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Storytelling Quality Down the Drain

AuthorMessage
Geographer
Nov 22, 2015
859
In the First Arc, the story was more interesting - it could get you excited about things, but now, in the Second Arc, it has gone down the drain. Avalon wasn't bad, though. Maybe in the coming worlds the storytelling quality could be increased? It was good in the First Arc.

Also, in the First Arc, the villain is cliche, but better then the Second and Third Arc villains: "Let's destroy the spiral!" That's a really overused cliche. I know you can come up with something better then that, KingsIsle.

Astrologist
Dec 16, 2009
1035
I disagree- I found the storytelling in the Second Arc way more complex and exciting. Khyrsalis's story is a complicated masterpiece and I loved every minute of it.

Squire
Oct 29, 2011
586
I like the second arc story a lot. The third arc story is also pretty decent so far.

Delver
Jan 17, 2013
251
Fable Finder on Sep 20, 2016 wrote:
In the First Arc, the story was more interesting - it could get you excited about things, but now, in the Second Arc, it has gone down the drain. Avalon wasn't bad, though. Maybe in the coming worlds the storytelling quality could be increased? It was good in the First Arc.

Also, in the First Arc, the villain is cliche, but better then the Second and Third Arc villains: "Let's destroy the spiral!" That's a really overused cliche. I know you can come up with something better then that, KingsIsle.
I guess our opinions on the story vary.

I found the first arc story incredibly boring, but the second arc much more interesting and engaging. The combat also got more intense and strategic, and I found it especially satisfying questing through Part 2 when it was released to see how the arc concluded.

I don't know that much about the overall third arc story, but I really disliked the story in Polaris. Hopefully the third arc story is filled with twists and turns, and hopefully the story quality improves with Mirage.

Survivor
Feb 29, 2012
14
Well you just said malistaire didn't want to destroy the spiral and none of them really wanted to destroy the spiral. They wanted to take control of the spiral. And you might not know what's gonna happen after polaris. Even though it's more than likely going to be about old cob and another one of his children.

Delver
Oct 18, 2009
276
I don't think its down the drain, I think its simply shifted and the players have changed. Now a days most players will just spacebar through the text because they want to level so they can get the sparkiest new gear and go back to their pvp circles. A story can only be interesting if you read it though I'll admit I got irritated with original Azteca because it felt so grindy but if you ignore the grinding it was still a fairly interesting idea. Yes the story of ruling the world, and destroying the world is over done, but so is the story doing stupid dangerous (occasionally evil) things for love, there are only so many ways to spin these ideas.

These "antagonist plots" been around since the beginning of recorded history and they've been spun every which possible way

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4162
I find the opposite to be true. The first arc was simplistic and childish, the second and third arcs involve much more complex storytelling.

Geographer
Nov 22, 2015
859
Eric Stormbringer on Sep 20, 2016 wrote:
I disagree- I found the storytelling in the Second Arc way more complex and exciting. Khyrsalis's story is a complicated masterpiece and I loved every minute of it.
I'm in Azteca right now, I'll see what Khyrsalis is like soon.

Geographer
Nov 22, 2015
859
FusionSun on Sep 20, 2016 wrote:
I guess our opinions on the story vary.

I found the first arc story incredibly boring, but the second arc much more interesting and engaging. The combat also got more intense and strategic, and I found it especially satisfying questing through Part 2 when it was released to see how the arc concluded.

I don't know that much about the overall third arc story, but I really disliked the story in Polaris. Hopefully the third arc story is filled with twists and turns, and hopefully the story quality improves with Mirage.
It's also the world lore that is better.

The Second Arc worlds are largely undeveloped. In Celestia, all you know about it is that it's a lost world with Marleybone explorers. In Zafaria, all you know is that it's a lost world with tribes. In Azteca, all you know about it is that it's a lost world with tribes. Avalon isn't that bad though.

Hmm, I see some trends going on here. Is Khyrsalis a lost world too? Does it have tribes?

Also, in the Second Arc worlds, the only story you have is "Do this for x reason". In MooShu, there's a plotline about convincing a samurai to be a monk for example.

Geographer
Nov 22, 2015
859
Tmali on Sep 21, 2016 wrote:
Well you just said malistaire didn't want to destroy the spiral and none of them really wanted to destroy the spiral. They wanted to take control of the spiral. And you might not know what's gonna happen after polaris. Even though it's more than likely going to be about old cob and another one of his children.
Controlling the world is pretty much as cliche as destroying it.

Astrologist
Dec 16, 2009
1035
Fable Finder on Sep 22, 2016 wrote:
It's also the world lore that is better.

The Second Arc worlds are largely undeveloped. In Celestia, all you know about it is that it's a lost world with Marleybone explorers. In Zafaria, all you know is that it's a lost world with tribes. In Azteca, all you know about it is that it's a lost world with tribes. Avalon isn't that bad though.

Hmm, I see some trends going on here. Is Khyrsalis a lost world too? Does it have tribes?

Also, in the Second Arc worlds, the only story you have is "Do this for x reason". In MooShu, there's a plotline about convincing a samurai to be a monk for example.
The only lost world in that list is Azteca. Celestia is a ruined world similar to Dragonspyre where Morganthe finally mastered the use of astral magics.

Zafaria isn't a lost world at all, in fact the entire reason we are there is to find a class of exchange students.

Finally, Azteca is a lost world that is thought to have been destroyed 10 years prior to the antagonist reaching there. The storyline in Azteca is complex and nuanced but often gets lost in translation due to the spike in difficulty.

Finally, Khyrsalis is not a lost world- it is the seat of Morganthe's power that she deliberately attempted to cut off from the rest of the spiral. I would say more but I want you to experience the storyline for yourself.

For a fun breakdown of some of the second arc worlds I wrote a story thread here a few years back: Story Thread.

Delver
Jan 17, 2013
251
Fable Finder on Sep 22, 2016 wrote:
It's also the world lore that is better.

The Second Arc worlds are largely undeveloped. In Celestia, all you know about it is that it's a lost world with Marleybone explorers. In Zafaria, all you know is that it's a lost world with tribes. In Azteca, all you know about it is that it's a lost world with tribes. Avalon isn't that bad though.

Hmm, I see some trends going on here. Is Khyrsalis a lost world too? Does it have tribes?

Also, in the Second Arc worlds, the only story you have is "Do this for x reason". In MooShu, there's a plotline about convincing a samurai to be a monk for example.
I found the second arc worlds way more developed than the first, and there was a sense of urgency and the foreshadowing of something dire to come.

In Celestia, yes, we know it's a lost world with Marleybone explorers, but there's also the fascination of discovering the secrets of Astral magic, something that not many people knew about at the time.

In Zafaria, you had to rescue the missing students, and to also prevent Morganthe's henchmen from stealing the golden artifacts from the four tribes. Unfortunately, we were unable to stop her, and she was able to fulfill a line from the prophecy and regain her powers that were buried underneath Mirror Lake.

In Azteca, yes, it was also a lost world, but you had to stop Morganthe from finding Huracan and fulfilling two more lines of the prophecy. Morganthe was also raiding the Pyramids of Azteca, and she needed Malistaire's assistance to capture the Lords of Night, so she could transport them to her Shadow Palace in Khrysalis, where she later forced and tortured them to teach her the Song of Creation. Wizards also had to try to find a way to stop Xibalba from crashing into the world, but Morganthe made sure it was unstoppable by having her forces delay us down below. Morganthe needed the Astral Magic that she stole in Celestia, so she could use it later on Xibalba.

Khrysalis isn't really lost, it's just been tightly locked down ever since Morganthe came to power there. There are enslaved populations there, and we have to help free them from Morganthe's tyranny and Warlords, also while fighting our way to the Shadow Palace to free the Lords of Night and to stop Morganthe from learning the Song of Creation. Along the way, to weaken Morganthe's grip on the land, we also have to restore the Astral Relics and destroy the corruption that her Shadow Magic did on them.

How is this undeveloped again?

Historian
Nov 28, 2010
614
I don't think there's been a drop in quality in the storytelling. The only thing I've found is that the more time battles take, the less time I spend immersing myself in the story. In Wizard City I could complete 20 quests in an hour. In Khrysalis I can complete 4 or 5 quests in an hour.

After completing Daily Assignments with 12 wizards, I sometimes only have an hour to invest in questing. So when I'm only getting 4 or 5 quests done in a day, I'm either going to a) rush through the NPC dialogue and not pay close attention, or b) the story is going to become very fragmented and it's going to be a challenge to piece everything together if I do pay attention.

Maybe I'm the only one that has been affected this way, but I believe that's why the storytelling may not seem as good. It has less to do with the storytelling, and more to do with the distractions in between.

That's where Polaris was a welcome relief. Street mobs don't take as long so it feels like you're going places. I just wish all of my wizards were there right now. Unfortunately 8 of them are still slugging their way through Khrysalis. It feels like an endless nightmare sometimes.

Astrologist
Dec 16, 2009
1035
High Five Ghost on Sep 23, 2016 wrote:
I don't think there's been a drop in quality in the storytelling. The only thing I've found is that the more time battles take, the less time I spend immersing myself in the story. In Wizard City I could complete 20 quests in an hour. In Khrysalis I can complete 4 or 5 quests in an hour.

After completing Daily Assignments with 12 wizards, I sometimes only have an hour to invest in questing. So when I'm only getting 4 or 5 quests done in a day, I'm either going to a) rush through the NPC dialogue and not pay close attention, or b) the story is going to become very fragmented and it's going to be a challenge to piece everything together if I do pay attention.

Maybe I'm the only one that has been affected this way, but I believe that's why the storytelling may not seem as good. It has less to do with the storytelling, and more to do with the distractions in between.

That's where Polaris was a welcome relief. Street mobs don't take as long so it feels like you're going places. I just wish all of my wizards were there right now. Unfortunately 8 of them are still slugging their way through Khrysalis. It feels like an endless nightmare sometimes.
I agree that a lot of people lose touch of the storyline as battles become more time-consuming/difficult.

-In Celestia people lost touch with that story due to the difficulty spike bought in with the new Crit/Block System(debatably fixed)

-In Zafaria people lost touch with that story due to the painful defeat and collect quests(now fixed)

-In Azteca people lost touch with that story due to the huge difficulty spike(now fixed)

-In Khyrsalis people lose touch with the story because of the length. Initially, Khyrsalis was 2 separate world releases. However, players now questing will immediately jump into part 2 with no intermediary period. This makes KH seem like one very very long world when in fact it was designed as 2(remains unchanged but led to the new questing style seen in Polaris)

Hopefully, KI's recent changes and upgrades can get people excited for the story once again.

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4162
Eric Stormbringer on Sep 24, 2016 wrote:
I agree that a lot of people lose touch of the storyline as battles become more time-consuming/difficult.

-In Celestia people lost touch with that story due to the difficulty spike bought in with the new Crit/Block System(debatably fixed)

-In Zafaria people lost touch with that story due to the painful defeat and collect quests(now fixed)

-In Azteca people lost touch with that story due to the huge difficulty spike(now fixed)

-In Khyrsalis people lose touch with the story because of the length. Initially, Khyrsalis was 2 separate world releases. However, players now questing will immediately jump into part 2 with no intermediary period. This makes KH seem like one very very long world when in fact it was designed as 2(remains unchanged but led to the new questing style seen in Polaris)

Hopefully, KI's recent changes and upgrades can get people excited for the story once again.
Celestia still has a bit of disconnect because of the lowered level requirement and difficulty, in my opinion. After my first couple wizards, I have never run straight through it. It's always do Celestia to Floating Lands for crafting, then Wintertusk to level up and get gear, then back to Celestia. Before the drop in level the story was less broken for me because I HAD to do Wintertusk before Celestia to level up enough to start Celestia, so I already finished Wintertusk before starting. The addition of 4 dungeons, Aquila and Darkmoor have also had a part in breaking up storyline questing because they are level based and outside the storyline.

Survivor
Dec 18, 2010
4
Since it takes me a while to finish a world I often forget what the story-line is when I pick up where I left off the week before. It would be great to have a story-line or lore tab that updates with your questing. This way if I have to go away from the game for a month, when I come back I can read what's in that tab and remember what's happened recently. Just a thought since not remembering the lore can contribute to thinking there's bad story telling.

Astrologist
Feb 28, 2014
1113
I like all 3 Arcs. The Storyline does have it's ups and downs. Overall it does get better for my interests

Astrologist
Feb 28, 2014
1113
Eric Stormbringer on Sep 24, 2016 wrote:
I agree that a lot of people lose touch of the storyline as battles become more time-consuming/difficult.

-In Celestia people lost touch with that story due to the difficulty spike bought in with the new Crit/Block System(debatably fixed)

-In Zafaria people lost touch with that story due to the painful defeat and collect quests(now fixed)

-In Azteca people lost touch with that story due to the huge difficulty spike(now fixed)

-In Khyrsalis people lose touch with the story because of the length. Initially, Khyrsalis was 2 separate world releases. However, players now questing will immediately jump into part 2 with no intermediary period. This makes KH seem like one very very long world when in fact it was designed as 2(remains unchanged but led to the new questing style seen in Polaris)

Hopefully, KI's recent changes and upgrades can get people excited for the story once again.
I agree with you on all this things. Specially when I heard people lost interest in playing as battles become more difficult as the storyline progresses. Those players think the game cheats too much; mostly in Khyrsalis and side dungeons. I know it's all about timing and strategy but lot a people don't see it that way. All they see are creatures attacking 2-3 times around and cast spells without the right pips requirement which they call that cheating. Almost everyone one of my friends who played this game left because they don't see how that kind of cheating is strategy. I agree Khyrsalis was quite long but fun