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Has everyone gone insane?

AuthorMessage
Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548

KI,

I have a friend who made warlord at lvl 1 using nothing but this new version of bolt you have made available to all levels. It was easy for him because of the lower than expected backfire rate.

Now for serious low level duelists insane bolt can be easily countered with resist but my question to you (KI) is this: Don't you think this treasure card is a little too much for most lower level pvp players considering it hits for more health then your opponent?

Anybody with common sence understands that this spell can instantly kill you so it should be used only in desperate situations. The problem here is that there are alot of people desperate to rank up and they use this card first chance they get and in every single match essentially ruining it for alot of people.

Wild bolt was a problem, I believe this new version you guys have made is telling players they don't have to learn strategy at low levels and can one hit an opponent for a price. Not a good message in the opinion of a serious pvp player.

I watched a match recently and it went like this

Round 1
Player 1-Balance blade
Player 2-death blade

Round 2
Player 1-insane bolt
Player 2-dead

Two rounds guys? Something's got to give considering people can't even learn the only defense (tower) until lvl 16???

This is an issue and should be looked at IMO

Some fixes
1)PvP only trained spell -50 moon damage (1 training point)
2) level restrict it
3) nerf it like Talos

I've been quiet lately because things have been good but this new trend of kill or be killed is getting a little bit lame.

3)




Delver
Oct 05, 2010
248
I agree, sincerely overall I think insane bolt needs its backfire rate increased in one battle I had been hit with 5 insane bolts and obviously lost. Maybe 40% is better seeing as the chances still favor the person casting the bolt but with enough backfire rate so as it does not always hit the other opponent. Isn't insane bolt made to be a last resort move? I'm seeing it more as a spam now.

Adherent
Mar 18, 2009
2646
I've always been a fan of anything goes in the arena, since gladiators of old never complained (or never had the chance to) about facing more experienced gladiators or whether shields, bare hands, spears, lions, chariots were in the arena with them either. Kill or be killed, those were the only rules.

But seeing how Talos was ultimately made no PvP, how come the other Wintertusk spells didn't either (or become level restricted)???

Armiger
May 10, 2010
2080
Tower shield may be a level 16 trained spell, but it can be purchased at both the Library and the Bazaar at any level for a -55% to the next incoming spell.

Add in resistance and this treasure tower shield and Insane bolt will only do between 400 and 450 damage, which can easily be healed with Pixie or Fairy.

When enough people learn this strategy and start using it, Insane bolt becomes a useless spam strategy as Power pips are not usually given at low level PvP, therefore it is easy to shield and heal.

If enough people use this strategy to defeat those Insane Bolt spammers, it will no longer be used, because the only thing Insane bolt will be good for is defeating yourself.

However, most people still have to learn the counter to this scenario.

Hero
Jun 08, 2009
793
TheDarkestMask wrote:
I agree, sincerely overall I think insane bolt needs its backfire rate increased in one battle I had been hit with 5 insane bolts and obviously lost. Maybe 40% is better seeing as the chances still favor the person casting the bolt but with enough backfire rate so as it does not always hit the other opponent. Isn't insane bolt made to be a last resort move? I'm seeing it more as a spam now.
Here we go..... Insane Bolt has a backfire rate, some people are luckier then others. I personally use this only when things look dire. Not bleak, not somewhat dim, dire. Give a plyaer a new spell, and they will use it. It's dangerous enough as is, 40% would make it barely worth using. Kingsisle, I implore you, please do not change Insane Bolt! That would be judging all Diviners by the actions of a few....

Geographer
Aug 28, 2010
957
darthjt wrote:
Tower shield may be a level 16 trained spell, but it can be purchased at both the Library and the Bazaar at any level for a -55% to the next incoming spell.

Add in resistance and this treasure tower shield and Insane bolt will only do between 400 and 450 damage, which can easily be healed with Pixie or Fairy.

When enough people learn this strategy and start using it, Insane bolt becomes a useless spam strategy as Power pips are not usually given at low level PvP, therefore it is easy to shield and heal.

If enough people use this strategy to defeat those Insane Bolt spammers, it will no longer be used, because the only thing Insane bolt will be good for is defeating yourself.

However, most people still have to learn the counter to this scenario.


Actually I would expect it to do less than that with a -55 tower and commander gear.
Just for the fun of it, I now carry Insane bolt in my Side deck for one reason. Anyone that uses Insane bolt on me, I write down their name and their pet name. The next time I see them, guess what they get.....?

Joe.

Mastermind
Jul 25, 2010
387
the only reason why Ki kept it for pvp because the back fire effect can apparently balance the game.

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
darthjt wrote:
Tower shield may be a level 16 trained spell, but it can be purchased at both the Library and the Bazaar at any level for a -55% to the next incoming spell.

Add in resistance and this treasure tower shield and Insane bolt will only do between 400 and 450 damage, which can easily be healed with Pixie or Fairy.
True but in first position the insaner could wand then kill his opponent by the second round. Are you suggesting the solution to spaming insane bolt first and second round killings in low level pvp is to spam a treasure tower every round? I have no problem with the spell (actually like the concept) just feel it is entirely op for people who play under 1000 health, that and the fact that it's taking strategy and fun out of low. My suggestion of a pvp only moon shield (trained) for people lvl 20 or lower would instantly kill this trend, agree? Fair considering some people like to play at 600-900 health. Half an insane would still hurt just not kill in the first round.


darthjt wrote:
When enough people learn this strategy and start using it, Insane bolt becomes a useless spam strategy as Power pips are not usually given at low level PvP, therefore it is easy to shield and heal.

If enough people use this strategy to defeat those Insane Bolt spammers, it will no longer be used, because the only thing Insane bolt will be good for is defeating yourself.
you'd be surprised at the volume of people desperate enough to throw out this non strategy. Darth start a lvl 10 and tell me how many times you get killed by an insane bolt on the way to first piece of resist gear, it's getting out of hand

darthjt wrote:
However, most people still have to learn the counter to this scenario.
Bottom line no two pip spell should kill caster or opponent in first round. All my characters at initiate have gear and could survive three in a row with pet, I'm suggesting this to better pvp at low levels.

Historian
May 01, 2010
665
Why not have the backfire rate become greater the lower level you are?
for example:
55-70, 80:20
45-54, 70:30
35-44, 60:40
25-34, 50:50
15-24: 40:60
5-15:30:70
1-4: 20:80

So if it is valuable for a level 1, it will be almost no better than the old wild bolt, with the fact that if you fizzle, you die.

Defender
Jan 20, 2010
108
darthjt wrote:
Tower shield may be a level 16 trained spell, but it can be purchased at both the Library and the Bazaar at any level for a -55% to the next incoming spell.

Add in resistance and this treasure tower shield and Insane bolt will only do between 400 and 450 damage, which can easily be healed with Pixie or Fairy.

When enough people learn this strategy and start using it, Insane bolt becomes a useless spam strategy as Power pips are not usually given at low level PvP, therefore it is easy to shield and heal.

If enough people use this strategy to defeat those Insane Bolt spammers, it will no longer be used, because the only thing Insane bolt will be good for is defeating yourself.

However, most people still have to learn the counter to this scenario.


drathjt, the part of this that you are not seeing is the Ascendant Staff factor. It gives an extra pip at the start of the duel, can be used by any level, and can be farmed from gurtok firebender. with this wand, a level 1 can cast insane bolt first round every time, no need for power pips.

Survivor
Apr 30, 2011
10
You make some valid points. I came across a 2 player team of storm and fire. The fire wizard was able to heal so the storm used insane bolt whenever he had enough pips. Once he did die and she healed him right away. She just stood there and shielded and waited to heal. There whole strategy was just to use insane bolt. Both were warlords by the way.

Survivor
Mar 22, 2010
31
Of all the gear to put in crown shop for lvl 70. Why couldn't the gear from the Create Your Own Gear winners list be used in this? Instead we get what looks like beginners gear. Bad choice. :(

Explorer
Mar 19, 2010
65
darthjt wrote:
Tower shield may be a level 16 trained spell, but it can be purchased at both the Library and the Bazaar at any level for a -55% to the next incoming spell.

Add in resistance and this treasure tower shield and Insane bolt will only do between 400 and 450 damage, which can easily be healed with Pixie or Fairy.

When enough people learn this strategy and start using it, Insane bolt becomes a useless spam strategy as Power pips are not usually given at low level PvP, therefore it is easy to shield and heal.

If enough people use this strategy to defeat those Insane Bolt spammers, it will no longer be used, because the only thing Insane bolt will be good for is defeating yourself.

However, most people still have to learn the counter to this scenario.


That arguement doesn't hold at all for low level arena users, in order to purchase Tower shields you need gold. In order to get gold you either need to farm(which can cause you to level up in the process)/spend the rest of your life running around for gold treasure chests, or have a higher leveled wizard who can trade you dropped items and then you have them flogged off to make the money for these cards. Out of those three only one method would really work which is the last one.

Therefore you would have to have a high leveled character to at least attempt beating them in Pvp. Not exactly the idea of fair play having to spend time leveling up one wizard just to afford to pay for the other's treasure cards.

Survivor
Aug 23, 2011
19
I addressed the uniqueness (and some inequities) with regard to Bolts in general in the thread:

Lets have a little chat about bolt shall we?

Rather than repeat them here, I'd invite you to take a gander over there. It addresses both Wild and Insane Bolts in general, but also a specific case of Insane Bolt that I think offer an arguement as to how it could be exploitive.

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
digemm wrote:
I addressed the uniqueness (and some inequities) with regard to Bolts in general in the thread:

Lets have a little chat about bolt shall we?

Rather than repeat them here, I'd invite you to take a gander over there. It addresses both Wild and Insane Bolts in general, but also a specific case of Insane Bolt that I think offer an arguement as to how it could be exploitive.
I'd love to, anything to get the ball rolling on this issue.

Defender
Jun 14, 2010
152
For whatever reason, I decided to do Kensington Park the other day. I made it through with a Storm wizard and a Death wizard. Toward the end of the dungeon, the Storm wizard started using Insane Bolt a lot. When I asked him why he was using all of those, he said that he used it all the time.

Eventually, we came up against four enemies with 2000 health. The Storm wizard cast Balanceblade the first round, then Insane Bolt the next. Now, granted, he did have Waterworks gear on, but it did around 2500 damage. He repeated this process for the other three, and we ended up winning the fight.
The only problem I have with this is that he did 2500 damage four times over the course of eight turns for two pips each turn.

Now, it's been a while since I've done lower level PvP, but that's deadly enough in higher level, as 2500 damage is anywhere from 2/3 to 1/3 of a transcended wizard's health. Insane Bolt could really get out of hand. Maybe if it had a 30% risk, or if it cost a pip or two higher, or maybe did a little less damage, then it would probably be fair.

Survivor
Dec 10, 2010
21
why dont we just make everyone elses spells weak so our schools win all the time? I mean why bother learning how to get better when we can just have KI change other peoples spells its much easier to complain. :D

Squire
Jan 05, 2010
548
alexp132 wrote:
why dont we just make everyone elses spells weak so our schools win all the time? I mean why bother learning how to get better when we can just have KI change other peoples spells its much easier to complain. :D
Hey Alex. If you have a low level pvp character and go second Insane bolt will kill you 80% of the time without you being able to "get better". This spell is being spammed as a primary attack in lower levels and people are getting bolted out of existence before their turn even started. Enlighten me on how you would get better when you die before you get a turn!?