Welcome to the Wizard101 Message Boards


Player Guide
Fansites
News
Game Updates
Help

By posting on the Wizard101 Message Boards you agree to the Code of Conduct.

A Gargantuan Con Game.

1
AuthorMessage
Defender
Jan 25, 2010
178
So here I am saving my training points in Celestia so that I can get Gargantuan. So I have 4 train points and I go there and I take the top highlighted one then the next one is dark then the next one is highlighted so I take that one all the way up to using all 4 points but yet I still did not get Gargantuan because it is still a dark button.

So I go finish Zeke's Lounge Lizards and come back to the trainer and now Gargantuan is no longer on the list. There is nothing left except Giant and Strong.

The whole point of this was to get Gargantuan which in essence, given the fact that the player does not need those sub cards they obtained in order to work their way up to getting Gargantuan, makes Gargantuan from the Sun Trainer a 5 training point card. That's all it is really.

Removing Gargantuan without warning to players who are spending their points in order to get Gargantuan, especially with the best notice available which is the text in the same log in window that warns of the A.M. maintenance shut down, in my opinion is an act of theft of the players training points.

Since I cannot find any information on KI offering any apologies and offering to give the players their Celestia training points back, I consider this to be an act of theft, theft of the players training points, theft of the players time, theft of the players labor AND theft of the subsequent real world CASH that the player is going to have to PAY KI in order to get their training points back.

Yes, THEFT. I think it is BAIT AND SWITCH which is illegal.

So there is the PROBLEM.

What is the solution?

Give back the training points, that most likely, thousands or tens of thousands of players were TRICKED out of,

or,

Remove these permanent Gargantuan cards from the players that have them in their decks and give them their Celestia train(ing) points back.

This whole thing was deceptive and unfair and the only FIX for this is for me to pay KI cash to get my training points back.

My 5 Celestian training points gained so far were ARBITRARILY taken from me.

Defender
May 11, 2009
126
A+ Student
Jan 05, 2009
1708
My hope is that KI is just doing the coding work necessary to bring it back...with a level limitation (such as on items and the like) and no PvP...which would make everyone but a small minority of PvP players who might use the card/spell in an abusive way.

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
jaronuts wrote:
So here I am saving my training points in Celestia so that I can get Gargantuan. So I have 4 train points and I go there and I take the top highlighted one then the next one is dark then the next one is highlighted so I take that one all the way up to using all 4 points but yet I still did not get Gargantuan because it is still a dark button.


You did something wrong. You only need strong, giant, monstrous, then gargantuan. Did you buy all the accuracy stuff as well?

jaronuts wrote:
So I go finish Zeke's Lounge Lizards and come back to the trainer and now Gargantuan is no longer on the list. There is nothing left except Giant and Strong.


Which sun trainer are you looking at? Base camp? If so, look at the one in the floating land.

jaronuts wrote:
The whole point of this was to get Gargantuan which in essence, given the fact that the player does not need those sub cards they obtained in order to work their way up to getting Gargantuan, makes Gargantuan from the Sun Trainer a 5 training point card. That's all it is really.


It only takes four. I just went and counted in my deck.

jaronuts wrote:

Removing Gargantuan without warning to players who are spending their points in order to get Gargantuan, especially with the best notice available which is the text in the same log in window that warns of the A.M. maintenance shut down, in my opinion is an act of theft of the players training points.

Since I cannot find any information on KI offering any apologies and offering to give the players their Celestia training points back, I consider this to be an act of theft, theft of the players training points, theft of the players time, theft of the players labor AND theft of the subsequent real world CASH that the player is going to have to PAY KI in order to get their training points back.

Yes, THEFT. I think it is BAIT AND SWITCH which is illegal.


You're being ridiculous. There is no bait and switch here. They have agreed to provide for you an online mmorpg which they have. By nature that is a dynamic and constantly changing environment. Even if they have since removed gargantuan (and I don't think they have since its still in my deck), many things are limited time offers and just like in real life, sometimes you miss out. You can always build a new character. Have you even bothered to open a support ticket with KI to find out if gargantuan has indeed been removed or is just been moved to a different location? Or did you just jump to screaming "theft" at the top of your lungs?

Hero
Aug 23, 2009
723
Seriously, calm down, there is no theft, con game, or hoodwink, I checked the Sun School Trainer on the Floating Island less thank 5 minutes ago, if you have training point and are level 58 you can get the spell-presuming you purchased prior spells. If you didn't notice already not all the Astral School Trainers have all the spells for the school, they get more spells the further into Celestia you go. Wow, calm down, if there was a serious problem such as spell removal I bet others would have brought attention to it and KI would have up out an announcement.

Astrologist
Aug 21, 2009
1205
you have to keep in mind you have to find the right trainer in the game to teach it to you, and that trainer simply is not the one in base camp

Mastermind
Sep 11, 2010
370
Gargantuan is still in the game. My newly obtained Gargantuan spell card says so - you have to go talk to the Sun School Trainer in the Floating Lands, however. The one in Base Camp only has the first few spells (same for Moon and Star spells).

Moderator
Bookshelvings wrote:
Gargantuan is still in the game. My newly obtained Gargantuan spell card says so - you have to go talk to the Sun School Trainer in the Floating Lands, however. The one in Base Camp only has the first few spells (same for Moon and Star spells).


That's correct. Strong, Giant and Monstrous must still be obtained before Gargantuan will be open to you, the location was changed not the requirements.

If you want the prize, you have to build the ladder rung by rung. There are no shortcuts.
Defender
Jan 25, 2010
178
I thought I was seeing things or may have been in error, but I wasn't. My friend that had Gargantuan and I went back to the trainer that he took me too that had Gargantuan.

Previously Gargantuan was at the bottom of the list and required 4 training points to obtain (I was level 60 when I did this) and was preceded by Keen Eyes, Accurate, Sniper and Unstoppable.

But as I said before, I had 4 training points but even before it was moved to another trainer Gargantuan was increased to require 5 points in succession to obtain it and I plainly saw Gargantuan was available to me and I only needed one more point, Gargantuan was highlighted and was last on the list after I had used my 4 points. I needed one more point so I go to the Lounge Lizards and when I come back Gargantuan is GONE.

It was moved to another trainer. I thought I was mistaken but Zeke admits that it was moved.

So, players got Gargantuan for 4 points, then it was 5 points when I tried to get it, then it was moved to the bottom of the list of a separate trainer underneath Strong, Giant, Monstrous and Gargantuan. That requires another 4 training points when I already spent 4 training points in an attempt to work my way up the list to get Gargantuan.

Gargantuan was changed twice, from 4 points to obtain it, then 5 points to get it then it was moved to the bottom of the list of another trainer.

What more proof do you need to prove that players training points were arbitrarily taken from them without warning or notice that this is going to happen? NONE.

Like I said, BAIT AND SWITCH.

That little hustle converts Gargantuan into an 8 training point card.

Only now, AFTER THE FACT, does Zeke or KI admit that Gargantuan was moved but otherwise there was no notice or warning of this that inevitably and wrongfully took away the players training points.

By design or mistake that is what happened, the wholesale looting of players training points. How many thousands of players lost their training points this way? I would like to get those players under one roof.

4 points lost, wasted, taken from me arbitrarily while trying to get Gargantuan, points spent in GOOD FAITH by me and a lot of other players.

Irregardless of how many training points the player was in possession of or not when starting Celestia does nor change the fact that the Celestia training points, for the thousands of player who were working towards Gargantua, were arbitrarily taken away from them.

For those who wanted Gargantua all they got was having their training points bled away a little at a time until there aren't enough points available in Celestia to get Gargantuan. All it took was a 3 step process to take their training points in exchange for nothing. First 4 points to get it, then 5, then move it to another trainer. That is how it happened.

You can own all the gold, all the items and crowns, I don't care, but one thing you do not own is my time and my labor and when my training points are taken from me in such a fashion that is what was wrongly taken from me.

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
jaronuts wrote:

Gargantuan was changed twice, from 4 points to obtain it, then 5 points to get it then it was moved to the bottom of the list of another trainer.

What more proof do you need to prove that players training points were arbitrarily taken from them without warning or notice that this is going to happen? NONE.


I won't rule out the possibility of a glitch, so you should open a support ticket with KI just in case. However, In the history of gargantuan availability... test realm through live, I, nor any of my friends have ever had the problem you're describing. It has always been 4 points, requiring strong, giant, and monstrous as prerequisites, and still does as of last night. Many people have accidentally purchased the accuracy spells thinking that they were required, and they did move it to the trainer in the floating land (though I'm pretty sure that happened before live). Additionally, most of the "purchase" interfaces, be it trainers, the bazaar, or typical stores, are sortable by clicking on the column header. The position of the spell in the list could possibly have been affected by an errant mouse click. Outside of that, you either experienced a glitch or you made a mistake.

Survivor
Jun 02, 2009
40
Gargantuan only costs 4 training points. First you buy Strong in the Base Camp, then Giant on Floating Land, then Monstrous on Floating Land, then Gargantuan on the Floating Land. For as long as Celestia has been on the live realm, to my knowledge, they have stayed in the same location, maybe they just changed from the test realm. You don't need to get Keen Eyes, Accurate, Sniper and Unstoppable before you get Gargantuan.

Quinn Deaththorn - Lv 59 Necromancer

Defender
Jan 25, 2010
178
Support ticket? Lol, hahahaha. In the past two weeks I have twice made a report on two other critical issues that apparently has fallen on deaf ears. There is no response one way or the other.

Requesting support when previous requests go unanswered is an act of futility.

I want my 4 training points back that were wasted on that trainer that had Keen Eyes, Accurate, Sniper and Unstoppable. Gargantuan was next on the list but I needed 1 more train point so I go get that point and come back and Gargantuan is gone.

Now after getting duped out 4 training points, I have to start the point spending process all over again with the other trainer and that is another 4 training points and that means, for players who already invested points into that other trainer, since the Gargantuan was moved, will cost me 8 training points when it should only cost 4.

ANYONE who put 1 or more training points into that trainer in an effort to work their way up to Gargantuan lost their points when the spell was moved.

Moving Gargantuan to another trainer is what arbitrarily took my training points away from me because the point spending process starts from scratch again at the new trainer.

Step 1. First it's on one trainer at a total of 5 points to obtain because I couldn't get it with 4. Yes, that trainer had 5 spells on the list Keen Eyes, Accurate, Sniper and Unstoppable. and Gargantuan. Anyone that actually got Gargantuan off of that trainer for 5 points lost 1 point.

Step 2. Then it was moved to another trainer that again requires 4 points to obtain.

Step 3. Offer no solution to the matter.

The final piece of evidence in this chain of events that I need is the receipt that I will get from buying back all my training points because so far THAT is the only way to replace the 4 training points that were arbitrarily taken from me and if I have to actually do that as a solution the matter has all the appearance of a bait and switch to generate revenue.

Either give me my 4 points back or that receipt from buying my points back will guarantee that I will get them back, plus the money I spent buying them back.

Mastermind
Sep 11, 2010
370
jaronuts wrote:
Irregardless of how many training points the player was in possession of or not when starting Celestia does nor change the fact that the Celestia training points, for the thousands of player who were working towards Gargantua, were arbitrarily taken away from them.

For those who wanted Gargantua all they got was having their training points bled away a little at a time until there aren't enough points available in Celestia to get Gargantuan. All it took was a 3 step process to take their training points in exchange for nothing. First 4 points to get it, then 5, then move it to another trainer. That is how it happened.


Actually, you are wrong on multiple points:

A) Gargantuan has always been in the Floating Lands for as long as Celestia has been on the Live Realm.

B) It has always required Strong, Giant and Monstrous before you could get Gargantuan - as well as level 58.

C) You only need 4 training points in total to get Gargantuan. There is no requirement for the accuracy buffs in order to obtain the power buffs.

D) Once you have a spell, no matter which trainer you got it from, it stays with you - just like recipes. Once you've learned a spell, it will disappear from all trainers that happen to train the same spell (such as the myriad of pedestals in Celestia).

So stop getting your knickers in a knot, and get your facts straight instead. I won't rule out that the trainer location changed from when Celestia was in the Test Realm (I didn't try Test Realm), but as long as Celestia has been on the Live realms, the Gargantuan spell has had exactly the same requirements and has been hanging around in exactly the same area. There is no con game or 11 training point-requirements or stealing or anything. You are merely crying wolf.

Mastermind
Mar 16, 2010
346
Defender
Jan 25, 2010
178
Unless I am totally out of my mind or blasted on some hallucinogenic drugs, I know what I saw and I know what I did.

That trainer had Keen Eyes, Accurate, Sniper, Unstoppable and Gargantuan. I go back after getting another another training point and Gargantuan is gone.

4 training points wasted because its going to take 4 more to get Gargantuan when Gargantuan should only cost 4 training points.

I listen to conversation in the chat box and there are other people in the game that are also complaining about losing their training points so I don't think this issue is going away.

Just give me my 4 points back, take those worthless cards out of my deck that I obtained trying to get Gargantuan and we will call it even.

How long can a situation like this persist before the people who lost their training points gather under one roof and demand satisfaction?

In the mean time I'm not going to get any more training points or train any more spells but I will buy back my points and start over.

Mastermind
Sep 11, 2010
370
Considering that I reset my training points a mere day ago (cleared up on a lot of useless shields and spells I never used aynway), I can do a double-confirm that you only need 4 training points for Gargantuan, and you have to obtain the spells in the order of "Strong" (level 52), "Giant" (level 54), "Monstrous" (level 56) and then "Gargantuan" (level 58).

Strong and Giant are offered by the Sun School trainer in Celestia Base Camp, along with Keen Eyes and Accurate. To obtain Monstrous, Gargantuan, Sniper and Unstoppable, you have to visit Floating Land or another higher-area Sun School trainer that has that specific set of spells available for training.

4 training points wasted because its going to take 4 more to get Gargantuan when Gargantuan should only cost 4 training points.

No. No, no no no and no. If you have Strong, Giant and Monstrous, you will need one point more to get Gargantuan. You don't have to re-obtain the spells at any point unless you reset your training points (in which case you will have the points returned to be reused).

You keep talking about getting 4 cards, and missing Gargantuan, yet you also claim you haven't gotten any of the Accuracy cards. So: Are you absolutely certain that you haven't already gotten Gargantuan on your wizard? That could be why it isn't available with the trainer, and why you have used 4 training points. Remember to flip through the pages of your spell book when looking for a specific spell.

Delver
Apr 02, 2010
261
Sorry for the dumb question, but how do you use it?

Can you enchant cards before hand in Unicorn Way, or do you have to use it during the battle at hand?

I mean, the regular strong, etc are Myth I think, but this is another school.

I question training it when I am Death; but I would at least like to know.

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
ic0517 wrote:
Sorry for the dumb question, but how do you use it?

Can you enchant cards before hand in Unicorn Way, or do you have to use it during the battle at hand?

I mean, the regular strong, etc are Myth I think, but this is another school.

I question training it when I am Death; but I would at least like to know.


Learned versions of the card (requiring a training point) must be used in battle. Treasure card versions of the spell can be done via the usual method in Unicorn Way.

Delver
Apr 02, 2010
261
Can I assume that just like Strong, Tough, etc, I can't enchant Wraith or Scarecrow?

And since Death is 85% accurate, I can get the 10% and 15% accuracy for next to nothing at the Bazaar, enchant Wraith or Scarecrow to my hearts content, and store them for future use.

Seems of limited use to Death.

Delver
Mar 18, 2010
262
I was confused there at first too. I got Keen Eyes (I wanted the accuracy). Then I started in on the others. You don't have to do the accuracy boosts to get the damage boosts.

Megan

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
ic0517 wrote:
Can I assume that just like Strong, Tough, etc, I can't enchant Wraith or Scarecrow?

And since Death is 85% accurate, I can get the 10% and 15% accuracy for next to nothing at the Bazaar, enchant Wraith or Scarecrow to my hearts content, and store them for future use.

Seems of limited use to Death.


That's correct. They can only be applied to damage spells (the ones with a fist). While it is a bit limited in comparison to some other classes, you do have sprite, banshee, skeletal pirate, and skeletal dragon which you can apply them to. You can also apply it to any secondary school damage spell you may have in your deck. However, don't underestimate the value of a gargantuan banshee. With a base damage in the range of 470-530, a gargantuan banshee can deal a lot of damage for only three pips, particularly because the death blade is +40%. Happy hunting!

Squire
Aug 12, 2009
594
You need train only Strong, Giant, and Monstrous to get Gargantuan at Level 58. Buying Keen Eyes will only help you if your goal is to get Accurate, Sniper, or Unstoppable. It's not KingsIsle's fault that you bought the wrong spells.

Hero
Jul 27, 2009
755
the accuracy spell are more for spells of lower percentage. to increase the chance of them making the mark.

but by using the gargantuan on most any creature spell you have an unbeatable spell but work of warning if it takes 8 pips to cast and you are a high gold pip percentage make sure you have the fifth gold pip or nine out of ten time you will fizzle on that cast with the 4 gold or 8 white pips. with 10 pip count you should always succeed in casting that spell.

you must combo it with and amplify and a blade if you add the trap and the spell ring and a few feints it will most always yield high hits..
this takes pure cooperation of a good crew of four wizards working together.
to date for the Efreet my highest hit has been 12,294 producing a one hit kill.


Mastermind
Jun 13, 2009
335
jaronuts wrote:
Unless I am totally out of my mind or blasted on some hallucinogenic drugs, I know what I saw and I know what I did.

That trainer had Keen Eyes, Accurate, Sniper, Unstoppable and Gargantuan. I go back after getting another another training point and Gargantuan is gone.

4 training points wasted because its going to take 4 more to get Gargantuan when Gargantuan should only cost 4 training points.

I


I have read your post and I am trying to understand it so I might figured out what exactly happened and offer some advice since most people are berating you for posting. It's unfortunate but that's how it is sometimes.

Ok here goes:

For each level of sun spells you have two types: accuracy and boost. If you trained an accuracy spell at a particular level then you cannot train the boost spell at that same level. I suspect that you may have trained the level 58 accuracy spell (unstoppable) and that is why Gargantuan is not available to you.

Please also note that the sun trainers are in the floating land above Pierce Stanston. As far as I know that's the only place in the game that you can train all the sun spells.

Additionally, you should use only 4 training points IF you ONLY trained boost spells. Therefore, you if trained monster then giant then monstrous then you should be able to train gargantuan if you are the required level. However if you had trained any other spell then you would have used a training point on that spell and so four training points would not be enough to learn gargantuan. Check your spell list, maybe you trained a POLYMORPH spell or an AURA spell.

if everything that I have said so far is not what happened or is not in the realm of possibilities, then something may be wrong with your account. I would invite you to send a detailed report of what transpired to wizard101 support and they will investigate the matter and have it rectfied.

Please be not discouraged. I do not think that KingsIsle is trying to rob anyone of their training points but as time goes by there are things in the game that they may need to change to enhance the game experience or simply to satisfy disgruntled players.

Regards,

Logan Frost
Legendary Necromancer/Conjurer

Mastermind
Aug 01, 2009
311
jaronuts wrote:
I thought I was seeing things or may have been in error, but I wasn't. My friend that had Gargantuan and I went back to the trainer that he took me too that had Gargantuan.

Previously Gargantuan was at the bottom of the list and required 4 training points to obtain (I was level 60 when I did this) and was preceded by Keen Eyes, Accurate, Sniper and Unstoppable.

But as I said before, I had 4 training points but even before it was moved to another trainer Gargantuan was increased to require 5 points in succession to obtain it and I plainly saw Gargantuan was available to me and I only needed one more point, Gargantuan was highlighted and was last on the list after I had used my 4 points. I needed one more point so I go to the Lounge Lizards and when I come back Gargantuan is GONE.

It was moved to another trainer. I thought I was mistaken but Zeke admits that it was moved.

So, players got Gargantuan for 4 points, then it was 5 points when I tried to get it, then it was moved to the bottom of the list of a separate trainer underneath Strong, Giant, Monstrous and Gargantuan. That requires another 4 training points when I already spent 4 training points in an attempt to work my way up the list to get Gargantuan.

Gargantuan was changed twice, from 4 points to obtain it, then 5 points to get it then it was moved to the bottom of the list of another trainer.

What more proof do you need to prove that players training points were arbitrarily taken from them without warning or notice that this is going to happen? NONE.

Like I said, BAIT AND SWITCH.

That little hustle converts Gargantuan into an 8 training point card.

Only now, AFTER THE FACT, does Zeke or KI admit that Gargantuan was moved but otherwise there was no notice or warning of this that inevitably and wrongfully took away the players training points.

By design or mistake that is what happened, the wholesale looting of players training points. How many thousands of players lost their training points this way? I would like to get those players under one roof.

4 points lost, wasted, taken from me arbitrarily while trying to get Gargantuan, points spent in GOOD FAITH by me and a lot of other players.

Irregardless of how many training points the player was in possession of or not when starting Celestia does nor change the fact that the Celestia training points, for the thousands of player who were working towards Gargantua, were arbitrarily taken away from them.

For those who wanted Gargantua all they got was having their training points bled away a little at a time until there aren't enough points available in Celestia to get Gargantuan. All it took was a 3 step process to take their training points in exchange for nothing. First 4 points to get it, then 5, then move it to another trainer. That is how it happened.

You can own all the gold, all the items and crowns, I don't care, but one thing you do not own is my time and my labor and when my training points are taken from me in such a fashion that is what was wrongly taken from me.


Be mad at yourself for not training properly.. It's no one's fault but your own.. Slow down when you are training- i have trained in gargantuan and got it fine. you have to train 3 other spells before it opens up to you- so it's no ones fault but your own.. slow down next time to see what you are clicking on.

1