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Puppet Teams

2
AuthorMessage
Survivor
Jun 09, 2010
13
joujou11cool wrote:
You all know what this is: A level 70 gets his level 1's to join him in a 2v2, 3v3, or 4v4 matches so they fight magus wizards. Well, most of you are against that, right? For all the losses that I've had against them on my magus wizards, I really don't care. People still pay money for pvp, and the people that get those 4 different accounts pay quite a lot, so it's fine. Even though you pay, you most likely won't be paying as much, and even if you did, it's your fault for not levelling up and doing pvp after, so there's no problem here, it's just out of pure hatred and anger that people complain about this. So next time you complain, you should have second thoughts.
Okay, dude, you totolly just stole my thought's lol my bro is a puppet team HATER, even though some people get their freinds to do puppet teams with them, I get your point, because the majority of puppet teams are just not really "teams" . :-)

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
At no time did i say that the 2 lev.35 could not win just that they were "most"likely not to win.
Now i seen some of your other posts here an i think that you are one of those PvPers who have all or most of there arena gear/pet and is just trying to keep peaple from getting the same gear and giving you a challange and a TC spamer who dont want lose the edge over the lower level PvPers.
Not thats maybe a bias opinion.

M.RedBlood Lev.70


I wish I had those :(

Defender
May 29, 2011
134
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
mkt3 wrote:
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...
limit the level gap between team members to 20 levels

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
travisAk wrote:
mkt3 wrote:
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...
limit the level gap between team members to 20 levels


I would like to see it limited to plus or minus 10 levels. So if you have a level 20, anyone that joins will have to be a Level 10 to Level 30.
I think it was Nick over at central that said that he saw a limitation on levels in the Test Realm. I wonder if they are still working on this, as it had a few problems.
I tried to find the posting again, but was unable to locate it. I hope this is address soon, as I cannot see any reason to allow it to continue. If anyone sees the posting on Central about the Test Realm and pvp, could they post it over here?

Thanks,
Fred.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
travisAk wrote:
mkt3 wrote:
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...
limit the level gap between team members to 20 levels


Would that really solve problems or just create more? Think about it:
a level 70 trying to PvP with a level 48. Maybe even just in practice. Or maybe that they're just really good at pvping with each other. Imo, the people that complain about puppet teams really don't know how to PvP.

Champion
Apr 18, 2010
407
joujou11cool wrote:


Would that really solve problems or just create more? Think about it:
a level 70 trying to PvP with a level 48. Maybe even just in practice. Or maybe that they're just really good at pvping with each other. Imo, the people that complain about puppet teams really don't know how to PvP.


I don't think you see the problem joujou. It's not that it's some impossible task, it's that people just starting pvp as a mid level can't do team pvp becuase they aren't good enough. If you 1v1, you'll face people around your level (well, at lower ranks), but in team pvp, you face a transcendent in which takes insane skill to defeat (skill that noobs don't have.) Along with that, puppet teams love to taunt the other team, so along with being beaten to smithereens, they are discouraged from pvp as they feel like complete losers.

People quit pvp from this joujou, so it's a problem weather or not it can be alleviated by getting better at pvp.


Defender
May 29, 2011
134
joujou11cool wrote:
travisAk wrote:
mkt3 wrote:
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...
limit the level gap between team members to 20 levels


Would that really solve problems or just create more? Think about it:
a level 70 trying to PvP with a level 48. Maybe even just in practice. Or maybe that they're just really good at pvping with each other. Imo, the people that complain about puppet teams really don't know how to PvP.


I agree, that would just create more problems. I like to pvp with my buds high lvl or low lvl, and i would definitely reject that solution.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
Solstice64 wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:


Would that really solve problems or just create more? Think about it:
a level 70 trying to PvP with a level 48. Maybe even just in practice. Or maybe that they're just really good at pvping with each other. Imo, the people that complain about puppet teams really don't know how to PvP.


I don't think you see the problem joujou. It's not that it's some impossible task, it's that people just starting pvp as a mid level can't do team pvp becuase they aren't good enough. If you 1v1, you'll face people around your level (well, at lower ranks), but in team pvp, you face a transcendent in which takes insane skill to defeat (skill that noobs don't have.) Along with that, puppet teams love to taunt the other team, so along with being beaten to smithereens, they are discouraged from pvp as they feel like complete losers.

People quit pvp from this joujou, so it's a problem weather or not it can be alleviated by getting better at pvp.



Practice makes perfect. Also, from what I've learned, it's much easier to win in a 4v4 then a 2v2 against puppet teams because there are more team mates to help you fight. If they can't win a 2v2, then there's nothing wrong with moving onto 3v3's and 4v4's. (When I pvp now, I hardly ever face puppet teams).

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
I wonder sometimes if people over there at Kingsisle understand How high level wizards teaming with RANK O LEVEL 1 WIZARDS Is distorting the matching system and ruining group pvp.

I have not played group pvp in three years because of these type of exploits that continue to plague mid and low lvl group pvp. I saw a thread with a guy who had 3600 rank from puppeting...

The current system rewards people with high rank points for EXPLOITING pvp by teaming with one of these downranked level 1's

YouTube is full of video's that shows distinctively how this tactic is being used to create match imbalances.. Something has to be done about this growing trend of cheat your way to warlord.

I don't play group pvp but might one day if problems like this are fixed. Unfair matches like this will discourage new pvp players from returning to arena and maybe even the game.

There are many good suggestions here on this site and over at central such as a rank floor and limiting the lvl gap between team members. Point system is like a delicate ecosystem (lol) so that shouldn't really be messed with IMO.



Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
joujou11cool wrote:
travisAk wrote:
mkt3 wrote:
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...
limit the level gap between team members to 20 levels


Would that really solve problems or just create more? Think about it:
a level 70 trying to PvP with a level 48. Maybe even just in practice. Or maybe that they're just really good at pvping with each other. Imo, the people that complain about puppet teams really don't know how to PvP.
You have zero concept of the problem these rank 0 puppet trans teams are causing.

I just saw a picture of two level 16 wizards (one 630 rank and the other 740 rank) who each lost 28 rank points after getting smashed by a rank 600 trans fire teamed with one of these rank 0 puppets. The trans hit crit on rain of fire. This is apparently FAIR under the current matching system.

You got something to say to those average wizards? Like you two lvl 16's obviously don't know how to pvp? What an ignorant thing to say and sorry if that came off as rude.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
travisAk wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:
travisAk wrote:
mkt3 wrote:
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...
limit the level gap between team members to 20 levels


Would that really solve problems or just create more? Think about it:
a level 70 trying to PvP with a level 48. Maybe even just in practice. Or maybe that they're just really good at pvping with each other. Imo, the people that complain about puppet teams really don't know how to PvP.
You have zero concept of the problem these rank 0 puppet trans teams are causing.

I just saw a picture of two level 16 wizards (one 630 rank and the other 740 rank) who each lost 28 rank points after getting smashed by a rank 600 trans fire teamed with one of these rank 0 puppets. The trans hit crit on rain of fire. This is apparently FAIR under the current matching system.

You got something to say to those average wizards? Like you two lvl 16's obviously don't know how to pvp? What an ignorant thing to say and sorry if that came off as rude.


Rudeness is fine anyways, it's what everyone has experienced being, there's no need to be sorry about it. It's just like saying that you're sorry for being human .

I may seem strict to pvpers, but really, I'm being honest here. If you don't know how to win a 2v2 match against higher levels, then you're pretty weak. I spam the heck out of my shield treasure cards when it comes to puppet teams, and that's basically all you have to do.

I didn't mean that you don't know how to pvp if you lose against higher levels or puppet teams. If you go off and complain about your loss, then yes, you don't know how to pvp. Maybe because I'm just that good at pvp, or just that I shield a lot when it comes to those types of battles that it comes as an easy win. I keep a full set of each school shield, and I try to defend myself and my teammates as well as I can. I usually do it on my Life/Ice wizard, because on my Ice wizard I'm level 36 with 29% resist, and then I shield spam until I get Frozen Armor, and then on my Life wizard I use Spirit Armor and also heal my teammates a lot. On my Myth wizard, I usually clear the blades and traps, as well as stunning the Transcended wizard. I can tell you a very easy way to overcome ALL puppet teams with ALL schools:
Fire: The Efreet treasure card is never bad, as well as stunning, and also using Smoke Screen on your opponent. Use your normal shields as well as 70% treasures, and stack them up heavy unless against a Myth wizard. You can also steal the blades on the Transcended wizard.
Ice: Spam 70% shields as well as getting a resist pet and resist gear and also with Heartsteel, and then spam Tower Shields and Legion Shields also, until you have 7 full pips to use Frozen Armor. Usually, powerful Ice wizards steal shields from their opponents.
Storm: I know, this school dies off very quickly, but unless you use my epic strategy. Keep on using shields, and also use Disarm on your enemy. Then, stack up so many shields that you hardly ever need to heal, or that you'll get weak attacks on yourself. Keep on spamming Kraken or Triton, and the victory is yours.
Death: You can drain! You can cut your opponent's heals! You can put up a Feint! You can spam those 70% shields as well as the treasure card versions! What more could you ask for? If you have a DoT on yourself, what's better then to rid your health with Sacrifice then heal? The DoT is gone, just like that!
Life: Really, all you have to do is shield, shield shield, spam Spirit Armor, spam those Guiding Lights, and heal your teammates whenever. Also, you have Triage! Get rid of those nasty DoT's while healing your teammates!
Myth: Seriously, just buy Earthquake treasure crads! Also, why not stun your enemy and also rid their blades/shields? Also, you can remove the traps from yourself!
Balance: I find this the perfect school for facing the puppet teams. What more could you ask for when you have: Elemental+Spirit Shields, Weaknesses, heals, blades on all of your teammates, fast attacks, and also a high power pip chance? Spam those shields like crazy then get onto attacking mode!

Overall:
Spam Infections, spam shields like it's your life goal, use Weaknesses, Plagues, Virulent Plagues, Smoke Screens, Black Mantles, and also heals, always load your deck with Fairies and Satyrs or even Rebirth! Always load global spells to destroy your opponent's global spells and also keep a Fortify/Vengeance/Conviction/Infallible in hand. Always use accuracy enchantments, armor piercing enchantments, and also damage boosting enchantments!

With all those, that's how I'm the master at defeating puppet teams, I'm not even kidding. You could even try it, you'll win most of the time! :D

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
joujou11cool wrote:
travisAk wrote:
joujou11cool wrote:
travisAk wrote:
mkt3 wrote:
Honestly, there isnt a way to really fix this...

Anyway, the likely ness of 2 lvl 40's beating a lvl 70 is slim.

Not everyone has those fancy epic pets and there 30% percent resist to all schools at that lvl...

Most people get a friend to puppet team with them, and do not buy 2 accounts.

The fact is, it isnt safe to 2v2 at low levels anymore, and thats just not good. I mean honestly, you gotta admit it is kinda cheap...

Unless we find a way to fix it, until then, leave it to kingsisle and move on...
limit the level gap between team members to 20 levels


Would that really solve problems or just create more? Think about it:
a level 70 trying to PvP with a level 48. Maybe even just in practice. Or maybe that they're just really good at pvping with each other. Imo, the people that complain about puppet teams really don't know how to PvP.
You have zero concept of the problem these rank 0 puppet trans teams are causing.

I just saw a picture of two level 16 wizards (one 630 rank and the other 740 rank) who each lost 28 rank points after getting smashed by a rank 600 trans fire teamed with one of these rank 0 puppets. The trans hit crit on rain of fire. This is apparently FAIR under the current matching system.

You got something to say to those average wizards? Like you two lvl 16's obviously don't know how to pvp? What an ignorant thing to say and sorry if that came off as rude.


Rudeness is fine anyways, it's what everyone has experienced being, there's no need to be sorry about it. It's just like saying that you're sorry for being human .

I may seem strict to pvpers, but really, I'm being honest here. If you don't know how to win a 2v2 match against higher levels, then you're pretty weak. I spam the heck out of my shield treasure cards when it comes to puppet teams, and that's basically all you have to do.

I didn't mean that you don't know how to pvp if you lose against higher levels or puppet teams. If you go off and complain about your loss, then yes, you don't know how to pvp. Maybe because I'm just that good at pvp, or just that I shield a lot when it comes to those types of battles that it comes as an easy win. I keep a full set of each school shield, and I try to defend myself and my teammates as well as I can. I usually do it on my Life/Ice wizard, because on my Ice wizard I'm level 36 with 29% resist, and then I shield spam until I get Frozen Armor, and then on my Life wizard I use Spirit Armor and also heal my teammates a lot. On my Myth wizard, I usually clear the blades and traps, as well as stunning the Transcended wizard. I can tell you a very easy way to overcome ALL puppet teams with ALL schools:
Fire: The Efreet treasure card is never bad, as well as stunning, and also using Smoke Screen on your opponent. Use your normal shields as well as 70% treasures, and stack them up heavy unless against a Myth wizard. You can also steal the blades on the Transcended wizard.
Ice: Spam 70% shields as well as getting a resist pet and resist gear and also with Heartsteel, and then spam Tower Shields and Legion Shields also, until you have 7 full pips to use Frozen Armor. Usually, powerful Ice wizards steal shields from their opponents.
Storm: I know, this school dies off very quickly, but unless you use my epic strategy. Keep on using shields, and also use Disarm on your enemy. Then, stack up so many shields that you hardly ever need to heal, or that you'll get weak attacks on yourself. Keep on spamming Kraken or Triton, and the victory is yours.
Death: You can drain! You can cut your opponent's heals! You can put up a Feint! You can spam those 70% shields as well as the treasure card versions! What more could you ask for? If you have a DoT on yourself, what's better then to rid your health with Sacrifice then heal? The DoT is gone, just like that!
Life: Really, all you have to do is shield, shield shield, spam Spirit Armor, spam those Guiding Lights, and heal your teammates whenever. Also, you have Triage! Get rid of those nasty DoT's while healing your teammates!
Myth: Seriously, just buy Earthquake treasure crads! Also, why not stun your enemy and also rid their blades/shields? Also, you can remove the traps from yourself!
Balance: I find this the perfect school for facing the puppet teams. What more could you ask for when you have: Elemental+Spirit Shields, Weaknesses, heals, blades on all of your teammates, fast attacks, and also a high power pip chance? Spam those shields like crazy then get onto attacking mode!

Overall:
Spam Infections, spam shields like it's your life goal, use Weaknesses, Plagues, Virulent Plagues, Smoke Screens, Black Mantles, and also heals, always load your deck with Fairies and Satyrs or even Rebirth! Always load global spells to destroy your opponent's global spells and also keep a Fortify/Vengeance/Conviction/Infallible in hand. Always use accuracy enchantments, armor piercing enchantments, and also damage boosting enchantments!

With all those, that's how I'm the master at defeating puppet teams, I'm not even kidding. You could even try it, you'll win most of the time! :D
Jou, I'm sure you have enough expierience to deal with a puppet team but you have to step back and look at things with a wider perspective. The problem isn't the effects of puppet teams on JouJou, the problem starts when two AVERAGE level 20 wizards (friends) join a 2 vs 2 match and get paired up with one person running two accounts, his Trans and a downranked lvl 1 rank 0 wizard. The critical system makes it almost impossible for them to win. This type of expierience is going to discourage new players from playing group pvp and make evenly matched teams harder and harder to find because people have either left group pvp or learned it is easier to rank up using this MATCHING SYSTEM EXPLOIT.

Btw I don't team and my lvl 10 fire warlord beat a legend death from second, but this isn't about me, it's about the average player and the gaming expierience in group pvp that is being rotted away by "teams" like this. It's about the pvp community as a whole and that includes players outside your skill zone.


A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
Jou, I'm sure you have enough expierience to deal with a puppet team but you have to step back and look at things with a wider perspective. The problem isn't the effects of puppet teams on JouJou, the problem starts when two AVERAGE level 20 wizards (friends) join a 2 vs 2 match and get paired up with one person running two accounts, his Trans and a downranked lvl 1 rank 0 wizard. The critical system makes it almost impossible for them to win. This type of expierience is going to discourage new players from playing group pvp and make evenly matched teams harder and harder to find because people have either left group pvp or learned it is easier to rank up using this MATCHING SYSTEM EXPLOIT.

Btw I don't team and my lvl 10 fire warlord beat a legend death from second, but this isn't about me, it's about the average player and the gaming expierience in group pvp that is being rotted away by "teams" like this. It's about the pvp community as a whole and that includes players outside your skill zone.


I found the key! (Key meaning a great point) You said average wizards, correct? No average wizard should be a warlord I don't think, they have to find the key to success into becoming a master at pvp, that's what a warlord should really be.

Survivor
Aug 12, 2011
46
Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
joujou11cool wrote:
Jou, I'm sure you have enough expierience to deal with a puppet team but you have to step back and look at things with a wider perspective. The problem isn't the effects of puppet teams on JouJou, the problem starts when two AVERAGE level 20 wizards (friends) join a 2 vs 2 match and get paired up with one person running two accounts, his Trans and a downranked lvl 1 rank 0 wizard. The critical system makes it almost impossible for them to win. This type of expierience is going to discourage new players from playing group pvp and make evenly matched teams harder and harder to find because people have either left group pvp or learned it is easier to rank up using this MATCHING SYSTEM EXPLOIT.

Btw I don't team and my lvl 10 fire warlord beat a legend death from second, but this isn't about me, it's about the average player and the gaming expierience in group pvp that is being rotted away by "teams" like this. It's about the pvp community as a whole and that includes players outside your skill zone.


I found the key! (Key meaning a great point) You said average wizards, correct? No average wizard should be a warlord I don't think, they have to find the key to success into becoming a master at pvp, that's what a warlord should really be.
Some people would think a screwdriver is a good key to start and take off in a vehicle, an easy way to get something they didn't work for or deserve. This distortion of the matching system is contradicting everything you just wrote, it is not encouraging people to earn rank it is encouraging them to create their own rank 0 level 1 puppet as a fast track to warlord, corrupting group pvp on the way up.

You make it sound like you support puppet teams?

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
Some people would think a screwdriver is a good key to start and take off in a vehicle, an easy way to get something they didn't work for or deserve. This distortion of the matching system is contradicting everything you just wrote, it is not encouraging people to earn rank it is encouraging them to create their own rank 0 level 1 puppet as a fast track to warlord, corrupting group pvp on the way up.

You make it sound like you support puppet teams?


As I said, I'm strict when it comes to pvp. To me, it's either good or bad. Either just do practice pvp until you get good enough, or don't do any work at all and just rush into ranked pvp and lose. I agree, it may sound like I support the puppet teams, but I don't. I'm neutral, meaning if it goes, I don't care, if it stays, more easy people to defeat, therefore I don't care either. I wrote pure examples on how to easily defeat these puppet teams, so you can tell from there that I have enough skill and knowledge to teach people how to fight against them, which will make it sound like I puppet team or encourage puppet teaming. Answer this: If I've given pure example of how to easily defeat puppet teams without requiring much skill, does that mean I encourage puppet teaming or have puppet teamed? I'll be 100% honest, I have never puppet teamed, but I've faced so many that it's easy. I'm not trying to act like a know-it-all, but I'm trying to stop the complaints on puppet teams.

You can also notice how I didn't argue against removing the puppet teaming feature, unless it was a level ranging, which everyone would hate.

When fighting a puppet team, you require an ultimate strategy and deck set-up, which can help you perfect your wizard. I've hardly lost to puppet teams because I fought them, just as people said: You learn more from your losses then winning. I took that advice seriously, and I recorded every single spell (Almost, I couldn't keep up at some point), and I tried to figure out where I could improve. You could call me a gamer for that, because it didn't offend me at all, but really, just study your losses and how/why you lost. At first I thought: No! I'll never beat puppet teams! I'll just lose my rank if I keep this up. And as I thought, I did lose my ranks while recording how I lost to puppet teams, and then I found out where I made most of my mistakes.
1. I didn't armor pierce.
2. I never used Shatter/Disarm
3. I didn't have a may cast Pierce pet
4. I needed a special amulet to defeat them (The Weakness one works perfectly)

I kept on finding things out, until I hit a lightbulb: Aha! I found it!

Honestly, I'm not the only one that learns a whole lot from their mistakes and can take on a puppet team, am I? There should be MILLIONS of players that can already do this! If you're having trouble, use one of the strategies above that I've said, and then come back to me and tell me how well you did. If you don't try them out, then it's going to be a lot of work to succeed.

Defender
Dec 25, 2008
125
Although it is wrong, just level up some more to avoid it. If no magus wizards are there as opponents then the opponents will be harder sometimes so hard making the puppet teams useless. Lol yea right :P

Sean Fireblood lvl 70 Fire

See you in the spiral!

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
Just to point things out, I won't be able to reply to any of you on this topic for a bit.

2