. Many lower levels don't even have second schools on a Balance wizard, so the shield would annihilate them, period.

Really, think about it. Already 69 ways to block a Balance spell, and yet you want more. Wow. You just can't get enough.

People are only complaining about a Balance Shield because they don't have any strategy to defeat a Balance wizard. Wizard101 isn't only about blade blade trap trap attack attack. Get a strategy, or cry and whine for a spell that doesn't take any strategy to defeat a spell.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1633