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Summer Test Realm Changes

AuthorMessage
Armiger
Jan 11, 2012
2313
Professor Falmea on Jul 2, 2020 wrote:
Wizards,

I wanted to address two of the features from the Summer update that have been getting a lot of feedback.

Character Revamp

Ever since the Wizard City revamp, our characters have stuck out like a sore thumb against the updated game graphics. We’ve wanted to do an update on our characters and character system for quite a while now, and we knew that something so near and dear to you as your own Wizard’s appearance needs the utmost care. The art team is very committed to keeping the charm and personality of your characters intact as we translate over to the new character system. Some broad initial adjustments addressing comments about your Wizard aging have already been made and will be in the next Test Realm update.

We realize you like some of the changes more than others, and we’ll continue to listen and review feedback and make adjustments throughout the next few weeks. We invite you to check out the new, improved Magic Mirror in the Shopping District (for gold now!), and take a look at the new customization options. The faces cannot be exactly the way they were before, but we want to be diligent about coming as close as possible to what you know and love. We cannot take half measures, incorporating some updates and not others, but we want to make sure that the magic remains that made you choose your Wizard’s look in the first place.

Details and descriptions help communicate opinions on visual feedback – the more, the better. What specifically about the looks of your new character do you like or don’t like? Do you like the new, more realistic size of the pupils or the previous cartoon-y pupil eyes better? Do you like that your characters blink? How about the new animations? What options in the magic mirror do you like or don’t like and why?

Shadow Changes

Let’s talk about those shadow spells. One of the reasons that these power reductions are so noticeable is that these spells were hands down the most powerful in the game. In fact, in their current state, they are entirely unbalanced. This has created a growing problem with game balance and power progression, which will only compound in the years to come as the level cap increases. With this initial pass, our goal was to see what these spells would look like balanced only for their pip cost. Of course we realize there are many other considerations, such as the value of pips themselves (both power pips and shadow pips), the pacing of pip generation, time spent in combat, the other tools each school may or may not have, and the overall "feel" of combat. Our systems designers are immersed in Shadow, reviewing and discussing feedback as we speak.

We do want to reassure you of our commitment to PVE – our goal is NOT to significantly increase the difficulty in high level content, so there will likely be other changes needed to bring the game in balance going forward.

Details over generalities are valuable here as well, as we’re looking at a lot of interconnecting game systems. Are there are specific situations where the current reductions in Shadow Spell power would invalidate combat strategies? How will these spell changes make specific bosses unduly difficult?

The common thread here – we’re listening, and constructive feedback with specific examples helps us greatly! Test realm is precisely for this type of feedback and we appreciate those of you who have taken the time to do so. Thanks for being part of our community, and working with us to make sure the Spiral is a magical place for all of us for many years to come!

----

Copying my latest response from in this thread:

"First of all, thank you for the detailed feedback on both fronts! This is the sort of dialogue that helps us make the Spiral awesome.

With the new character system, we had to rebuild the way the character models are constructed (we have to do this often when we update art that's well over a decade old, and the character models are one of the oldest things in game!). So, the answer is that we aim to keep the visuals as close to the original as possible, but we cannot retain the exact old faces, so giving us feedback like, "on this face, I don't like that my pupils are smaller, the shape of my face is not quite as round, and I have smile lines" etc. These specific critiques are super helpful for us to be able to tweak instances where the faces are drastically and unintentionally different than the original.

We'll take a look at all the links regarding feedback and fan edits. I think we're on the same page here, and this will help with the feedback on aging and shading. Definitely check out the next Test Realm update, and we can continue to discuss!

In terms of the Shadow Spells - I'll make sure Matnetic and Ratbeard and crew review all this feedback and wrap it into their ongoing discussions. The very next update won't have any Shadow Changes YET, but we will let the community know what's to come as Test Realm marches on."
Are there are specific situations where the current reductions in Shadow Spell power would invalidate combat strategies? How will these spell changes make specific bosses unduly difficult?

Anybody who farms for anything now will take at least twice as long (at the VERY least). You third to halved the damage output meaning it will take longer to finish the fight, while raising the chance that somebody will die and miss a chance to get their item because they will die the round the boss dies. Now they have to do it again because they missed a turn to get drops

If you add in the RNG system you guys use for drops (not to mention the normal routine of getting the same gear you're using when you want something else), the broken critical system, and now the power nerf, it makes grinding not worth it except for extremely hardcore players.

Let's not forget about the team up process. Even LESS people will be willing to help others when they're farming because if one person messes up, they have to start all over again.

My personal opinion, and others will disagree with me, if you want to nerf the damage output, then we will need quite a few things implemented to counterbalance your update.

Think of it this way, if you nerfed boss health the way you nerfed our spell damage, you would tell us that the fights were too easy. It's time to really start implementing various ideas we've come up with over the years, and implement them sooner rather than later.

It's not just specific fight strategy, it's everything; like you said, everything is intertwined.

Making things more challenging does not mean making them longer. I've mentioned many times how making monsters unable to put a Myth blade on a non myth school companion monster makes the fight harder, because now the Myth school monster has 2 blades instead of 1. They might stack, they might not, but then if they don't, they next damage spell is more effective. No cheat, health buff, or spell nerf is needed for that. One SIMPLE change and already the fights got harder.

Monsters get outrageous health, maxed starting pips, our spells before we do, are 90% stun immune throughout the whole spiral, have cheats, have pets, and even with mastery can learn spells we can't learn if we have mastery. If I had a Storm Mastery Amulet, I can't learn Storm's Glowbug Squall, and NOBODY can learn the Shadow version of it either.

As a side note, will the Shadow versions of the spells get nerfed too? So, both STORM and SHADOW versions will be nerfed?

You can make the game challenging by changing how YOU approach the game instead of forcing US to change our approach and methods.

We've asked for various expansions to Mastery spells (moon/sun/star tri-blade/trap/shield spells) so we can pick up other spells and make them more effective, or to help boost our team. We've asked for decks that give you more instances of spells per deck for mastery. There are likely tens of thousands of ideas floating around this board, all you need to do is look for them.

Survivor
Feb 15, 2010
13
I have fire, storm, death, and life as max levels so I've had a good feel for most of the spell changes. In that respect, the biggest problem with the shadow spell nerf is mystic colossus and Khrulhu. I suggest buffing Khrulhu's damage from 595 to at least 630. Considering Khrulhu is supposed to be one of death's hardest hitting AOE spells, 595 base damage is too low.

Survivor
Jul 15, 2016
4
Regarding Shadow Changes

You have to realize that literally every single player in the game does not want to keep using their rank 7 and 9 aoe spells. This is exceptionally bad for myth because they have to use frog at max level because colossus is not even worth packing in anymore.

Please just revert the shadow changes. Nobody asked for those. What the PvP community wants is a shield reduction nerf on abominable weaver and a weakness reduction nerf on efreet. No one ever wanted for shadow enhanced spells to get nerfed as this will make the game boring since, like I said, we will have to continue to use our old aoe since the shadow enhanced spells are now all but useless.

Please just keep shadows and shadow enhanced spells the way they are in pve. Please do not bother nerfing every single mob and boss from Polaris through Empyrea, for that is a huge waste of time.

Both communities, pve and pvp, DO NOT want these changes. In fact, many of us are already thinking of quitting the game since these shadow enhanced spells are spells we all love. Remember that you are supposed to get stronger spells as you level up. As a max storm, I should not have to use sirens instead of bugs at max level because the new aoe, bugs, is simply weaker than sirens. This makes the game boring and this logic can be applied to pretty much every other school, ESPECIALLY MYTH.

Like I’ve stated before, max myth wizards will not be forced to resort to spells like frog while other schools use storm lore, fire dragon, forest lord, scarecrow, ra, frost giant, etc. Myth has no good aoe after frog and this is a HUGE problem. This update has essentially killed the myth school.

Please consider this. I have six max level wizards for all the schools except for ice. I know what I am talking about and I can assure you that many in the community will agree with this. Thanks for reading!

Survivor
Jul 15, 2016
4
Please revert the shadow enhanced spell changes. All the PvP players asked for was a shield reduction nerf for abominable weaver and a weakness reduction for efreet. They never asked for all these nerfs to these numerous shadow spells. Plus, these spells are worse than the previous aoe’s we have gotten like sirens, fire dragon, scarecrow, etc. This is not how the game should work. Please revert the changes and just nerf the two spells I mentioned above. I, like many others, will be quitting if this update goes through. No one likes these changes and they seriously need to be reverted, otherwise this game will die. Please consider this. Thanks!

Survivor
Jul 15, 2016
4
If you want to nerf the shadow enhanced spells for pvp, PLEASE give us two versions of the spells. One for pve which is the original version, and one for pvp which is the new versions. Using these new spells in pve will be practically useless since we will just use our rank 7-9 aoe since they are stronger than the new nerfed shadow enhanced spells.

Survivor
May 14, 2015
41
I've heard people putting down the new faces so much recently because our characters look older. But the fact is, maybe some people WANT their characters to look older, because they're not supposed to be children according to their stories. Take one of my friends characters Tiffany Unicornblood for example. Back when the character was still 19 years old, yes, it would make sense for her to look pretty youthful because she was still a young adult trying to find her way in the world.

Today? She is now in her mid-30's, and she has a teenage daughter running around who is enrolled in Ravenwood. So it would logically make sense that she look much older, because she's now a grown woman with a child whom she must look after.

And as for her mother, Jessica? It's still unclear how old she is, but if she's a grandmother now, she's probably in her 60's, AT LEAST. A 60-year-old Wizard is NOT going to look like the younger Wizard's we've had up until now!

So if you ask me, there needs to be options to make our characters look as young or old as we want them to be. Do we want them to be youthful, or looking like they're getting ready for retirement, or in their prime?

Survivor
Apr 11, 2018
2
I just fill like they should keep the shadow aoe the way they were in live. If not just buff glowbug's squall up to maybe 990 or 1000 and leave Ruslaka's Wrath at 1445. For put khrulhlu at least 800 because it's just scarecrow but up 185. For there only good aoe mystic colossus was fine were it was or put it to 750 and have it remove 3 shields. And for gaze just goes to 550 when you enchant it so how about buffing it up to 850 so it's not such a useless single hit for them and you could make the bubble +15% or+20%. Idk there are other people that have some better ideas than what I just said.

Survivor
Oct 12, 2012
9
Dear KingsIsle,
I'm posting this on behalf of your fans. we are the people that buy the bundles, memberships, and crown items. We are the ones always eager to sink our teeth into the beautiful, extensive lore you have created. Your game brings us nostalgia, escapism, and fun. We choose to play through the arcs and side worlds on character after character just to experience the uniqueness of your game over and over again.

That being said, the changes you are proposing to shadow-enhanced cards-as seen on test realm-alienate your core audience. Wizard101 has many niches: the pet trainers, gardeners, decorators, and PvPers. However, we all have one thing in common.
We quest. And for that very reason, the nerfs to the spells ignore and even invalidate all the work us players put into acquiring them. With mobs gaining more and more HP and resist, we need this damage more than ever in PvE content. We beat Malistaire, Malistaire, and Malistaire again to unlock the secret of shadow-enhanced spells. Please listen to what we have to say, which I will reiterate in plain and simple terms.
Key Take-aways
PvP is its own institution, with its own rules, gameplay, and demographic.
We are united by PvE, we must all quest through it and it's the heart of the game.
Changing these spells to the extremes you have is introduces the laziest kinds of challenges. That's because it's takes away what we've already had. It is not a new mechanic or stat, just the removal of something we have come to know, appreciate, and understand.

I hope someone has the time t o read this post, one in an infinite sea of suggestions and comments.

Survivor
May 21, 2010
2
Ok so the shadow pip nerfs made on test realm. I would like you guys to readjust them if possible because right now a lot of them are just unbalanced. Let’s start with storm. Glowbugs could get a 100more dmg increase and at least remove 3 blades because most people in pvp can just elemental blade to encounter it. And storm already has a lot of blade removing spells. And now bull can potentially do more dmg than bugs. Storm is one of the lowest tier schools in pvp they can die easily so their spells like Rusulka for 6 pips which does only little bit more than iron sultan and has a chance to give -30. Maybe leave the dmg alone and only give +30 only. or increase the dmg and leave the weakness or blade alone. Myth and balance got the worst of it. Mystic was fine the way it way before. Most people in pvp don’t use mystic in 1v1. In pve it’s already so hard to quest on myth that u barley see any myth wizards anymore. Myth doesn’t have any good aoe. And balance already got so many of their spells nerfed. I would like to see gaze stay the same. Or just leave the dmg alone and decrease the bubble to 15%. Than death, lulu doesn’t need to be nerfed that much because drains are already weak when u enchant them it doesn’t do the full amount. Besides ffa and weaver which actually needed nerfing, you guys messed up all the other shadow spells.

Survivor
Feb 12, 2016
1
We all understand the necessity of balancing out the shadow spells in order to further the games development but this isn’t “balanced” you’re not taking into account the damage the different schools have. Mystics 400 dmg isn’t compromised by the average 100 damage their gear can give, or lowering death when we can get a maximum of 144 damage (taking over stats into account) isn’t fair. You’ve buffed fire to where they can have a maximum of 174 damage with 100% critical, you’ve shown favoritism to one school time and time again, this game will not work if every single player is fire. I don’t quite understand lowering the damage of spells and lowering the difficulty of bosses/mobs it would literally just be the exact same thing we have now you’d be doing such a drastic overhaul and extra work for the same result...it’s a complete 360.

Into character design
A change was need they were quite outdated, I feel as if most of the issue lies on the eyes they’re very bright and just one solid colour if they had some shading and looked a bit more realistic like they do now I think everyone might grow to like them more. Different eye shapes would also be something I’d like to see added players of different nationalities could be better represent if all the eye shapes weren’t exactly the same.

Survivor
Nov 20, 2016
3
We have been in a tank meta for so long. With guardian spirit coming back, its gonna be even worse. With our strongest spells being nerfed, its gonna be impossible to kill jades. So pvp is ruined. Also, this my message that I think is really important and needs to be shared. the worst part is that they did it again. They managed to release an update that is severely broken. I don’t expect them to get it right the first time. But I expect them to actually care about the changes they make. They need to make careful adjustments, not hear that people want weaver and ffa nerfed and then say forget it and nerf everyone. They are supposed to make the lines between the schools that make them unique bigger. They should make the schools stand out. And they did the exact opposite. Now everyone has an equally strong aoe and single hit. Except the support schools now do more damage than the offensive ones. They did the exact opposite of what they HAD to do and instead of making everyone unique they instead diluted everyone. What needs to be done is the schools need to be reevaluated and their spells and stats need to be rebuilt. They need to actually fit the description of the schools. Ice should do the least damage by a LOT and have the best tanking stats by a LOT. Life should have below average damage, above average tanking, and amazing healing. Storm should have top tier damage by a LOT and have the worst tanking and hp abilities by a LOT. The schools need to be looked at and fixed. They are all the same right now.

Survivor
Jul 15, 2016
4
No one asked for any of these changes. Please revert them. Just nerf weaver’s shield and efreet’s weakness. Everything else is just fine!

Survivor
Dec 08, 2013
2
I think you should have the shadow spells like Bad Juju. You should keep the same stats for PvE but have different stats for PvP.

Survivor
Dec 08, 2009
5
I know i already said something here, but something just hit me. I know its too cumbersome to make the old shadow enhanced hits have pvp and pve types, but what if when we learn these spells they come with a single spellement. and that spellement is used to decide whether someone wants a version that's pvp friendly, but nerfed as it is now, or the second path is an also nerfed, but not so heavily nerfed version that's no pvp.

Survivor
Jan 27, 2011
1
Focusing more on the impact of Shadow-enhanced spells receiving a rebalance, I agree that it is the right course of action. While implementing a nerf is something that is never going to be met with the most acceptance, I think the community has done a poor job in reacting and telling the Devs what we would like to see- myself included. Condemning the Devs of W101 and threatening to cancel membership will not help anyone in this scenario- which is what a large portion of the posts I've seen on Twitter and Reddit have been doing. Instead, let me address areas in which I think the rebalance could be amended to the satisfaction of both the Devs and the player base.

*** before I continue I want to address the 4-pip shadow spells. I'm assuming those will, too, be rebalanced, because Iron sultan doing the same and Rusalka for 2 less pips doesn't make too much sense. The same issue exist for the other schools and their 4-pip shadow spells.

So the biggest issue I see with the shadow spells, nerfed or not is: the extent to which schools rely on them is not equal.

has the ability to use three other decent AoE options other than bugs. While bugs is still the preferred option in Live, if storm HAD to use Sirens solely for hitting it wouldn't destroy the functionality of the school.
and however absolutely NEED Khrulhu and Mystic to be able to be viable later in the game. more so than death, needs to have a good AoE because it is classified as a hitting school, that is apparent from the way in which myth gear has been separated from those of the other spirit schools. It is just below in crit and just below in damage (using the Dragoon gear for comparison). But now, Bull does ~69% more damage, on average, than Mystic and Glowbug does 62% more damage than Mystic. To me, that discrepancy is too great, even is Mystic removes 1 ward first. With that in mind, I have some ideas for rebalancing the AoEs that have been rebalanced in Test.

Bugs 850 base, remove 3 blades
Bull 700-820, -30% mantle (this spell I kept the same because I think it is the spell that got the most reasonable nerf)
Mystic 660 base, remove 2 wards before damage
Khrulhu 715 base, slightly higher than myth to account for 2/3 enchant on drains
Nested 600-650, I don't know why this was the best shadow AoE post rebalance
75 per pip, 1050 base at max pips, the benefit is this can get the highest base damage, but the draw back is that you have to wait for the pips, I think that's a fair mechanic
Wings of Fate 595 base, 225 heal, no DoT, HoT can remain if necessary

the single-target shadow spells then need to be balanced against these, but I think everyone nervous for the implications in PvE are mostly concerned with their AoEs.

I think that what will make the community happy is seeing their shadow AoE hitting that 900 damage mark after enchant. Anything lower seems too underpowered. Also, with less of a nerf to the spells, less work has to go into rebalancing the mobs. I think what doesn't sit well with the player base is having the spells nerfed to the point where the enchanted, rebalanced version does less than the base of the unenchanted Live version.

Survivor
Feb 19, 2019
2
I'm going to summarize the entirety of your Shadow Spells changes section in one sentence.

We here at KI only listen to our whiny PvP community who complain that their lvl.47 abilities are no match for overpowered Shadow hits.

You can't just completely make shadow spells useless to cater to the minority of your fan base!! The death, myth, and balance changes are completely absurd and anyone who is willing to justify them is out of their mind.

Survivor
Apr 11, 2018
2
I think that they could of kept the shadow aoe's the same but if not here's what I think they could do for some of them. For have glowbug's do maybe 990 or 1000 and keep the remove all blades. For have lulu do 850 or little higher. For mythic colossus have it do 750 or 850 and remove's 3 shields. And for have gaze do 850 or 450 but the bubble gives +15% or 20%. Now Ik there are people that have better ideas than what I had to say but that's ok

Survivor
Aug 30, 2010
8
The general reaction that I have seen so far to the nerfing of shadow spells is VERY negative and quite angry. When they initially came out it was explained that shadow backed spells were intended to be the most powerful spells in the game precisely because they were backed with the power of shadow. So to now nerf them to the point where a basic learned spell is now more powerful than something backed with the power of the shadow seems...well... in one point, it negates the usefulness of the spell.
For instance, on a Storm wizard. Nerfing Glowbugs quite this badly means that instead of using it as my go to fast hit and kill in PVE, I'll totally ignore it in favor of Tempest or St orm Lord, because they now become MORE powerful than something backed with the power supposed to be inherent in Shadow.
In the case of Myth? It finally had a powerful AOE other than Frog. Not only that but for bosses like...Omen Stribog where you need to remove ALL shields (And ONLY the shields so Earthquake will NOT work) in front of a primary hitter (if you're in with a storm for instance) so that they can get their hit through without the bother of some fifteen shields (not an exaggeration, Omen gets SOOOO many shields... ok,so, not all of them stack, but really...there's some serious shield spamming going on there lol)...nerfing the ability to remove all shields is FAR too much. Not only does Mystic become weaker in removing shields, but with the DRASTIC damage reduction it becomes less powerful than the five pip(Granted it's a single hit) spell Ninja Pigs. So...once again, I would be forced to completely abandon Mystic, which is my favorite spell in the game (and Myth is my main character and ALWAYS first to max out when a new world comes out).
Most of the reductions do, in fact, make a spell that is SUPPOSED to be stronger than anything previously learned BECAUSE of the shadow infused into them, weaker than something Characters learned anywhere between thirty to forty levels prior. So, yeah, I understand the anger of those who are upset with this OVER nerfing of something that has worked perfectly fine since shortly after they came out.

With all that said, I DO understand the need to balance the system in an evolving game. The problem comes when doing so goes TOO far.

Survivor
Apr 11, 2020
1
Hi this is my first time ever posting here, and only recently came back to the game, so I was not around when darkmoor came out, so I am not informed as to how they changed the game but with that being said I think some of the changes to shadow spells are fine like weaver, ffa, or bull (which was kinda indirectly buffed due to how big the nerf to bugs was), but for death, myth, and balance that is far from the case. All that needs to be said for gaze of fate is that a storm hit from spectral blast will do more damage. Myth and death are the ones I'm really concerned with because both schools heavily rely on their shadow aoes because all their other aoes are pretty bad to use at higher levels, but now there is barely a difference between them. Frog has a max damage of 325 and mythic's damage is now only 450, so if it takes an average of 3 turns to get a shadow then it is better for you just use frog twice. For death lulu (have no idea how to spell the full name) is now just scarecrow with an enchantment. Now I would actually not have a problem with lulu if is was 695 damage instead of 595 because it is a drain spell meaning you can't fully enchant it, so its base damage with epic is 795 where if you giving it just 100 more damage can compensate for the damage lost in the enchantment.

As for the character models I think they are only bad because they have freakishly large and unsettling eyes, so if the eyes were just a bit smaller I think they models would actually look really good.

Survivor
May 03, 2014
1
Thank you guys for all your hard work! I love all the changes, for the character revamp.. but I want to be able to revert to the old graphics, would you guys consider making an on and off setting for these things, it makes it extremely beneficial as well for everyone who has slightly lesser computers as over people, like me,‘I have to run everyone on the lowest settings, Thank you, Famela, please do consider as I don’t think I will be able to play after this update unless there’s a on and off setting for this.

Survivor
Aug 02, 2012
2
Shadow Changes:
Rating/Rounds:
I’ve watched some Test Realm pvp matches and so far I do not think the shadow pip rating system is helping the problem. I assume It’s because the system is trying to reward a shadow pip every 3 rounds and I still think this is too much. To start off with none of the Rank 4 shadow spells were nerfed. Which means Shadow Spell spam happening. Even if these spells were nerfed, there still exists the problem that getting a shadow pip every 3 rounds is not enough time to make other spells viable. Spamming a 4 pip shadow spell that is nerfed to 7 pip equivalent is still faster because it takes 4 rounds to get 7/8 pips (4 power pips). Then there are spells like shrike and sentinel. If I can get a shadow pip every three rounds I essentially can always be in a shadow form none stop and once your shadow pips get built up, and I’ve seen it in these test realm matches. Your shadow pips are basically a steady stream. I think on the pvp side shadow pips need to come every 5 rounds. This way traditional spells are still in play. This way you can’t spam 3 shadow spells in shrike (re: test realm matches). I think a shadow pip should be a strategic advantage not an abundant resource. If Shadow pips came every 5 rounds it opens up more combos. By the time you get a shadow pip you’d be able to Medusa into snake charmer or Medusa Medusa but right now with by the time I get pips for Medusa I can snake charmer twice and by the time I’ve casted both snake charmer (2 rounds) I will likely have another shadow pip to follow up with a third snake charmer. Before this rating system you could go 8 rounds without shadow pips and getting one meant you needed to be strategic. I truly think pvp have an average 5 round wait for shadow pips.

Spell nerfs:
Mystic Colossus:
First I’d like to point out mystic. A twitter poll was done on the WizDevs account and I’d like to point out some discrepancies. The poll and answers to questions indicated we would be keeping Shatter as the utility on Mystic Colossus. The word ‘wards’ was included in the poll description in context to removal, and a answer indicated the only nerfs we would see would be to damage. Either standard damage nerf and leave shatter on the back end or putting shatter on the front end for even more reduced damage. At this point we are sitting with 1 shield removal and then a weak aoe. I think this is a good idea but I don’t think it fits the spell. In other words I think if this spell concept was going to exist it should be saved for a higher rank where the damage reduction of having pierce or shatter on the front end would still be decent. I think right now the best thing to do for mystic is one of the following. A) mystic does damage and then removes 2 wards or B) mystic does damage and has shatter. I do not think removing one shield front end or back end is adequate enough for this spell that has served both as a good aoe and a good support spell for myth and I would like mystic to still hold its support role on this spell.

Wings of fate:
Wings of fate needs reworked badly and it seems very possible with what we’ve seen with other shadow spells. At this point I see no reason to leave a spell that much of the community deems useless as is when all of the other spells that were released with it and have the same pip cost are being adjusted. This spell was not used because it was unbalanced, this spell was avoided because it has no practical use in pvp or pve and a spell as strong as this should not be useless. This spell suffers in both pve and pvp as being a spell that tries to accomplish too much at once and because of that it has no practical uses. Currently in pve throwing a mass DoT (and a weak one at that) hurts the ability to trap or feint bosses. Likewise a 525 HoT (for 6 pips) is not enough health to deal with Incoming damage. Changing the 50-50 aspect of this spell would make it largely viable. If Eternal Leviathan can do 545 and 320 to all alllies Wings of Fate can the same for 9

Witch’s House Call/Wings of Sorrow:
Why were these spells not nerfed? The rank 6 shadow spells are suppose to worth 9 pips. Wings’ debuff is at least work 1 pip so it’s dpp should be rank 8. Witch’s minion is at least one, at the most 3 (minotaur/cyclops/troll minion -> 700 hp) so this spell at the most should be rank 8 dpp as well. I say this as a player who has two max myth wizards And then a max life and death. Wings of Sorrow can do the same damage as Avenging Fossil. I think both spells should be brought down a little and that their 140 damage range is too much.

Rusalka’s Wrath:
This is the only spell with a negative effect and it needs removed. Otherwise every other rank 6 spell needs the chance to produce a negative result. Not only is Rasulka doing almost the same damage as Witch’s house call and wings of sorrow (off by about 40 damage) it’s utility isn’t worth the same as theirs. And with the chance for a weakness it’s just drastically no where close to being held to the same standard as any other rank 6 spell. I can not fathom why the weakness was added in the first place and I see no reason to keep it there going forward. There is no chance for some god tier utility nor some high valued damage that makes a possible weakness realistic. Please remove it.

Survivor
Jan 08, 2012
1
I don’t understand why this “Balancing” was so extreme for some school then others. Being a player with multiple wizards I see it from different sides. In my mind we all worked hard, put the time and effort into getting these powerful spells and for what? To have all that hard work, Excitement and anticipation for these amazing spells to be shattered. Why stick around to the end when the spell you learn in wizard city are just as strong as shadow magic?

Survivor
Aug 07, 2009
21
If you would all actually pay attention to feedback, you would know that this "nerf" to shadow enhanced spells and pips is a disaster! Shadow pips (and shadow-related enhanced spells) should be very powerful! Old Cobb was the one with so many shadow pips, but never had enough regular pips to do anything with them. Now you wanna nerf it even more? I understand that shadow pip enhanced spells are very powerful, but that's how it should be!

The worse part, is that each shadow enhanced spell is different, therefore there will only be a few classes with good shadow enhanced spells unfortunately, while the other schools shadow spells are just not enough to keep them in a game!

I'm very bad at explaining myself, so you still might be confused, and i'm sorry. Hard to articulate what i'm trying to say as i have something wrong with my brain.

But if we have to rely on our old spells (that aren't shadow enhanced) to get the job done, that means the shadow enhanced spells are just awful!

Administrator
First of all, thank you for the detailed feedback on both fronts! This is the sort of dialogue that helps us make the Spiral awesome.

With the new character system, we had to rebuild the way the character models are constructed (we have to do this often when we update art that's well over a decade old, and the character models are one of the oldest things in game!). So, the answer is that we aim to keep the visuals as close to the original as possible, but we cannot retain the exact old faces, so giving us feedback like, "on this face, I don't like that my pupils are smaller, the shape of my face is not quite as round, and I have smile lines" etc. These specific critiques are super helpful for us to be able to tweak instances where the faces are drastically and unintentionally different than the original.

We'll take a look at all the links regarding feedback and fan edits. I think we're on the same page here, and this will help with the feedback on aging and shading. Definitely check out the next Test Realm update, and we can continue to discuss!

In terms of the Shadow Spells - I'll make sure Matnetic and Ratbeard and crew review all this feedback and wrap it into their ongoing discussions. The very next update won't have any Shadow Changes YET, but we will let the community know what's to come as Test Realm marches on.

“If the Mind is like a candle, the Heart is like the sun.” Professor Falmea (aka Leah Ruben, your fearless Producer!)
Survivor
Feb 11, 2009
4
I'm not too concerned about character design to be honest. But I am concerned about the monstrocity that is done to shadow spells.

I don't know why Myth School has been the black sheep. Y'all made myth use Humongofrog for 78 levels. Mystic Colossus continues to be the only viable AoE Myth has, with the exception of the Lord Humongofrog 8 pip pet spell from the Wandering Eye. Reducing the damage of Mystic Colossus IN HALF is way too extreme. Myth is supposed to be the 3rd hardest hitting school and yet the level 58 AoE spells like Ra do more damage than the level 100 Myth school spell. I understand you're making room for new spells, probably an AoE spell for Myth, but you have to realize that you're essentially invalidating Mystic Colossus. It's going to be better to use the Lord Humongofrog pet spell. Not to mention that myth wizards will go 108+ levels before getting a *good* AoE that isn't a pet spell.

Not to mention that Lulu has always done more damage than Mystic Colossus. The only spells I can think of that Myth has gotten a good deal on is King Art, Ninja Pigs, and Scion. Every other spell is wildly inferior to every other school in terms of either damage output or effects. Myth always does SLIGHTLY better than the average damage for each new generation of spells. Which isn't worth it considering myth has, depending on gear, worse health than Fire. Fire has more damage, critical, and health than Myth wizards in 75% of the gameplay. Myth's main gimmick of summoning minions is useless because there STILL is not a mass summon spell for myth wizards and it took 10.5 years to allow myth wizards to summon more than 1 minion. Ruining Mystic Colossus is ruining the ONLY thing Myth has going for it.

Death isn't in much of a better boat. Lulu is just slightly better Scarecrow. People will only use Deer Knight at this rate, which Death wizards have arguably a worse tradeoff than Myth because at least Lord Humongofrog is much easier to obtain.

I don't have an opinion of the Gaze being nerfed because my balance literally never uses it because I have always thought the spell was trash. Bugs nerf is way too much as well, but storm will survive because they have other good AoE attacks. Weaver nerf is doable but not ideal.

Y'all are favoring Fire too much and it's blatantly obvious. And yes, it does seem like y'all are unbalancing this game specifically for PvP because this comes RIGHT after the KILive PvP talk. I have played this game for 11.5 years and I am already fed up with how the game has been run lately. This might be the final straw. The "bundles" that are more expensive than buying everything individually, the blatant crowns grabbing, pay to win gear unless you're max level, and laggy servers is one thing, but to mess with a well established game mechanic and to completely invalidate 2 schools altogether is another. Nerf Mystic Colossus to 750 or 700 and Lulu to 650 or 700. Doing anything further than that will make questing with these schools miserable because they are staples in Myth and Death gameplay.

Updates should be something we look forward to, but the last several updates has made it so the community is fearing them. I love this game, but I'd rather quit it now so it will have a happy place in my heart forever than to watch it get ruined update after update. Nerfs are totally okay, to reduce the damage of schools by 50% and ruin any possible solo viability is not. Readjust your "balancing" and stop looking at this game through PvP perspective and look at how it will RUIN PvE for multiple schools