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Level 100 Ice is a joke

AuthorMessage
Survivor
Apr 10, 2011
2
As you all know, Ice is a tanky school with tons of health, resist, and critical block. While those stats are high, we suffer in attack and critical. However, ever since the addition of Aquila, Ice has lost a lot of the characteristics that make them such a tank school. Ice now has to focus on outputting damage, which they can't really do since they have such low attack, and blocking criticals, which is also very hard because everyone has up to twice as much critical as we do block AND they usually use shrike, which pierces through 50% PLUS what they have and possibly infallible. I will list the current stats of the Malistaire hat, robe, and boots for Ice below.

Hood of the Cold Hearted

+619 Health
+10% Power Pip Chance
+3% Global Armor Pierce
+14% Global Resist
+119 Ice Critical
+10% Ice Damage
+5% Shadow Damage
+2% Shadow Pip Bonus

Armor of the Cold Hearted
+975 Health
+9% Power Pip Chance
+12% Ice Accuracy
+13% Ice Damage
+16% Resist
+76 Ice Critical
+2% Shadow Pip Bonus

Shoes of the Cold Hearted

+368 Health
+8% Power Pip Chance
+5% Global Accuracy
+3% Global Armor Pierce
+105 Critical Block
+12% Global Resist
+13 Ice Damage
+1% Shadow Pip Bonus

You may think, "Oh those stats are nice, what's the problem?" The problem is ALL of the OTHER top tier gear sets. Every other school get enough accuracy to get above 100% BUT Ice. Every other school gets +105 block to their boots, averaging out block for every school. Every school gets 95 global block and 100 global critical rating on their best wand, averaging out the block even more. Storm gets 25% accuracy from just their Mally robe. TWENTY FIVE PERCENT. What does ice get in total from their ENTIRE set? ONLY 17! Why does the school that is supposed to have super high damage but low accuracy get the most accuracy? That's so unfair! Also, ever since the jewels update, storm can easily reach around 30-45 to maybe even 50 storm pierce WITHOUT SPELLS. That renders Ice's resist useless because they can add shrike, infallible, and their pierce bubble. Ice also only gets 36% damage from the whole set, and require the alpha and omega ring and blade of the felled titan or whatever the first boss in the graveyard drops. I just want KingsIsle to stop making this game focused on who can output more damage faster, and instead balance it out. Storm shouldn't be able to get 350+ block, and Ice should be able to tank more, and if every other school should get perfect accuracy, so should Ice. A good fix to this would to make storm's malistaire wand get +50-75 block with 100-125 critical, while Ice's should give +100-150 block and 75-90 critical. If this was implemented, the pierce should also be changed to be equal on every wand. Also one more thing, Ice has no "ice heals", meaning they have to rely on a pet ( which takes up a spot for damage or resist ), or on a life mastery amulet ( which removes the possibility of using the Morganthe amulet that gives critical, block, pierce, and health(?)). Please fix this.

Mastermind
Nov 19, 2014
365
Michael Trollgiver on Jul 3, 2015 wrote:
As you all know, Ice is a tanky school with tons of health, resist, and critical block. While those stats are high, we suffer in attack and critical. However, ever since the addition of Aquila, Ice has lost a lot of the characteristics that make them such a tank school. Ice now has to focus on outputting damage, which they can't really do since they have such low attack, and blocking criticals, which is also very hard because everyone has up to twice as much critical as we do block AND they usually use shrike, which pierces through 50% PLUS what they have and possibly infallible. I will list the current stats of the Malistaire hat, robe, and boots for Ice below.

Hood of the Cold Hearted

+619 Health
+10% Power Pip Chance
+3% Global Armor Pierce
+14% Global Resist
+119 Ice Critical
+10% Ice Damage
+5% Shadow Damage
+2% Shadow Pip Bonus

Armor of the Cold Hearted
+975 Health
+9% Power Pip Chance
+12% Ice Accuracy
+13% Ice Damage
+16% Resist
+76 Ice Critical
+2% Shadow Pip Bonus

Shoes of the Cold Hearted

+368 Health
+8% Power Pip Chance
+5% Global Accuracy
+3% Global Armor Pierce
+105 Critical Block
+12% Global Resist
+13 Ice Damage
+1% Shadow Pip Bonus

You may think, "Oh those stats are nice, what's the problem?" The problem is ALL of the OTHER top tier gear sets. Every other school get enough accuracy to get above 100% BUT Ice. Every other school gets +105 block to their boots, averaging out block for every school. Every school gets 95 global block and 100 global critical rating on their best wand, averaging out the block even more. Storm gets 25% accuracy from just their Mally robe. TWENTY FIVE PERCENT. What does ice get in total from their ENTIRE set? ONLY 17! Why does the school that is supposed to have super high damage but low accuracy get the most accuracy? That's so unfair! Also, ever since the jewels update, storm can easily reach around 30-45 to maybe even 50 storm pierce WITHOUT SPELLS. That renders Ice's resist useless because they can add shrike, infallible, and their pierce bubble. Ice also only gets 36% damage from the whole set, and require the alpha and omega ring and blade of the felled titan or whatever the first boss in the graveyard drops. I just want KingsIsle to stop making this game focused on who can output more damage faster, and instead balance it out. Storm shouldn't be able to get 350+ block, and Ice should be able to tank more, and if every other school should get perfect accuracy, so should Ice. A good fix to this would to make storm's malistaire wand get +50-75 block with 100-125 critical, while Ice's should give +100-150 block and 75-90 critical. If this was implemented, the pierce should also be changed to be equal on every wand. Also one more thing, Ice has no "ice heals", meaning they have to rely on a pet ( which takes up a spot for damage or resist ), or on a life mastery amulet ( which removes the possibility of using the Morganthe amulet that gives critical, block, pierce, and health(?)). Please fix this.
I agree (wish there new tank gear) for ice wizard so, useless to use armor pierce!

don't go for armor pierce (because bad talent) wish new gear for tank for exalted (had 999resist) so, take on armor pierce XD for being rude to tank wizard calling TANK useless unless wizard101 made new talent (resist some of armor pierce) jewel resist won't either help no real percent resist but wish it was then able (most highest resist of being immunity to ice by being school of ice? & fire resist be deadly also clued balance

Explorer
Apr 26, 2010
62
It is way harder to tank now than before Aquila, but that was necessary to stop the 6 hour long jadezilla battles. It does sort of lower Ice's value in team pvp, but in 1v1 they are fine.

Geographer
Dec 16, 2009
947
I had to laugh when I read this. Storm should have lower block? Storm is absolutely 100% dead if it cannot block a critical due to it's low health buffer. As for accuracy- Simply equip a jewel and viola Ice has more than perfect accuracy. When it comes to damage output Ice is no slouch. An infallible or bubble and a winter moon to Abominable Weaver combo will completely defeat storm. Storm cannot do the same to Ice under a bubble or infallible with storm lord-bugs combo unless one of those criticals. I can agree with giving Ice more block on its wand but NOT at the cost of storm's block. As for healing- I firmly believe every class should have an ability to heal itself and I hope ki is working towards a solution.

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
Team yoloswag on Jul 4, 2015 wrote:
It is way harder to tank now than before Aquila, but that was necessary to stop the 6 hour long jadezilla battles. It does sort of lower Ice's value in team pvp, but in 1v1 they are fine.
Just can't agree with that, as Ice is a low Tier 2 school, at best.

They can't block Fire, Balance or Life more than 35% of the time, and Storm even less.
They can't heal if they use the Morgan Amulet, and if they use the Life they can't block.
Their Critical is terrible, and when they don't have the solid resist they use to have, all
they can do is relay on their health. So, they are locked into trying to stack blades and
one shot their Shadow Weaver before they die.

So, yes they are a second Tier school, but I would clearly put them below or at best equal to Death.
Ice should have been given enough block to hold off most of the hits. It should have been given
a 65% base resist, or a bit more. As it is, it's stuck between a rock and a hard place, with only one
option to 1v1.

Bottom line, there is no reason to have limited ice in this way, none.
Just as there is no reason to still have the first turn advantage, none.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
Veracity8 on Jul 5, 2015 wrote:
Just can't agree with that, as Ice is a low Tier 2 school, at best.

They can't block Fire, Balance or Life more than 35% of the time, and Storm even less.
They can't heal if they use the Morgan Amulet, and if they use the Life they can't block.
Their Critical is terrible, and when they don't have the solid resist they use to have, all
they can do is relay on their health. So, they are locked into trying to stack blades and
one shot their Shadow Weaver before they die.

So, yes they are a second Tier school, but I would clearly put them below or at best equal to Death.
Ice should have been given enough block to hold off most of the hits. It should have been given
a 65% base resist, or a bit more. As it is, it's stuck between a rock and a hard place, with only one
option to 1v1.

Bottom line, there is no reason to have limited ice in this way, none.
Just as there is no reason to still have the first turn advantage, none.
In my opinion, Ice is still an effective 1v1 school when it comes to fighting lower tier schools (and Balance). Though Ice has troubles dealing low pip damage, its 5 pip game is nowhere behind any of the other schools. Its use in Icebird treasure cards and Shrike already makes Ice a solid offensive school.

What I do differently on my Ice wizard is use my resources. A Feint, Shrike, and possibly an Icebird blade from before the use of Feint is sure to make Abominable Weaver a large damage spike. Though Ice is not very strong in keeping a low pip damage reliant game (due to the existence of large armor pierce among the other schools), it is still an extremely powerful OHKO school in that it has the highest blades in the game, and the most effective attack and blade spell.

If you compare Ice to Storm or Myth, those 2 schools can't even use Feint effectively as they don't have a large health pool to sit back on. If schools in general were simply given more defensive gear options, this crater of a tier division would finally dissipate.

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
PvP King on Jul 6, 2015 wrote:
In my opinion, Ice is still an effective 1v1 school when it comes to fighting lower tier schools (and Balance). Though Ice has troubles dealing low pip damage, its 5 pip game is nowhere behind any of the other schools. Its use in Icebird treasure cards and Shrike already makes Ice a solid offensive school.

What I do differently on my Ice wizard is use my resources. A Feint, Shrike, and possibly an Icebird blade from before the use of Feint is sure to make Abominable Weaver a large damage spike. Though Ice is not very strong in keeping a low pip damage reliant game (due to the existence of large armor pierce among the other schools), it is still an extremely powerful OHKO school in that it has the highest blades in the game, and the most effective attack and blade spell.

If you compare Ice to Storm or Myth, those 2 schools can't even use Feint effectively as they don't have a large health pool to sit back on. If schools in general were simply given more defensive gear options, this crater of a tier division would finally dissipate.
PvPKing,

“In my opinion, Ice is still an effective 1v1 school when it comes to fighting lower tier schools (and Balance). Though Ice has troubles dealing low pip damage, its 5 pip game is nowhere behind any of the other schools. Its use in Icebird treasure cards and Shrike already makes Ice a solid offensive school.”

Effective against lower Tier schools, but that only leaves Myth and Storm.

Fire and Life, is a no brainer, Ice has a limit chance against either.
Balance normally keeps Life in the Side, on elucidate, for a quick heal. Not using
their own heals at all for Ice, unless there is no other option. I still see Balance as having
an edge on most Ice that need solid pips to combo.

Since Ice’s resist is down at 65%, and Storm has a solid 50% or more pierce, Ice can
Quickly run into trouble. My Ice has been hit for over 5000 by a critical storm.
(My Balance has too, Storm is a Glass cannon that can run luck streaks).

Having high health is not the only item that Ice needs in the current meta.
I think that Eric may feel that it’s a key, but I see the High Health as a minimal requirement with
the weak hits, low critical, low critical block and loss of resist to fire and storm.

Death is an even match for Ice, I usually call this a toss of who is first.

Myth, ok, Ice can usually crush myth if it gets a Stun block up.

Now, giving that I may not get a Shadow pips for 10 rounds, as Ice I have no Offense.
My Defense has been cut down to almost the lowest of any player, imo. This is what bothers me,
In it’s own way KI has forced Ice to battle in a certain way. Therefore it has no options and everyone
Knows exactly what is headed their way.

I agree, Ice can Power spike with a Feint, but is that all that Ice has become in this meta? Plus, when
Ice is second, the counters are so easy on Ice.

Ice was a solid top tier school back at 60-70-80 and maybe 90,
why give it a short end of the stick at 100?

Survivor
Oct 01, 2013
29
Delver
Dec 04, 2013
215
I agree, Exalted Ice is a joke. They have merely health that keeps them alive with all these storms running around. Ppl used to complain about Ice's OP resist back in the Avalon days and we still use that as an accuse to nerf Ice. The thing is, resist is basically dead at exalted(Thanks to storm). The average storm has 57% pierce. Add that with shrike and you've got a dead ice. I've noticed that with the new Ultra Dungeons update, Ice is starting to get back on its feet which is good but storm still has the upper hand. Ty, KI, for giving Ice a little push.

Geographer
Dec 16, 2009
947
Shadow 343 on Jul 17, 2015 wrote:
I agree, Exalted Ice is a joke. They have merely health that keeps them alive with all these storms running around. Ppl used to complain about Ice's OP resist back in the Avalon days and we still use that as an accuse to nerf Ice. The thing is, resist is basically dead at exalted(Thanks to storm). The average storm has 57% pierce. Add that with shrike and you've got a dead ice. I've noticed that with the new Ultra Dungeons update, Ice is starting to get back on its feet which is good but storm still has the upper hand. Ty, KI, for giving Ice a little push.
More made up statistics? Which gear is the average storm using that gives them 57% pierce. Average storm has 52% pierce and ice still has a huge advantage over storm due to the fact that it has literally 70%+ more health than storm.

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
Eric Stormbringer on Jul 18, 2015 wrote:
More made up statistics? Which gear is the average storm using that gives them 57% pierce. Average storm has 52% pierce and ice still has a huge advantage over storm due to the fact that it has literally 70%+ more health than storm.
I only got 51% pierce on my storm, so i'm complaining, I need the other 1% to compete.
On the flip side of this, when I critical bug and hit for over 4000, Ice doesn't seem so intimidating.

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1611
Veracity8 on Jul 23, 2015 wrote:
I only got 51% pierce on my storm, so i'm complaining, I need the other 1% to compete.
On the flip side of this, when I critical bug and hit for over 4000, Ice doesn't seem so intimidating.
Veracity, I feel like you're making Ice seem weaker than what it really is. Ice's Shadow Enhanced Spell gives a 75% shield after the attack. In contrary to Storm's Shadow Enhanced Spell, is does nothing but merely remove blades, something of which Ice does not rely on at max level, aside from Icebird. Ice still has a 3000 health difference higher than Storm, as the average Ice wizard will have ~7100 health (1300 higher than its runner-up, Life) and the average Storm wizard barely has 4000. I see many a times a Storm wizard facing an Ice wizard, and the Ice wizard usually takes the 16 rank home.

The only schools Ice really struggles against are Life and Fire, Ice can very well hold its own against any Balance wizard, and is probably the best second tier school. An Ice wizard who carries Steal Ward and is smart enough to time a Hungry Caterpillar can also make effective use of Life's 800 absorb, and Ice has the very tools it needs to tank a Fire wizard. Ice is still a very strong school in Exalted PvP, and I believe that schools in the "dead tier" (Storm and Myth) need more attention than something like Ice.

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
PvP King on Jul 24, 2015 wrote:
Veracity, I feel like you're making Ice seem weaker than what it really is. Ice's Shadow Enhanced Spell gives a 75% shield after the attack. In contrary to Storm's Shadow Enhanced Spell, is does nothing but merely remove blades, something of which Ice does not rely on at max level, aside from Icebird. Ice still has a 3000 health difference higher than Storm, as the average Ice wizard will have ~7100 health (1300 higher than its runner-up, Life) and the average Storm wizard barely has 4000. I see many a times a Storm wizard facing an Ice wizard, and the Ice wizard usually takes the 16 rank home.

The only schools Ice really struggles against are Life and Fire, Ice can very well hold its own against any Balance wizard, and is probably the best second tier school. An Ice wizard who carries Steal Ward and is smart enough to time a Hungry Caterpillar can also make effective use of Life's 800 absorb, and Ice has the very tools it needs to tank a Fire wizard. Ice is still a very strong school in Exalted PvP, and I believe that schools in the "dead tier" (Storm and Myth) need more attention than something like Ice.
I agree that Ice is capable of holding it's own, but not as they rank up. Once you get a skilled Fire, Life or
or Balance, Ice is most likely going to lose. Ice up to 1300 is fine, but once you get a bit beyond that, Ice
starts to show it's weakness. The mistakes that a 900 warlord makes are not there at 1500.

Death can be very effective against an Ice, even at the 1300 mark, and at Level 100, Ice's incredible
Health buffer can be taken very quickly.

If KI feels that is all that is needed in todays 1v1, I would like to tell them they are wrong.
Take two even players, and the Fire, Life and Balance are most likely going to win.
Not that Ice can't pull it off, but it's just not as likely.

Ice and Death are pretty much an even match, at any rank, it just depends on who is first.

I don't feel that Storm is on the low end of the totem pole, I very much feel that they are not
that far away from Ice. A storm that knows how to keep a small deck, with enough shields, is
very effective. Fire and Balance are there main enemy, Balance because of Mana burn.

Myth, well, I agree, they do need help, actually a lot of it.