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Team up feature

2
AuthorMessage
Champion
May 10, 2013
483
CoffeeGodEddy on Jun 26, 2014 wrote:
Hello, I would like to propose a revision of the "Team Up" feature by giving some possible ideas.

After seeing multiple unqualified people go into Loremaster and other dungeons to farm, I would like to request "Team Up" to be turned off for them. This does not mean they cannot enter via sigil, but so that people who are not qualified (I.e. within 5 levels of the appropriate level for the world) cannot enter unless using the sigil. This is to prevent lack of participation or skill as many people have resolved themselves to wear PvP gear to survive, which takes all their mana away. Multiple players I've talked to agree with me that it is not only annoying, but selfish to allow farming by these types of players because they did not take the time to level like we all did or do not want to participate. I'm sure there is more than one plausible solution to this minor problem and am open to suggestions and comments that may further this thread.

Thank you.
If KI wanted to restrict the Loremaster to levels 30+, they should have done that.

If the sigil is lighted up, they are qualified.

@Oran of Urz:
I completely disagree with you. I don't think a level 5 would rather glitch into Tartarus and solo it. No, no one in the right minds would do that.

@Mr. Robot (I can't say your name for some reason):
Absolutely correct, good speech. I agree with that, but balance 45-59 might have trouble.
PVP Warlords need Lore Spells.

Best spell for every school:
Fire: Krampus
Ice: Winter Moon
Storm: Catalan
Myth: Ninja Pigs
Life: Luminious Weaver
Death: Deer Knight
Balance: All of them are fantastic.

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4117
CoffeeGodEddy on Jul 1, 2014 wrote:
In response to low level sympathizers...

You can't let a low level "go" by letting the boss KO him/her. He/She could easily join the battle one turn later, thus making the boss target the next player. He/She could also shield spam consistently throughout the entire battle. I've seen this happen on multiple occasions.

I've only seen one or two low levels actually blade someone else and not shield or heal (if they are not wearing pvp gear and have mana to heal). Also, the likely hood of having a low level blade someone of the correct school is 1 in 7.

PvP gear is also an issue. If someone is selfish enough to wear PvP gear in a high level dungeon, expecting a free ride, what makes you think they are going to be a "team player" and blade someone other than shield themself?

Low levels do not need the spells in Loremaster. The spells are rank 4-5. One usually gets those rank spells in their 30s and 40s, not there 10s and 20s.
Low levels need them just as much as or even more than higher levels. The spells were designed for PvP mainly. I've run Loremaster 1000's of times with low level players and usually after one run they change cards to blade or trap for me because they see it works quicker and are happy to help. Yes there are a few of those moochers who just sit and pass because they don't want XP to accidentally level them up.

Squire
Jun 19, 2010
504
I personally don't care what level a player is. If you can access the sigil; you can access the dungeon. If you can handle the area or dungeon; put on your big wizard pants and bring everything you've got to help our team win!

Higher level players may be more effective and bring greater damage to defeat Loremaster over lower level wizards.

However, what really tweaks me the wrong way are players who ask and demand your help in areas and dungeons they can't handle, who either flee and don't come back, or never lift a finger to help during the battle.

Armiger
Mar 18, 2009
2381
CoffeeGodEddy on Jul 1, 2014 wrote:
In Response to Oran of Urz...

"Your suggestion also indicates that anyone above level 50 would not be allowed Team Up assistance into Loremaster either. Most level 55 Balance wizards will have trouble soloing in this dungeon (or at least take longer) and I suspect remaining schools would like to have more teammates (since faster battles equals increased spell drops)."

No where in my post did I mention that a player must be lvl 50 or higher to enter. I said a player within 5 levels of the zone should be allowed to use the Team Up feature. Dragonspyre is upper 30s+ zone. Getting to the Antheneum is by no means hard or requires a lot of leveling since it's one of the very first areas. Also, not everyone rolls Balance as there are 7 schools to choose from. If that lvl 55 Balance wizard is having trouble soloing, he should use the Team Up feature to be paired with other Qualified players.

"Restricting Team Up only negates the feature itself (making it useless). Every day, someone posts on these forums that even with Team Up (at odd hours) they can't get other players to join. This suggestion will only decrease those odds (since it will only group players within 5 levels and will even restrict higher level assistance from those who might be farming). Sounds like your issue is less about Team Up and more about KI's decision to allow all levels for Loremaster."

If you have every tried using Team Up on the Loremaster, you would realize that it works within minutes, if not seconds of a full 4 person group, mind you. Is there already a lack of use by the Team Up too? Yes, but that's for desolate zones. High traffic areas such as Loremaster do not apply to this.

"...but the Loremaster fight is designed for all levels (just like the possible reward spells."

This is not true. Anyone can look up the possible rewards from Loremaster and see that gear dropped is 45+. The spells also dropped are all rank 4+ with the majority being rank 5 spells. There is no need for someone in the early stages of Krokotopia, Marleybone, or even stuck in Wizard City to be farming Loremaster for spells. What does a level 15-35 need with rank 5 spells? Am I missing something?

"I would like to request "Team Up" to be turned off for them. This does not mean they cannot enter via sigil, but so that people who are not qualified (I.e. within 5 levels of the appropriate level for the world) cannot enter unless using the sigil."

In a nutshell, what this is saying is that anyone 5 levels below the appropriate level for a world should have to use the sigil, not Team Up.
"No where in my post did I mention that a player must be lvl 50 or higher to enter. I said a player within 5 levels of the zone should be allowed to use the Team Up feature."

No where in my post did I mention that it would require level 50 or higher to enter, either. To repeat my post, "Your suggestion also indicates that anyone above level 50 would not be allowed Team Up assistance into Loremaster either." In other words, level 50 and above would not be able to use Team Up to get groups together to farm faster.

"In a nutshell, what this is saying is that anyone 5 levels below the appropriate level for a world should have to use the sigil, not Team Up."

This is a completely different statement than your original suggestion. Your original suggestion indicated that Team Up would be disabled for anyone not within five levels of the appropriate level. Dragonspyre is a level 45ish world. Your original suggestion would disable Team Up at Loremaster for players over level 50, as well as players below level 40. Your revised suggestion now restricts this to only those levels below the intended level.

"This is not true."

This is not debatable. If it wasn't true, KI would not allow any level player to enter via the sigil (just like Waterworks). Since KI does allow all levels entry into Loremaster (which is located in level 45 world, hence...by design), it is true. Since they can enter via sigil, they should be allowed entry via Team Up. Again, your complaint to KI should be about all levels entering the dungeon...not Team Up. Even your response regarding gear dropped supports this.

"Is there already a lack of use by the Team Up too? Yes, but that's for desolate zones. High traffic areas such as Loremaster do not apply to this."

Your suggestion specifically mentions applying this feature to other dungeons. To quote your post, "After seeing multiple unqualified people go into Loremaster and other dungeons to farm, I would like to request "Team Up" to be turned off for them." Do you now mean only high traffic dungeons? What qualifies as high traffic? Will the rest of us agree with that qualification?

In a nut shell from my perspective, Team Up doesn't require any changes, sounds like you need changes to the qualifications to enter the Loremaster sigil.

Armiger
Mar 18, 2009
2381
PlayHard101 on Jul 2, 2014 wrote:
If KI wanted to restrict the Loremaster to levels 30+, they should have done that.

If the sigil is lighted up, they are qualified.

@Oran of Urz:
I completely disagree with you. I don't think a level 5 would rather glitch into Tartarus and solo it. No, no one in the right minds would do that.

@Mr. Robot (I can't say your name for some reason):
Absolutely correct, good speech. I agree with that, but balance 45-59 might have trouble.
PVP Warlords need Lore Spells.

Best spell for every school:
Fire: Krampus
Ice: Winter Moon
Storm: Catalan
Myth: Ninja Pigs
Life: Luminious Weaver
Death: Deer Knight
Balance: All of them are fantastic.
PlayHard101,

I have no idea what you are referring to. I didn't mention anything about glitching, level 5s, or Tartarus.

KI allows level 5 players to start the quest and enter Loremaster dungeon via sigil (they just need a lift into Dragonspyre). My comment is that if a player is allowed to enter a dungeon via sigil, then they should be allowed to use Team Up, as well. The OP's suggestion was to change Team Up (in effect to this one dungeon) at the expense of how Team Up was designed overall. Team Up doesn't group up similar levels, it groups all players that are qualified for that dungeon to increase the chances of actually getting a group.

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2926
My only problem with the team up feature is the multilevel dungeons (ie: Mt. Olympus, Atlantea, Loremaster), because my chances of getting teamed up with people of my own level are slim to none.

I once used team up for loremaster. I am level 100, and I ended up in a group of level 40s. They thought I was the coolest thing ever... but I am balance, so it was hard enough. But I basically wound up carrying them: tanking, healing, and the only one doing any damage.

Same with Olympus. If I want to farm gladiator for my level 90 elite gear, who's to say I won't end up with a group of level 30s? I hope KI will fix this, so we can be paired with people our own level for these instances.

-von

Survivor
Feb 28, 2009
16
Oran of Urz on Jul 3, 2014 wrote:
PlayHard101,

I have no idea what you are referring to. I didn't mention anything about glitching, level 5s, or Tartarus.

KI allows level 5 players to start the quest and enter Loremaster dungeon via sigil (they just need a lift into Dragonspyre). My comment is that if a player is allowed to enter a dungeon via sigil, then they should be allowed to use Team Up, as well. The OP's suggestion was to change Team Up (in effect to this one dungeon) at the expense of how Team Up was designed overall. Team Up doesn't group up similar levels, it groups all players that are qualified for that dungeon to increase the chances of actually getting a group.
Do realize I want this revision to affect all dungeons in the future and not just Loremaster. If they could customize the feature so it's a win/win for everyone, then great.

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4117
CoffeeGodEddy on Jul 15, 2014 wrote:
Do realize I want this revision to affect all dungeons in the future and not just Loremaster. If they could customize the feature so it's a win/win for everyone, then great.
You do realize there ARE no other dungeons that would be affected by this "idea". Loremaster is the only dungeon that allows players who have not made it to that world to enter the sigil. It is a dungeon meant for all levels PERIOD, end of story. This makes your suggestion moot. The dungeon was made to allow everyone.

Survivor
Feb 28, 2009
16
seethe42 on Jul 15, 2014 wrote:
You do realize there ARE no other dungeons that would be affected by this "idea". Loremaster is the only dungeon that allows players who have not made it to that world to enter the sigil. It is a dungeon meant for all levels PERIOD, end of story. This makes your suggestion moot. The dungeon was made to allow everyone.
If it was made to allow everyone, how come you have to go through Krok, Marley, and Mooshu before reaching DS? Please explain the point of making everyone go through that just to have a "noob" quest inside the library? The monsters are high ranking. That should be an indicator of around what lvl people should be. Open your eyes. Look at the gear loot, 40+. You have to travel to DS and click the quest finder to even find that quest. The fact you need to be in DS, which means you've beat Mooshu and the worlds before, means that there is an appropriate lvl range.

"It is a dungeon made for certain levels PERIOD, end of story. This makes your comment seethe42 moot."

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4117
CoffeeGodEddy on Jul 15, 2014 wrote:
If it was made to allow everyone, how come you have to go through Krok, Marley, and Mooshu before reaching DS? Please explain the point of making everyone go through that just to have a "noob" quest inside the library? The monsters are high ranking. That should be an indicator of around what lvl people should be. Open your eyes. Look at the gear loot, 40+. You have to travel to DS and click the quest finder to even find that quest. The fact you need to be in DS, which means you've beat Mooshu and the worlds before, means that there is an appropriate lvl range.

"It is a dungeon made for certain levels PERIOD, end of story. This makes your comment seethe42 moot."
Any level player can teleport to any level world. In every other instance, low level players cannot enter dungeon sigils or receive the quests to do so. The Loremaster allows both, therefore it was clearly made to be open to all levels. My comment is not moot at all, it's completely to the point. KI made this one dungeon instance and quest available to anyone who can get there regardless of their level. They released this instance in the same release that they released level 30, 70, 90 level limited dungeons, so it was clearly not an oversight. Anyone who has paid for that area or is a member has access to it.

Survivor
Feb 28, 2009
16
Less wordy edited version of what I'm trying to get across:

If you haven't reached a world yet, turn off dungeons for that person, including sigil and team up.

Let them port in for friends unless KI specifically made it one of those dungeons that you can't port in.

If there is a full team of people and someone leaves to get mana, don't allow port ins from people who weren't part of the dungeon. (Only for 4 person parties)

Allow players to customize Team Up more by school preference, purpose (e.g. farming, full run, etc), and possibly allow players to queue for a dungeon and not have to stand there while it gathers people (like WoW or other MMOs)?

2