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Please kill the stuns

AuthorMessage
Survivor
Mar 15, 2009
40
okkk well to solve the problem of you losing your ranks play in the free arena! but other than that yes, chain stunning is a strategy and a good one at that, seeing as how much people are complaining about it...

...MUST.... GO ..... REMODEL.. DECK!!!!!!!! *walks off like a zombie saying brains*

Survivor
Oct 26, 2008
33
Insecto
Post Jun/2/2009 3:01:59 pm Subject: Re:-Please kill the stuns
Look, stunning is a great strategy in stopping the foe from attacking defending, buffing, ect. But the point is, is that even if you want to stun other opposing players or enemies, you(and I and all the other wizards with stuning spells) don't know if that spell(like blinding light, choke, and storm lord) will fizzle. I'm not saying stuning spells are badorgood, I'm just saying that there is no such thing as any spell that cheats or has a bad effect. Yes, I do respect all of your opinions about that stunning spells are bad, but to be honest, all ya got to do with spells that you think are "worthless", just strategize. And this goes forallof the spells, not just stunning because every school has like over 101 ways of strategizing with their main focus of spells.(i.e. having a deck that focuses on aura spells[my favorite ] such as heck hound, link, fire elf, frostbite, storm hound, scald, Fire Dragon, you get the idea.) So you kind of get what I'm saying



Alright, if Choke/Blinding Light cast every round is a strategy in team duels then tell us all the counter-strategy to this completely fair card?

Storm Lord is not really a factor in chain stunning. While it is possible for a few rounds, it is a seven pip spell, and cannot be maintained indefinitely. Choke and Blinding Light are the only two spells that can be maintained indefinitely. I have watched a duel where one team has used choke for 31 rounds, and there have been several others I have watched with similar results. Not one fizzle, not one missed round. During this time the rest of the team proceeded to defeat their opponents one by one.

As I stated above choke has a base accuracy of 80%. add keen eyes to make it 90%, and then add in accuracy clothes and the chance to fizzle is 0%.

So please enlighten us as to the 101 methods of getting around these two spells. I refuse to call it a strategy because that would define it as something clever, and there is nothing clever to repeatedly using the same card over and over.

Thanks

Defender
Oct 03, 2008
174
Chain stunning is TOO GOOD of a strategy; you never even get the chance to counter this strategy because it DOESN"T LET YOU PLAY CARDS!!! HOW CAN YOU COUNTER IF YOU CAN"T PLAY ANYTHING?!

don't know if that spell(like blinding light, choke, and storm lord) will fizzle.

They will NEVER fizzle because the accuracy of these spells will usually be boosted by nearly 20-25% with a combination of pre-prepared treasure card versions (this is probably what the professors were talking about when they mentioned a "treasure card factory") and gear.


Valkoor Crow
Grandmaster Necromancer


Survivor
Oct 26, 2008
33
cbfan14
Chain stunning is TOO GOOD of a strategy; you never even get the chance to counter this strategy because it DOESN"T LET YOU PLAY CARDS!!! HOW CAN YOU COUNTER IF YOU CAN"T PLAY ANYTHING?!


Which is why every reasonable person who duels is complaining about it. It is NOT FAIR and NOT FUN for the opposing team, and considering this is a game we should not have fun at others expense.

Defender
Oct 03, 2008
174
Well, while I don't like chain stunning, I really REALLY hope they'll keep beguile the way it is. That card is SO MUCH FUN, it really creates some scenarios that that are quite . . . interesting . . . in a really fun way. I especially like how when you get beguiled the selections get all turned around, its funny so to see yourself healing an enemy or hitting your comrades and going "WTH?!"

At least with beguile you can still cast cards and your opponents can't attack you. Another thing I thought of is that it can be a counter to chain stunning; by constantly beguiling one of the opponents, his teammates will hesitate to do that storm lord/frost giant/ or any other multi stun for fear of hitting him too.

Valkoor Crow
Grandmaster Necromancer

Survivor
Feb 16, 2009
26
Gamma wrote:
Thank you for your input on the current state of the Player vs Player system.

I just wanted to let you know that we have changes to stun *in PvP* planned for a future update, and we are going to look at the 'treasure card factory' problem.




i really dont understand.....to my knowledge no one has ever been killed by a stun. and even with chain stun along with no damage you gain pips and can be ready for a big attack after. in the mean time the one doing the stunning cant do any thing else either like blade or trap. and loses pips in the mean time.
i do agree about treasure cards though....they should not be allowed in arena at all.
in the arena you need to use your school spells with the accuracy and power they were meant have. and be cast by by those in that school..

i dont use treasure cards in battle at all... i embrace my school and use every spell in my deck (including stun) to survive and even win.

valdus icestalker
grandmaster ice

Survivor
Feb 12, 2009
11
Stuns are not a problem in 1 on 1 duels. They only become a problem with 2 or more per side.

1 person stuns every round, the other person does damage. Chaining these together means the other team never has a chance to attack.

Survivor
Apr 26, 2009
22
I'm Grandmaster Sorcerer, last night I faced Master Storm with death as second school. He asks me up front if I use shields. I tell him of course they are part of my deck but honestly I don't use many. Anyway he proceeds to put around 50 tower shields on and damaging me, making it completely impossible for me to do any damage at all. Unfortunately for him, and fortunate for me, he hasn't learned where reshuffle card is located. Most of these tower shields were treasures. I somehow managed to keep myself alive by discarding and healing. He ran out of cards, lol. So time for me to reshuffle to get all my discards back. With 100 HP left, I call my minion, fortunately fire one, and then proceeded to pass while fire minion took out all his tower shields with fire elf. Wahlah, I won :-D. My point being the use of 50 to 60 tower shields should not be allowed. It was totally ridiculous. The battle took 2 hours. Even balance wizards only have so many shields unless they purchase more treasure tower shields.

Scarlet Song
Grandmaster Sorcerer

Survivor
Oct 26, 2008
33
At least with beguile you can still cast cards and your opponents can't attack you. Another thing I thought of is that it can be a counter to chain stunning; by constantly beguiling one of the opponents, his teammates will hesitate to do that storm lord/frost giant/ or any other multi stun for fear of hitting him too.

Beguile isn't much better if used excessively, especially if your going second because then you can't do anything about the effects.

As you pointed out earlier, to counter something you need to be able to actually play a card. If your chain stunned you don't get the opportunity to do anything, so beguile, or any other card is useless.

i really dont understand.....to my knowledge no one has ever been killed by a stun. and even with chain stun along with no damage you gain pips and can be ready for a big attack after. in the mean time the one doing the stunning cant do any thing else either like blade or trap. and loses pips in the mean time.
i do agree about treasure cards though....they should not be allowed in arena at all.
in the arena you need to use your school spells with the accuracy and power they were meant have. and be cast by by those in that school..

i dont use treasure cards in battle at all... i embrace my school and use every spell in my deck (including stun) to survive and even win.


It's not the stun spell that kills anyone, it's the rest of the team with the wizard casting choke/blinding light every round that kills the other team who never get to play a single card if they go second, or get to play one card if they go first.

There is another post about treasure cards, though choosing not to use all resources available to you is your decision. The issue here is not with treasure cards, but spells that do not allow the opposing team to play.

Survivor
Apr 26, 2009
22
fizzen wrote:
Gamma wrote:
Thank you for your input on the current state of the Player vs Player system.

I just wanted to let you know that we have changes to stun *in PvP* planned for a future update, and we are going to look at the 'treasure card factory' problem.




i really dont understand.....to my knowledge no one has ever been killed by a stun. and even with chain stun along with no damage you gain pips and can be ready for a big attack after. in the mean time the one doing the stunning cant do any thing else either like blade or trap. and loses pips in the mean time.
i do agree about treasure cards though....they should not be allowed in arena at all.
in the arena you need to use your school spells with the accuracy and power they were meant have. and be cast by by those in that school..

i dont use treasure cards in battle at all... i embrace my school and use every spell in my deck (including stun) to survive and even win.

valdus icestalker
grandmaster ice


They aren't talking about 1vs1, they are talking about 2vs2 and so on. While one of the team is chain stunning the other team member is shielding and damaging. The opposing team is rendered useless by the chain stunning.

Defender
Oct 03, 2008
174
Just to clarify, the chain stun doesn't kill you; one wizard immobilizes your whole team with the multi stun spells while his teammates rip you apart. You are left completely defenseless against this strategy because you are unable to play cards to defend yourself, and the wizard who keeps your team stunned will usually be a grandmaster with a 50%-70%+ pip chance who gets power pips virtually every turn, with another grandmaster, having equal power pip percentage, being a backup stunner.

Valkoor Crow
Grandmaster Necromancer

Survivor
Jul 09, 2008
9
Really it is more of a problem in team battles. No stun has ever killed me however a team of stunners has plenty of wizards to attack.


fizzen wrote:
Gamma wrote:
Thank you for your input on the current state of the Player vs Player system.

I just wanted to let you know that we have changes to stun *in PvP* planned for a future update, and we are going to look at the 'treasure card factory' problem.




i really dont understand.....to my knowledge no one has ever been killed by a stun. and even with chain stun along with no damage you gain pips and can be ready for a big attack after. in the mean time the one doing the stunning cant do any thing else either like blade or trap. and loses pips in the mean time.
i do agree about treasure cards though....they should not be allowed in arena at all.
in the arena you need to use your school spells with the accuracy and power they were meant have. and be cast by by those in that school..

i dont use treasure cards in battle at all... i embrace my school and use every spell in my deck (including stun) to survive and even win.

valdus icestalker
grandmaster ice

Survivor
Feb 16, 2009
26
once agian....o please
whats next? steal shield?
gamma gamma he cheated. every time i put on a shield he took it

or healing
every time i hit him he just healed no fair

now i do agree with no treasure cards in the arena. there is no reason for it
but leave the school spells alone.

just stop crying and load some stun in your deck...all the schools are balanced pretty well and stun is part of that.

i have never lost a match cause of stun(not counting the bug)
i just set back pip up and wait for them to fizzle or run out then boom.

and by the way i do maintain a capt rank for the most part.
not the best but pretty good if i do say.
and stun has nothing to do with it.....but ya want to talk about storm damage?
lol every school can point the finger at the other..
just play
win loose or draw just have fun

valdus icestalker
grandmaster ice

Survivor
Nov 18, 2008
1
I have kept silent about this flaw until now. For long have I enjoyed a decent PvP match where game was fair and each team holds and equal chance of victory. I faced a fire and ice wizard in PvP with my death and a balance wizard. Initially, stuns were used the entire time and we were rendered futile. We were also verbally abused about our dueling ability. For those of you who think this is a strategy, you probably utilize this method so you defend it. It is simply cheating as you stand no chance of victory. Clothes provide an increase in fizzle rates as well as keen eyes, etc. It is not difficult to create these cards. Perhaps limit the ability to stun, say one every two turns. Keep the final spell stuns as it takes several turns to use. Or simply make keen eyes etc a rare and expensive card not easily acquired. Today I faced an ice wizard who stunned me the entire time and saved up for a frost giant. Before long, I was faced with a little over seven hundred health and no chance of winning. I understand the changes being made but will this indefinately solve the problem. Will new ones arise I ask? This is a sad era in Wizard 101 and people who have recieved the best gear due to this flaw simply 'cheated' their way to the top dare I say. I say that because it is cheating. If it wasn't, this would not be problematic. I never chained stunned in my life and I refuse to participate because of it.

With little chance of fizzle, this is simply a 'broken' strategy. Packing the deck with stuns and treasure cards to boot will assure a stun or five in the hand. I have lost many points due to this and I find it diffucult to progress in the arena. Of course I could use this way of battle but I would be contradictory. I win as much as I lose and I cant seem to manage in the arena unless I am paired with an equal player(which I always seemed to be paired with a knight or commander and I am a veteran). Utterly horrific this is and I am quiet positive that if you are a warlord, you cheated. If you didn't chain stun or participate in it, I commend you for your valient efforts. You truly earned it with sheer skill and strategy at it's finest.

In further matters, why is the final myth spell a single hit as the rest of the schools have a hit all? I understand earthquake and the frog are multi hit but there are other schools with multi hit as well. While cinimatics are cool, this spell pales in comparison to the others. I think it should be a multi so it can rank with the other final spells.

Survivor
Dec 18, 2008
25
Catyana wrote:
It is not just the stuns that are killing the PVP, it is all the bonus attacks these cards get, such as the high damage fire does and then it damages for like the next 3 turns still. I played a life person yesterday, they did their high level 48 card, not only did it heal a high amount, it gave an absorb card and healed additionally for several more turns.

The initial attack on these cards should be more than sufficient, please drop the bonus stuff on them.

FYI I am a level 48 storm, so I am not complaining from a lower level standpoint, although I do have a lower level also.

just saying but uh that is kind of the point of the lvl 48 spells and just to let you know if you drop the added effects fire might as well use meteor strike cause same damage just 3 pips less cost?death would only hit 400 to one person? that would stink cause wraith is better. storm would just use tempest cause it around same damage as stormlord hitting all. so plz dont say to drop bonus effects

Survivor
May 26, 2009
4
people stun should not leave the game it hardly works however choke its chance of hitting should go down by twenty or more

Delver
Mar 15, 2009
203
If stunning is a school spell quit crying about it,Its like saying life person cant heal or storm school cant use stormlord,give it a rest stunning is a school spell so it can be used.

I dont have it I aint crying about it!

Michael RedBlood
Grandmaster Death

Survivor
Mar 29, 2009
8
I don't seem to get the big problem either, the spell stun is a school spell you can't do anything about it. I'm a grandmaser diviner (storm), and i mostly use storm lord, and it stuns all opponents (my favorite part), but i hate the stun shields, it makes me mad. But now wizard101 has made a new upgrade witch is stun shields, so it doesnt matter, except the fact you cant stun more that one time (unless four people use the stun spell). So quit crying about it and the hang of it

Defender
Jul 18, 2009
160
Firefly555 wrote:
To me stunning is a strategy as is tempest and judgement. I feel the problem with stunning comes from the treasure cards and the stunning bug. Please dont take stunning away from ice school they are by far the easiest to kill in the arena. I think a special deck for arena would be a good way to fix this problem. One that doesnt allow any treasure cards to be used except ones purchased at the arena.


Easiest to kill? Have you actually pvp'd at all? WOW. They have inherently the most health and nice shields also.

Besides life they are one of the hardest to kill.

Defender
Jul 18, 2009
160
cbfan14 wrote:

HELLO! I am sry for responding to this message board so late, but recently i have started competeing in the arena alot. i am a grandmaster ice wizard. when i started we didnt have the final spells now we do and all i hear is people talking about chain stunning. i persnally do not believe in it, but if there are going to be changes then all final spells should be looked at including rebirth. me and a friend lost a very tough match just yesterday. we both are ice wizards and refused to chain stun though if we had we could have just by doing one chain stun. but still we have honor, we lost due to four rebirths in a row! i am sry it may just be me down over over losing a fight, but come on! that is something that is less fair than any chain stun! me and my partner ran out of cards! if KI plans on fixing things in the arena then rebirth should be looked at also! really the best way to fix these problems would just to not allow the final spells in the arena that way everyone will be happy. really all the final spells have major advantages in the arena. or if not that then allow people to use final spells with no fear of a negative reaction!
Jonathan Icewhisper

Grandmaster Thaumatugre


Rebirth, unlike chain stuns, are easily countered. You can either use doom and gloom to cut the amount healed by half, use death attacks to ignore the absorb shields, and/or use attacks like earthquake to remove them. Against shain stuns, however, there is absolutely no defense. :(

Valkoor Crow
Grandmaster Necromancer

Um no. There are stun blocks in game.

Defender
Oct 03, 2008
174
Stun blocks didn't exist on the 5th of June, hiway1999; stun blocks weren't implemented until Grizzleheim, which was released around the beginning of July.

I'm glad KI implemented the stun blocks, it really balanced out group pvp.
It shows they're working hard to try to fix a lot of these issues. Stun blocks were a nice compromise, IMO, since those who like the culprit spells still get to use them, and the spells get to keep their effects. Mind you, chain stunning is still possible, it just takes more skill to pull off now.

Valkoor Crow
Grandmaster Necromancer

Survivor
Feb 21, 2009
5
Just to reinterate the problem. I lost match yesterday to 3 storm wizards and 1 life. The storm all set there for two rounds, didn't even bother shielding, then they would take turns using storm lord, one person per round. The life wizard has some spell that took away the stun shields, so they essentially kept us stunned from the time they attacked until we were dead. GET RID OF THE STUNS!!!!!!
I am level 50 fire, refuse to use my stun spells or the earthquake spell that comes with my clothing.

Defender
Jul 18, 2009
160
Brayjo7 wrote:
Just to reinterate the problem. I lost match yesterday to 3 storm wizards and 1 life. The storm all set there for two rounds, didn't even bother shielding, then they would take turns using storm lord, one person per round. The life wizard has some spell that took away the stun shields, so they essentially kept us stunned from the time they attacked until we were dead. GET RID OF THE STUNS!!!!!!
I am level 50 fire, refuse to use my stun spells or the earthquake spell that comes with my clothing.


Why don't you get someone in your group with stun shield?

Defender
Oct 03, 2008
174
hiway1999 wrote:
Brayjo7 wrote:
Just to reinterate the problem. I lost match yesterday to 3 storm wizards and 1 life. The storm all set there for two rounds, didn't even bother shielding, then they would take turns using storm lord, one person per round. The life wizard has some spell that took away the stun shields, so they essentially kept us stunned from the time they attacked until we were dead. GET RID OF THE STUNS!!!!!!
I am level 50 fire, refuse to use my stun spells or the earthquake spell that comes with my clothing.


Why don't you get someone in your group with stun shield?


Please read the posts carefully, his team DID have stun shields; they didn't help because the other team just kept removing all of their shields with earthquake (I know this because earthquake is the only spell that removes multiple shields).

Survivor
Aug 09, 2008
29
i am glad that KI made the stun shield bc it helps a lot. i don't get why storm wizards have a high-power attack and a stun. i personally think that ice should only get the stun because it has a low attack and it needs it more.