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Let's Talk About Malistaire and Morganthe &+

2
AuthorMessage
Explorer
Jun 10, 2012
53
SilvaBlitz on Mar 30, 2014 wrote:
I think it's because of the effect. I mean, when you think of EVIL the first thing that pops into your mind is death or darkness.

-Jordan ThunderGlade Level: 92
Well yes, also necromancers have a bad reputation not just in this video game but in mythology and general- they tend to be quite evil and barbaric. But there has already been 2 death bosses and once something repeats itself thrice it tends gets quite stereotypical, and instead of each arch having its own unique story, an obvious pattern is apparent and gets less surprising and exciting. There are other schools out there, and there are loads of stories just waiting to be written.

I have another idea for the next arch: Maybe there is a secret powerful tome that holds ancient magic within it from a place beyond the spiral, but it has been lost for millennial until an unsuspecting Raven wood student stumbles upon the book. The student is curious about the tome, and decides to take it home. Every time she read a little more of that tome, the less of her existed inside her body. The magic inside that book required a person to posses and destroy in order to resurrect. Finally, the book got complete control over her (or him) and the magic within the book threatened to rewrite the spiral, control it's inhabitants, and eventually destroy the spiral altogether. Maybe as a plot twister, the magic within the tome lives to destroy worlds, and that is how it survives. The final boss could be the unfortunate curious student and his/ her school could be balance (because it is a mixture of all schools) or myth (It just sounds right)

Explorer
Jun 10, 2012
53
seth lotus on Jan 16, 2014 wrote:
I thought morganthes tie to malastaire was that she secretly poisoned sylvia in the first place. I guess i am wrong then lol

Seth lotus 42
Well, there are some wizard conspiracy theories out there on how Sylvia died. Many people find it too hard to believe that an experienced healer could have simply died to a common cold. One of the most common is Morganthe poisoned Sylvia, drove Malistare insane so we could kill him and she could easily control him. It's a good theory, but it is a little bit too elaborate and overly complicated-- not to mention there is a lot at stake. (Like the spiral she is attempting to rewrite herself!)
I read on here on the messaging boards somewhere that, as the story says, Sylvia simply died of a common cold. (And that is just sad. Irony) I don't know exactly where the post is, all i know that it was written by Diego and one of the topics Kingsisle wrote. I think it was one of those feedback Friday posts. (I am too lazy to find it and link it.)

Explorer
Jul 24, 2011
93
I haven't even completed the first arc, but I would like another Death final boss. I know it's really unfair for Death people, but I like the Death bosses.

Cole GoldenFlame, Level 39 Pyromancer World: MooShu and Grizzleheim Area: Crimson Fields and Mirkholm Keep

Delver
Apr 21, 2012
253
Dr Von on Jan 16, 2014 wrote:
Only KI knows that, lol. But I agree with you~ it's always been my belief that Morganthe was somehow involved in Sylvia's death; otherwise, what is the tie between her and Malistaire? You don't just rip someone out of his grave for no reason: obviously, she needed him for something.

Here are my theories:

1) Morganthe killed Sylvia~

The greatest theurgist in the Spiral does not simply die from a common cold (which is exactly what Gloria Krendell and Sergeant Skullsplitter both said it was, back in Wizard City). My guess is that it would take a lot more than that to take Sylvia out, which leads me to believe that Morganthe had help, or maybe...

2) Malistaire killed Sylvia himself.

Whether by mistake or on purpose, I don't know. What if Sylvia got into something she shouldn't have? Or what if it was a case of, "if I can't have her, then no one will"?

3) Sweet revenge

What I do know is that Malistaire turned Sylvia into a wraith, to preserve her spirit until he could resurrect her...

Morganthe decided to give Malistaire a taste of his own medicine by ripping him out of his grave and bringing him back as a corpse himself. Kind of like, "well, you didn't let her rest in peace, so I'm not letting you rest either".

-

Either way, there is much more to the story than KI has let on thus far. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

-von
95
I do not believe that Morganthe had any interaction with Malistaire before the whole Azteca thing. If you recall, the events of Sylvia and Malistaire took place approximately one year before you came to Ravenwood. BUT Morganthe was trapped on Celestia,
here,
http://www.wizard101central.com/wiki/Quest:Forewarned_Is...#tab=Quest_Dialogue

Nestor mentions that the Pisceans and Lophians were allies for MANY years, since the cause of the trouble with those groups was Morganthe, she was likely trapped in whatever state she was in on Celestia for far longer than when Sylvia died.

Survivor
Jul 15, 2013
32
Cunning Finnigan S... on Dec 15, 2013 wrote:
So what's the point I'm trying to make? Simple! I want to know which villian you like more or feel you can relate to more.

From my experience, I've heard a lot of Wizards prefer Malistaire over Morganthe. I think Malistaire will remain a top player favorite because 1.) He's the first villian you encounter and 2.) I think because a lot of families play, many older players (or romanticists) can relate to him. I think one spouse could relate to loosing the other and talking massive strives to bring the lost one back more than wanting to prove you're right, as older players, I think, have had that structured learning experience under their belt. I think Malistaire really represents the more mature and older players because his goals were much more deep than Morganthe's

On the other hand, I think a lot of younger players can or could relate to Morganthe more. To be a star student and then have everything taken away from you that is yours to learn can really hurt. I mean imagine being in school and you're taking a class and making straight A's in it, but the teacher won't teach you the next big lesson and keeps belittling you and when you try and sneak the next lesson, you're removed of all rights to learn something and expelled from that school. As a younger players, if that happened to me at my high school, I could relate to it. I also think Morganthe represents the more rambucious and reckless children with too much curiousity. When you look at her major goal, they are a bit more trivial compared to Malistaire's (but just as deadly).

I, personally, like Morganthe more than Malistaire as I can better relate to her (Malistaire is still up their on the Villianous Leaderboards). But I want to hear which major villian you more relate to.

I'd also like to ask you: What do you want to see in the next major villian?
Would you like someone just as sympathetic as Malistaire or even more ruthless and deliberate than Morganthe? Maybe a mix of both? Or would you like a villian who is more of an 'it', a creature that you can't sympathize and really can only try to stop, like Pirate101's Armada to show an example?

I'd like someone whose a little more mysterious and harder to figure out, but maybe with just as bad a past as Malistaire. I don't know if their can be a villian more deliberate than Morganthe, but who knows? I'd also love someone who doesn't relate to Ravenwood and is completely new. (Malistaire was a teacher of Ravenwood, Morganthe a student of Ravenwood. Ever notice that?) Maybe a rival of Merle Ambrose.

Post your comments below!
definitely morganthe!

Survivor
Jul 15, 2013
32
Dr Von on Jan 16, 2014 wrote:
Only KI knows that, lol. But I agree with you~ it's always been my belief that Morganthe was somehow involved in Sylvia's death; otherwise, what is the tie between her and Malistaire? You don't just rip someone out of his grave for no reason: obviously, she needed him for something.

Here are my theories:

1) Morganthe killed Sylvia~

The greatest theurgist in the Spiral does not simply die from a common cold (which is exactly what Gloria Krendell and Sergeant Skullsplitter both said it was, back in Wizard City). My guess is that it would take a lot more than that to take Sylvia out, which leads me to believe that Morganthe had help, or maybe...

2) Malistaire killed Sylvia himself.

Whether by mistake or on purpose, I don't know. What if Sylvia got into something she shouldn't have? Or what if it was a case of, "if I can't have her, then no one will"?

3) Sweet revenge

What I do know is that Malistaire turned Sylvia into a wraith, to preserve her spirit until he could resurrect her...

Morganthe decided to give Malistaire a taste of his own medicine by ripping him out of his grave and bringing him back as a corpse himself. Kind of like, "well, you didn't let her rest in peace, so I'm not letting you rest either".

-

Either way, there is much more to the story than KI has let on thus far. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

-von
95
so does that part mean that morganthe was sylvia's friend? but then i guess morganthe went thru a lot of pain and was turned to the dark side

Survivor
Jul 15, 2013
32
seethe42 on Dec 31, 2013 wrote:
I have to agree with Dr Von. Malistaire was more appealing to all ages. Everyone of all ages eventually understands the experience of loss of a loved one. His loss was twisted in a selfish way to try to regain what he lost. There is a spark of sympathy because his underlying motive started with Love. Morganthe really had no redeeming features in her character. She's more like just a spoiled brat out to destroy everything for power sake. She is greedy, impatient and completely selfish. There's really no understanding her motives except that they arose purely out of hate, greed, ambition and vengence. While all people have those feelings at one time or another, we don't admire them or feel sympathy for them.
ahem you obviously didn't go to morganthe's past yet first she got banished from avalon because her big brother malory dragged her into something evil and she didn't know better then she accidently got into a battle with malistare which then she was no longer a ravenwood student then she turned to the borrowers who got caught by bugs and the bugs forced morganthe to the dark side obviously the bugs reminded her of her sad past and that drew her to the dark side you just don't understand her past but she's my favorite evil person in the game!

Survivor
Oct 11, 2012
11
this does not really relate to the post but it would be awesome if you did this for part of the story line....
the next story line bad guy was behind malistare's wife dieing and at the end PLEASE let malistare be our ally. He is a cool character and it is not like he is REALLY evil, let me be out ally when we fight the bad guy who kill his wife. Or at least put Malistare in the storyline again, and as our allyonce he gets justice, since he is dead he can either rest in peace FINALLY {evil morganthe} or he can teach death for ravenwood again. He is a good teacher plus it would be ironic if the death school had a teacher who was dead
PLEASE let Malistare come back

Survivor
Dec 12, 2009
16
Cunning Finnigan S... on Jan 17, 2014 wrote:
These are interesting, theories, but I don't think Morganthe had anything to do with Sylvia's death. And I'm pretty sure Malistaire wouldn't try to kill the one he holds so dear. Morganthe may have been expelled before the events of Sylvia and Malistaire.

Keep in mind, what Malistaire tried to do spread like wildfire. In Pirate101, we find out in the MooShu Skyways that the attack on the Emporer already reached the most outer parts of MooShu. And I'm sure the Wizards in Wizard City are shaken up by that, plus they have connections in Krokotopia, and Cool Ranch (theres a proffesor of smaller importance over there) and Harold Argleston has relatives all over the Spiral (Cool Ranch, Aquila (P101 again)). So the news would quickly spread. Don't you think news where someone is trying to bring back the dead would become viral?

I doubt Morganthe had any personal connections to Malistaire, unless Malistaire was Morganthe's Death Teacher back in the day. But the news would have spread to even her kingdom, and someone who is powerful enough to raise the dead would be very useful to Morganthe, especially if she's trying to gain knowledge from the deceased. Her agents could find where Malistaire is very quickly (If you did the Spiral Geographic Warehouse quest, you might remember there being Shadow Weavers in Dragonspyre). That's how I see it, at least.

But I will agree with number 3. Malistaire's return does make him taste his own medicine, plus he already has a grudge against us.
my theory is kinda crazy, but here it is :) save the criticizing for later
Morganthe is malistare's daughter and she got mad when Malistare died and she decided "hey, why not bring back my dad and we can rule the world!". she might have been involved in Sylvia's death, but it was probably an accident. or not. morganthe could've wanted more Malistare time and she might've felt neglected and so she thought like "if i can't have him, then you cant!". or, maybe she left something out and Sylvia let her curiosity get the best of her. or morganthe might've not liked Sylvia in the first place.
just an idea :)
Brianna lifegiver 65 fire and storm wizard.

Mastermind
Jul 26, 2011
304
taylor emeraldwhis... on May 4, 2014 wrote:
ahem you obviously didn't go to morganthe's past yet first she got banished from avalon because her big brother malory dragged her into something evil and she didn't know better then she accidently got into a battle with malistare which then she was no longer a ravenwood student then she turned to the borrowers who got caught by bugs and the bugs forced morganthe to the dark side obviously the bugs reminded her of her sad past and that drew her to the dark side you just don't understand her past but she's my favorite evil person in the game!
He posted that in December 2013, way before Khrysalis Part 2 was released and you don't have some of the story correct either. Morganthe wasn't banished from Avalon, she left with Merle to be taught in Wizard City. Also she went through Ambrose's book of Forbidden Knowledge thinking she was to clever, strong, and smart to be learning at the pace Ambrose attempted to teach her and that resulted in her almost blowing up and completely destroying Wizard City. Merle told Malistaire, her death teacher, to expel her from Ravenwood. Malistaire the attempted to take Morganthe's wand making her furious and they ended up in combat. Midway, Ambrose teleported into the death tower and took Morganthe's spell deck and wand. After she was expelled, she went to find herself in the Spiral and she knew she was nothing without her magic. She went to Khrysalis looking for hidden magic to call her own. After sailing the then safe Starfall Sea, she tried to learn Star Magic at the Alcazar of Radiant Judgment but couldn't quite make sense of the magic. She then went to the Hive, home of the Arachna to search for new magic. Then some Arachna Magi recognized her as the Chosen One since she was a Human Wizard as told in the Grand Prophecy. They then took tests on her and proved her as the Chosen One and she ended up as the Morganthe we love and know today.

Survivor
Sep 20, 2010
13
Morganthe is extremely irritating because she never dies. She runs away every time, just as you are about to catch her. I really do not know how in the world she convinced Malistare to leave Sylvia and return to miserable life, but it really shows how she is much more manipulative and powerful she is. Malistare actually had some emotion and heartbreak behind his crimes of passion. Morganthe had the evil lust for power which caused the complete annihilation of Azteca. She destroys things with no sense of right or wrong. And remember guys, Malistare used Death magic, Morganthe uses the much more powerful, much more evil Shadow magic. Malistare caused his chaos, like the striking of the Emperor, not out of pre-calculated malice, he was trying to hide and throw Merle off his tracks. Morganthe already knew what she was going to do before she did it, she has that cold, calculating evil that doesn't care who she hurts or what she destroys. She has a maleficent, egotistical selfishness which builds with every life she destroys. Morganthe, I feel, is the true evil in the Spiral. There is an underlying feeling for me that she also isn't dead.

Adherent
Feb 07, 2011
2926
*spoiler alert*

in radiance reborn (k2), there is a scene involving morganthe and malistaire.

he says (to paraphrase) "if not for the actions of sylvia and myself, wizard city would be in ruins" because of something morganthe had previously done. said scene also ended with merle breaking it up and morganthe being expelled.

so morganthe and malistaire *did* know each other before azteca.

i'd be curious to know what it was that morganthe had done, leading up to that scene. more importantly, there was some bad blood between morganthe and malistaire; it is also implied in malistaire's dialogue that sylvia was also involved in the event, which ended badly for morganthe and therefore gives her a motive.

i can't stand conspiracy theorists irl. but this is what csi and mystery novels have done to my mind!



-von

Archon
Sep 17, 2012
4117
taylor emeraldwhis... on May 4, 2014 wrote:
ahem you obviously didn't go to morganthe's past yet first she got banished from avalon because her big brother malory dragged her into something evil and she didn't know better then she accidently got into a battle with malistare which then she was no longer a ravenwood student then she turned to the borrowers who got caught by bugs and the bugs forced morganthe to the dark side obviously the bugs reminded her of her sad past and that drew her to the dark side you just don't understand her past but she's my favorite evil person in the game!
You obviously played a different game than I did. Malory didn't drag her into anything, he disapproved of her using the Sprigan magic. She did it anyways. If anyone did the dragging it was her. She didn't turn to the borrowers, she sought out the shadow magic and used them all. You paint her as a victim which she isn't.

Delver
Apr 20, 2011
209
Dr Von on Sep 12, 2014 wrote:
*spoiler alert*

in radiance reborn (k2), there is a scene involving morganthe and malistaire.

he says (to paraphrase) "if not for the actions of sylvia and myself, wizard city would be in ruins" because of something morganthe had previously done. said scene also ended with merle breaking it up and morganthe being expelled.

so morganthe and malistaire *did* know each other before azteca.

i'd be curious to know what it was that morganthe had done, leading up to that scene. more importantly, there was some bad blood between morganthe and malistaire; it is also implied in malistaire's dialogue that sylvia was also involved in the event, which ended badly for morganthe and therefore gives her a motive.

i can't stand conspiracy theorists irl. but this is what csi and mystery novels have done to my mind!



-von
I sort of lean towards the theory that it was Morganthe that caused the Death School to fall into Nightside, perhaps it was Malistaire and Sylvia's invovlement that stopped all of Wizard City falling into Nightside. Lets remember too, that a building or piece of land crashing down like an elevator would've caused lots of deaths and injuries (I wonder how Dworgyn survived).
I'm hoping that in the next arc certain historical questions are answered and some mysteries are revealed whether it's through a radiance reborn situation or something else.

Hero
Feb 26, 2012
717
I totally prefer Malistaire to Morganthe. His story was more believable, and more coherent. He was also just a better villain, much more style, more flair, more class.

Morganthe seems to me to be just a spoiled kid psychopath. Her storyline was very disjointed and incoherent to me as well. She always had a sort-of "Power Ranger Villain" quality to her -- a kind of juvenile character prop for bad things to happen in lots of odd places -- rather than a well-developed narrative and character.

2