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No Chivalry In PvP

AuthorMessage
Survivor
Feb 21, 2010
26
People in pvp just have no chivalry
I refer to the Knights Code of Chivalry the code all knights followed and its a good example to people today

Some lines in it state that unfair fighting is wrong
Like:None shall sneak on an enemy and strike from behind
and Fight with honor
etc.

But most just declare that it a fair fight and the victor won a fair fight

and there is other polite stuff which can just effect the entire game
like be nice to women(i have seen people do these type of things)

But using treasures and bragging about a victory is just wrong
it makes things unfair and there is no fair winner

So really people be fair and polite

P.S. I do like these type of things like mythology and history

Chase DragonSpear Lv.70 Myth

Defender
Jun 14, 2010
158
carlcarl99 wrote:
People in pvp just have no chivalry
I refer to the Knights Code of Chivalry the code all knights followed and its a good example to people today

Some lines in it state that unfair fighting is wrong
Like:None shall sneak on an enemy and strike from behind
and Fight with honor
etc.

But most just declare that it a fair fight and the victor won a fair fight

and there is other polite stuff which can just effect the entire game
like be nice to women(i have seen people do these type of things)

But using treasures and bragging about a victory is just wrong
it makes things unfair and there is no fair winner

So really people be fair and polite

P.S. I do like these type of things like mythology and history

Chase DragonSpear Lv.70 Myth


I dont really get this post.
I know that sneak up from behind thing was just an example but still...
The game decides the rules. There is no choice.

So how exactly can one fight without honor?
We cant sneak up on other wizards and shoot spells at them.
We cant cheat by casting 2 spells at once.
We cant make an 8 pip spell casted with 4.
Where is this lost honor you speak of?
The game makes the rules. We follow them. Some people are better than others at making those rules work for them.

Treasure cards are NOT cheating. Everyone has access to them.
I mean seriouslly, people have been using treasures in PvP for years! Is this still a shock to some ppl?
Dont get mad about it. Instead, utilize the tools available to you.

Oh, and about the being nice to women comment..
1. I treat everyone in the game with respect - male or female.
2. I will not give a girl special treatment based on her sex. If she is kind, then so am I. If she is rude, I will blast her - as I would anyone.
3. In all probability, 3 out of 10 times that cute little girl is really a dude.

Cmon its the internet.

Champion
Jul 30, 2010
441
it is a good wish but, people will never cease to be rude .I have been called rude for a number of reasons, winning hitting a girl with a spell, and speaking, but that doesnt make it true.

Hero
Jun 08, 2009
793
While I agree that most PvP players are decidedly unchivalrous, I am not sure I see your point about treasure cards. They are a legitimate portion of the game, and it doesn't really mean you don't know how to fight. TC's are employed by duelists of all levels, if they were an illegitimate practice, KI would have blocked them from PvP.

Cya in the Spiral,

Paul Stormglade, Transcended Diviner

Go Sparks!

Mastermind
Jul 25, 2010
387
loki1201 wrote:
carlcarl99 wrote:
People in pvp just have no chivalry
I refer to the Knights Code of Chivalry the code all knights followed and its a good example to people today

Some lines in it state that unfair fighting is wrong
Like:None shall sneak on an enemy and strike from behind
and Fight with honor
etc.

But most just declare that it a fair fight and the victor won a fair fight

and there is other polite stuff which can just effect the entire game
like be nice to women(i have seen people do these type of things)

But using treasures and bragging about a victory is just wrong
it makes things unfair and there is no fair winner

So really people be fair and polite

P.S. I do like these type of things like mythology and history

Chase DragonSpear Lv.70 Myth


I dont really get this post.
I know that sneak up from behind thing was just an example but still...
The game decides the rules. There is no choice.

So how exactly can one fight without honor?
We cant sneak up on other wizards and shoot spells at them.
We cant cheat by casting 2 spells at once.
We cant make an 8 pip spell casted with 4.
Where is this lost honor you speak of?
The game makes the rules. We follow them. Some people are better than others at making those rules work for them.

Treasure cards are NOT cheating. Everyone has access to them.
I mean seriouslly, people have been using treasures in PvP for years! Is this still a shock to some ppl?
Dont get mad about it. Instead, utilize the tools available to you.

Oh, and about the being nice to women comment..
1. I treat everyone in the game with respect - male or female.
2. I will not give a girl special treatment based on her sex. If she is kind, then so am I. If she is rude, I will blast her - as I would anyone.
3. In all probability, 3 out of 10 times that cute little girl is really a dude.

Cmon its the internet.
Very good point i dont think anyone would think of what you just said Big Thumbs up!

Survivor
Jan 06, 2011
13
First off I will say I am not I big PvPer, so my experience is limited. My first Wizard was Death and when he was in the high teens and low twenties I did some Arena Dueling. About half the time it would be a "good" duel and about half the time the person I was dueling woudl whip out some crazy high level spell. At first I could not figure out how they were doing it. Then I learned about Treasure Cards. I stopped dueling because I could not fathom spending that much Gold on buying Treasure Cards to use in the Arena. Gold. ROFL. Now that my Death Wizard is in the mid-50's I have Gold coming out of my ears and it woudl be no problem to buy TC and pass them over to my other lower level Wizards or to low level friends so they could be over powered in the Arena. I don't because it just seems wrong and spoils what the Arena seems like it should be.

There would seem to be an extremely simple answer. Consider using Treasure Cards in the Sport of Dueling to be like using steroids or other performance enhancers and just ban them. Dueling each other in the Arena should be about what we can do as Wizards ourselves, not what some High Level Friend/Patron can fill our sideboard with. Maybe allow TC's which you can cast normally, but not anything which you do not have normal access to. It puts new players who do not have High Level Alts or Friends at a tremendous and unfair disadvantage. It is also one which I do not think an actual Sport would allow in its regulations.

Here is another idea... What about two kinds of Duels?

In a "Normal" duel you would not be able to Treasure Cards or your normal Gear. There would be a standard collection of "Arena Gear" of various levels you could choose from which was all "No Sell, No Trade, Arena Only". The "No TC" aspects could be easily addressed by just having the "Arena Decks" have a sideboard of 0. This makes it all about your skill as a Wizard not the size of your bankroll.

An "Unlimited" duel woudl be just that... anything goes. Equipment, Treasure Cards, etc... Unless you have deep pockets yourself or have a Patron you would be best advised to stay away.

Thoughts?

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
carlcarl99 wrote:
People in pvp just have no chivalry
I refer to the Knights Code of Chivalry the code all knights followed and its a good example to people today

Some lines in it state that unfair fighting is wrong
Like:None shall sneak on an enemy and strike from behind
and Fight with honor
etc.

But most just declare that it a fair fight and the victor won a fair fight

and there is other polite stuff which can just effect the entire game
like be nice to women(i have seen people do these type of things)

But using treasures and bragging about a victory is just wrong
it makes things unfair and there is no fair winner

So really people be fair and polite

P.S. I do like these type of things like mythology and history

Chase DragonSpear Lv.70 Myth


Carlcarl99,

Since you like history, here is a bit on the Knights Code of Chivalry .
Early on, there was no Knights Code of Chivalry , it was brought in by the Church. This was to control the Maylays (sp?) because of the number of Knights that were killing knights in these power battles. (example, an English Knight would kill another English Knight in a Maylay).

Even though the English Knights held this code, the French did not accept it till much later. Many Knights of Europe did not accept it at all.

Battle of Hasting, I believe 1066, when the Skeletons of the people in the battle were looked at (at around the year of 2001), 89% were kill from the back. This was about the same number (percentage) in some of the other battles in England.
Showing that few really followed the Knights code.

Kind of reminds you of PvP doesn't it, no code is followed.

Joe.
Joseph LionHunter.

Champion
Apr 18, 2010
403
Survivor
Jan 06, 2011
13
The analogy between an Arena Duel and the Battlefield seems flawed. It is more formalized, etc... like a Sport. As such it can have Rules & Regulations. Sometimes those are even added to forbid tactics which are too effective and thus damaging to the Sport. American Football has several things like this. Or look at Fencing if you want something closer to "dueling". Lots of rules, especially if you look at Foil rather than Epee.

Champion
Apr 18, 2010
403
TrainBoyDad wrote:
The analogy between an Arena Duel and the Battlefield seems flawed. It is more formalized, etc... like a Sport. As such it can have Rules & Regulations. Sometimes those are even added to forbid tactics which are too effective and thus damaging to the Sport. American Football has several things like this. Or look at Fencing if you want something closer to "dueling". Lots of rules, especially if you look at Foil rather than Epee.


I agree. Me being an Epee fencer, really dont care about where I hit, but when I fence foil, I usually try to take my time, and remember the rules, just like in the arena in PvP. But in Wiz, I would consider myself an Saber, cause I try to end it quickly.

Survivor
Feb 21, 2010
26
The examples i gave were for thing i saw ad are just examples of stuff in the code

When i mean no honor and treasures
I meant that treasures are ruining pvp
I used to PvP i bet a whole lot of others

But spammers killed PvP for us

If people want PvP to be a part of this game
then they have to stop killing it for others

Here is an example
Player 1: no gold no treasures
Player 2: tons of cash a ton of treasures

Player 2 is going to win

People make fun of others when they lose even if they were close to winning

The good thing for me is that i started racing and i am actually good at it

Hero
Jun 08, 2009
793
carlcarl99 wrote:
The examples i gave were for thing i saw ad are just examples of stuff in the code

When i mean no honor and treasures
I meant that treasures are ruining pvp
I used to PvP i bet a whole lot of others
Reply: If you don't like PvP, then why are you wasting time complaining about it? Have fun doing PvE, win a rare pet or two.

But spammers killed PvP for us

If people want PvP to be a part of this game
then they have to stop killing it for others
Reply: People will fight how they fight, and you can't exactly threaten to remove PvP unless you get over 10 million players on your side.Here is an example
Player 1: no gold no treasures
Player 2: tons of cash a ton of treasures

Player 2 is going to win
Reply: Not a definite. If player 1 is a PvP Private with no idea how to use what they have, and Player 2 is an experienced PvP player with a good strategy and card setup, the outcome will be the opposite. I know several Warlords who never bother with Treasure Cards.
People make fun of others when they lose even if they were close to winning
Reply: Even Kingsisle said that they can't enforce good manners, thus scamming and insults are not punishable offenses. Bad winners and sore losers are out there. The only way to win this war against them is not to fight.
The good thing for me is that i started racing and i am actually good at it Reply: Good for you. Now that you have something else to do, you can stop complaining on this board.
All comments in above quote.

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
TrainBoyDad wrote:
The analogy between an Arena Duel and the Battlefield seems flawed. It is more formalized, etc... like a Sport. As such it can have Rules & Regulations. Sometimes those are even added to forbid tactics which are too effective and thus damaging to the Sport. American Football has several things like this. Or look at Fencing if you want something closer to "dueling". Lots of rules, especially if you look at Foil rather than Epee.


TrainBoyDad,

I think you missed what I was trying to point out in my history lesson.
All battles have rule that are followed, if you break them, you most likely don't live to see the next day. If you question that, please come talk to my Dad (Gulf War Vet) or Grandfather (Vnam Vet).
I was not talking about Rules or Regulation, or the Rules in place that KI has put into the Coding of the game.
The point I was trying to make was directly related to chivalry that the church brought into the Knights back around 700-800 AD. I was trying to state that Chivalry was seldom if ever used on the real battlefield.
As stated by Carl, it seem to be seldom seen in PvP now days.

Joe.

Survivor
Feb 21, 2010
26
How this world has changed
Before there was peace(except for civilization wars)
and now there is rude people and others disregarding peoples posts

Hero
Jun 08, 2009
793
carlcarl99 wrote:
How this world has changed
Before there was peace(except for civilization wars)
and now there is rude people and others disregarding peoples posts
We're not disregarding your post, we're arguing it. In my eyes, it's pretty clear this is a cleverly disguised rant about Treasure Cards in PvP. You're entitled to an opinion, however, so are we! If you only want opinions that agree with yours, well, then, sorry but that isn't how it works.

Survivor
Jan 06, 2011
13
I posted a long diatribe on this I don't want to repeat, but I think it would be interesting to have two PvP options. One which does not allow TC and possibly only allows "stock" equipment and another like it is now where "Anything Goes". If you don't have the cash to blow then play in the stock league. Or if you think you are good enough to take "stock" gear and go up against players in the "unlimited" arena then go for it. Talk about Bragging Rights! :)

Survivor
Feb 21, 2010
26
bionaknight wrote:
carlcarl99 wrote:
How this world has changed
Before there was peace(except for civilization wars)
and now there is rude people and others disregarding peoples posts
We're not disregarding your post, we're arguing it. In my eyes, it's pretty clear this is a cleverly disguised rant about Treasure Cards in PvP. You're entitled to an opinion, however, so are we! If you only want opinions that agree with yours, well, then, sorry but that isn't how it works.


I meant its going on all over
in real life
sometimes here

Champion
May 03, 2011
447
Well, I am still a neophyte PvP-er, but I do know about chivalry in relation to medieval history (that's my professional field). Essentially, Joe is right--the so-called Code of Chivalry was a literary invention. In the Middle Ages, the aristocracy was basically making life miserable for everyone, especially in France, which lacked a strong monarch. They constantly fought, and the peasants and townspeople were caught in the middle of these violent-but-petty squabbles and power-grabs. So, writers--who were paid by the nobility (there weren't any publishers--or printing, for that matter, so no one made money on writing unless they wrote under the patronage of a nobleman, who paid them)--basically set about redeeming the bad rep of these warring nobles, by creating a fantasy called the "code of chivalry." In the stories, nobles abide by certain rules--no backstabbing, no oath-breaking etc. They rescue the downtrodden and honor women--at least aristocratic women. They are virtuous and honorable.

The reality was more brutal, and more in keeping with warfare throughout history--winning is everything, and you do whatever you can to beat the other guy. Then you take all his stuff and burn down his house.

That said, better manners would make the game (not just PvP) more enjoyable. Honor isn't a dead ideal, but it's definitely not something a lot of people understand or value these days. I guess my suggestion would be to act honorably yourself, and lead by example. Maybe it will prove contagious. :-)

Tabitha

Hero
Jun 08, 2009
793
carlcarl99 wrote:
bionaknight wrote:
carlcarl99 wrote:
How this world has changed
Before there was peace(except for civilization wars)
and now there is rude people and others disregarding peoples posts
We're not disregarding your post, we're arguing it. In my eyes, it's pretty clear this is a cleverly disguised rant about Treasure Cards in PvP. You're entitled to an opinion, however, so are we! If you only want opinions that agree with yours, well, then, sorry but that isn't how it works.


I meant its going on all over
in real life
sometimes here
Rude people are everywhere, true, but it's sort of hard to disregard a post outside of a message board. And since this is the threat you posted this in, I can only assume you were referring to our responses. Sorry if I misunderstood, I'm just stating how this looks to me.

Hero
Jan 24, 2010
705
LOLZ, I hope there's no chivalry in PvP, otherwise we'd all have to pay obeisance to a particular religious figure and probably engage in a little witch burning and torture on the side. See, chivalry was not POLITE or CONSIDERATE of anyone who disagreed with the divinely anointed king, and his knights were meant to enforce his divine will.

Anyway, chivalry is dead, and I'm glad of it. Now, if we could just get some civility in PvP, we'd make progress.

Qbb/Scarlet, Moira

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
loki1201 wrote:
carlcarl99 wrote:
People in pvp just have no chivalry
I refer to the Knights Code of Chivalry the code all knights followed and its a good example to people today

Some lines in it state that unfair fighting is wrong
Like:None shall sneak on an enemy and strike from behind
and Fight with honor
etc.

But most just declare that it a fair fight and the victor won a fair fight

and there is other polite stuff which can just effect the entire game
like be nice to women(i have seen people do these type of things)

But using treasures and bragging about a victory is just wrong
it makes things unfair and there is no fair winner

So really people be fair and polite

P.S. I do like these type of things like mythology and history

Chase DragonSpear Lv.70 Myth


I dont really get this post.
I know that sneak up from behind thing was just an example but still...
The game decides the rules. There is no choice.

So how exactly can one fight without honor?
We cant sneak up on other wizards and shoot spells at them.
We cant cheat by casting 2 spells at once.
We cant make an 8 pip spell casted with 4.
Where is this lost honor you speak of?
The game makes the rules. We follow them. Some people are better than others at making those rules work for them.

Treasure cards are NOT cheating. Everyone has access to them.
I mean seriouslly, people have been using treasures in PvP for years! Is this still a shock to some ppl?
Dont get mad about it. Instead, utilize the tools available to you.

Oh, and about the being nice to women comment..
1. I treat everyone in the game with respect - male or female.
2. I will not give a girl special treatment based on her sex. If she is kind, then so am I. If she is rude, I will blast her - as I would anyone.
3. In all probability, 3 out of 10 times that cute little girl is really a dude.

Cmon its the internet.
well said Loki! You've just saved me the pain of ranting on for a day, and I Ty for that :)

Champion
Apr 18, 2010
403
travisAk wrote:
loki1201 wrote:
carlcarl99 wrote:
People in pvp just have no chivalry
I refer to the Knights Code of Chivalry the code all knights followed and its a good example to people today

Some lines in it state that unfair fighting is wrong
Like:None shall sneak on an enemy and strike from behind
and Fight with honor
etc.

But most just declare that it a fair fight and the victor won a fair fight

and there is other polite stuff which can just effect the entire game
like be nice to women(i have seen people do these type of things)

But using treasures and bragging about a victory is just wrong
it makes things unfair and there is no fair winner

So really people be fair and polite

P.S. I do like these type of things like mythology and history

Chase DragonSpear Lv.70 Myth


I dont really get this post.
I know that sneak up from behind thing was just an example but still...
The game decides the rules. There is no choice.

So how exactly can one fight without honor?
We cant sneak up on other wizards and shoot spells at them.
We cant cheat by casting 2 spells at once.
We cant make an 8 pip spell casted with 4.
Where is this lost honor you speak of?
The game makes the rules. We follow them. Some people are better than others at making those rules work for them.

Treasure cards are NOT cheating. Everyone has access to them.
I mean seriouslly, people have been using treasures in PvP for years! Is this still a shock to some ppl?
Dont get mad about it. Instead, utilize the tools available to you.

Oh, and about the being nice to women comment..
1. I treat everyone in the game with respect - male or female.
2. I will not give a girl special treatment based on her sex. If she is kind, then so am I. If she is rude, I will blast her - as I would anyone.
3. In all probability, 3 out of 10 times that cute little girl is really a dude.

Cmon its the internet.
well said Loki! You've just saved me the pain of ranting on for a day, and I Ty for that :)


And carlcarl09, we arent disregarding your post, so dont consider this little correction an insult, we're just saying it how it is, like i said before chivalry is dead. Chivarly was around almost a millineum ago, times have changed.....