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Conviction - Must PvP to Train?? = Very Wrong

AuthorMessage
Survivor
Apr 03, 2009
25
Good Day -
With the introduction of Avalon, even with Gear that promotes critical block, it seems that our wizards are being stunned and critical hit VERY often... So I went to see Deigo the Duelmaster and imagine my surprise when I found out that you have to be a PvP Seargent in order to be able to TRAIN the spell Conviction.
My family has no interest in PvP and only plays PvE and finds that this spell will increase our chances of completing Avalon without having to die as often as we have been...
PLEASE consider the players of this wonderful game that DONT PvP and want to train this spell for the use in PvE.

Survivor
Apr 15, 2009
39
I have only one thing to say to this ... AGREEDED!

Armiger
Feb 25, 2009
2425
Agreed!!!!!!!!!!.

If our spells are going to be nerfed to accommodate PvPers, then make all the spells that are designated for PvP available to all wizards to train.

I no longer PvP and haven't since the bickering over the spells being OP started. But I don't think it is fair to those that don't PvP to have to give up any spell stats to those that are crying because they get beat in PvP. This is why I quit PvP. It was no longer fun nor was it worth trying to hone skills.

Suggestion KI. Make PvP a totally separate GAME for those that prefer to PvP. Make it so that their levels in PvP and their actual Wizard101 levels have nothing to do with each other. Make their PvP spells strictly PvP and no longer connected with PvE.

Survivor
Apr 03, 2009
25
Something that I did not add in my original post is that if you wanted to lay a level restriction to be able to train Conviction, rather than a PvP requirement... I would be ok with that. Since most of the Moon, Star and Sun spells do have a level restriction, it would make perfect sense that Conviction would follow suit.

But for this very useful spell in the Player Vs. Environment, for us to HAVE to PvP, even if it is only 10-20 matches to gain rank of Sergeant, is just ridiculous. We have even considered fighting each others family wizards just to acquire the necessary level, but even that seeems even more ridiculous...

Please change this to a level restriction rather than a PvP requirement. Thank you for your time.

Adherent
Mar 18, 2009
2737
HatTrick3 wrote:
Something that I did not add in my original post is that if you wanted to lay a level restriction to be able to train Conviction, rather than a PvP requirement... I would be ok with that. Since most of the Moon, Star and Sun spells do have a level restriction, it would make perfect sense that Conviction would follow suit.

Please change this to a level restriction rather than a PvP requirement. Thank you for your time.


Many Avalon bosses drop gear with the Conviction item card spell, because they critical too much. That was KI's solution for the increased enemy critical attacks.

The level restriction for that gear is 78.

Champion
Feb 03, 2012
406
kingurz wrote:
HatTrick3 wrote:
Something that I did not add in my original post is that if you wanted to lay a level restriction to be able to train Conviction, rather than a PvP requirement... I would be ok with that. Since most of the Moon, Star and Sun spells do have a level restriction, it would make perfect sense that Conviction would follow suit.

Please change this to a level restriction rather than a PvP requirement. Thank you for your time.


Many Avalon bosses drop gear with the Conviction item card spell, because they critical too much. That was KI's solution for the increased enemy critical attacks.

The level restriction for that gear is 78.


That fixes nothing, you need to be lvl 78 and get the drop? for one convistion? only 4 rounds a battle? I commend the effort but i agree convistion should just be a straight forward learned spell.

Survivor
Apr 03, 2009
25
kingurz wrote:
Many Avalon bosses drop gear with the Conviction item card spell, because they critical too much. That was KI's solution for the increased enemy critical attacks.

The level restriction for that gear is 78.

ALL of that dropped gear has ONE Conviction is No Auction and between level 76-78 and not the answer...

Conviction is the ONLY spell that has a PvP restriction in order to train... WHY?
Are PvP players that are Private (One level below Sergeant) really going to gain that much benefit from the possible added critical and stun block?? That is the question that you need to ask and must be the only reason that this spell has a PvP restriction at all...

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1643
HatTrick3 wrote:
kingurz wrote:
Many Avalon bosses drop gear with the Conviction item card spell, because they critical too much. That was KI's solution for the increased enemy critical attacks.

The level restriction for that gear is 78.

ALL of that dropped gear has ONE Conviction is No Auction and between level 76-78 and not the answer...

Conviction is the ONLY spell that has a PvP restriction in order to train... WHY?
Are PvP players that are Private (One level below Sergeant) really going to gain that much benefit from the possible added critical and stun block?? That is the question that you need to ask and must be the only reason that this spell has a PvP restriction at all...


Actually, the order is
Private
Corporal
Sergeant
Veteran
Knight
Commander
Warlord

So, you must gain 2 ranks. But getting to Sergeant is really easy, and here's a famous saying (That I most likely cannot remember and probably will say it in a really messed up way):
You worked what you get for.

Yeah, I can just never remember sayings properly...

Adherent
Mar 18, 2009
2737
HatTrick3 wrote:
kingurz wrote:
Many Avalon bosses drop gear with the Conviction item card spell, because they critical too much. That was KI's solution for the increased enemy critical attacks.

The level restriction for that gear is 78.

ALL of that dropped gear has ONE Conviction is No Auction and between level 76-78 and not the answer...

Conviction is the ONLY spell that has a PvP restriction in order to train... WHY?
Are PvP players that are Private (One level below Sergeant) really going to gain that much benefit from the possible added critical and stun block?? That is the question that you need to ask and must be the only reason that this spell has a PvP restriction at all...


First, your initial post indicated that Avalon was where stunning and critical was becoming a problem.....so yes, 70+ is an appropriate level range. You really only need four rounds anyways for stun, since the enemies don't spam 0 pip stun spells, nor can they spam high ranking spells. So cast Conviction when those enemies are in the high pip range. Use Reshuffle if necessary. Plenty of high level gear already comes with tons of critical block, use Stun Block for other stuns.

Second, I never said the current solution was the best solution, only that KI did implement a solution for Avalon (in addition the solutions that are already present and available in the game). I never disagreed with your idea, but did imply that if the spell was not PvP only, it would likely be in the 78 level area requirement to train (since that is where it showed up as an item card).

Finally, I can't answer why that particular spell has a Sergeant requirement. I can only assume it was to give PvPers an incentive and prior to Zafaria/Avalon, stunning was only really a PvP issue (although critical has always been a problem in PvP ever since being introduced).

I agree with your suggestion, but more on the giving low levels critical block support (when they face higher levels in the arena), not the stunning portion since Stun Block is still a very useful tool and can already be acquired at Private and critical block only appears in the 55+ gear range.

Defender
May 15, 2010
152
kingurz wrote:
HatTrick3 wrote:
Something that I did not add in my original post is that if you wanted to lay a level restriction to be able to train Conviction, rather than a PvP requirement... I would be ok with that. Since most of the Moon, Star and Sun spells do have a level restriction, it would make perfect sense that Conviction would follow suit.

Please change this to a level restriction rather than a PvP requirement. Thank you for your time.


Many Avalon bosses drop gear with the Conviction item card spell, because they critical too much. That was KI's solution for the increased enemy critical attacks.

The level restriction for that gear is 78.
Yeah, it will help him through Avalon. After all, Level 78 is about the level you are expected to be finished.

Mastermind
Mar 16, 2010
346
HatTrick3 wrote:
Good Day -
With the introduction of Avalon, even with Gear that promotes critical block, it seems that our wizards are being stunned and critical hit VERY often... So I went to see Deigo the Duelmaster and imagine my surprise when I found out that you have to be a PvP Seargent in order to be able to TRAIN the spell Conviction.
My family has no interest in PvP and only plays PvE and finds that this spell will increase our chances of completing Avalon without having to die as often as we have been...
PLEASE consider the players of this wonderful game that DONT PvP and want to train this spell for the use in PvE.
Why is this posted on two fourms?

Survivor
Nov 01, 2008
4
I agree, too many criticals in the new world of Avalon. Would love to have this spell but I am not sergent. :(

Geographer
Nov 26, 2011
860
joujou11cool wrote:
HatTrick3 wrote:
kingurz wrote:
Many Avalon bosses drop gear with the Conviction item card spell, because they critical too much. That was KI's solution for the increased enemy critical attacks.

The level restriction for that gear is 78.

ALL of that dropped gear has ONE Conviction is No Auction and between level 76-78 and not the answer...

Conviction is the ONLY spell that has a PvP restriction in order to train... WHY?
Are PvP players that are Private (One level below Sergeant) really going to gain that much benefit from the possible added critical and stun block?? That is the question that you need to ask and must be the only reason that this spell has a PvP restriction at all...


Actually, the order is
Private
Corporal
Sergeant
Veteran
Knight
Commander
Warlord

So, you must gain 2 ranks. But getting to Sergeant is really easy, and here's a famous saying (That I most likely cannot remember and probably will say it in a really messed up way):
You worked what you get for.

Yeah, I can just never remember sayings properly...


You got the order wrong...It goes like this:
Private
Corporal
Sergeant
Veteran
Knight
Captain
Commander
Warlord

Survivor
Apr 03, 2009
25
woot000 wrote:
Why is this posted on two fourms?

This is where I was instructed to post it by KI and Cause I believe that Halston's Lab actually gets looked at more often so it makes more sense for it to be there if I would like it to change...

joujou11cool wrote:
So, you must gain 2 ranks. But getting to Sergeant is really easy, and here's a famous saying (That I most likely cannot remember and probably will say it in a really messed up way):
You worked what you get for.

Yeah, I can just never remember sayings properly...

Why should someone that only intends to PvE have to work for any spell? If it was PvP only, then fine but since it is being cast by the NPC's or mobs in Avalon, it needs to be accessible for those players that dont PvP... To say you only have to gain two levels in PvP to acquire, I have no intention to PvP even if it is to train this spell... It is a shame that anyone HAS to PvP for Pets, trophies, statues, etc. just to get the item...

kingurz wrote:
First, your initial post indicated that Avalon was where stunning and critical was becoming a problem.....so yes, 70+ is an appropriate level range. You really only need four rounds anyways for stun, since the enemies don't spam 0 pip stun spells, nor can they spam high ranking spells. So cast Conviction when those enemies are in the high pip range. Use Reshuffle if necessary. Plenty of high level gear already comes with tons of critical block, use Stun Block for other stuns.

By this response, it seems you have not been in Avalon, so when you actually get to Avalon you will see... When fighting 4 NPC that start out with 8-9 pips, yes stunning and critical is a BIG ISSUE from turn ONE. Sorry but a 4 pip reshuffle, when you are not balance0 is just another horrible suggestion that will fix nothing for a single Conviction provided by gear. ALL of my wizards currently wear gear from the Waterworks and carry the level appropriate wand that provides the best critical block and still get critical hits more often than I can count on all my fingers and toes...

kingurz wrote:
Second, I never said the current solution was the best solution, only that KI did implement a solution for Avalon (in addition the solutions that are already present and available in the game). I never disagreed with your idea, but did imply that if the spell was not PvP only, it would likely be in the 78 level area requirement to train (since that is where it showed up as an item card).

Finally, I can't answer why that particular spell has a Sergeant requirement. I can only assume it was to give PvPers an incentive and prior to Zafaria/Avalon, stunning was only really a PvP issue (although critical has always been a problem in PvP ever since being introduced).

A PvP issue should NEVER be imposed on the players that PvE, plain and simple..

kingurz wrote:
I agree with your suggestion, but more on the giving low levels critical block support (when they face higher levels in the arena), not the stunning portion since Stun Block is still a very useful tool and can already be acquired at Private and critical block only appears in the 55+ gear range.

Again, another PvP issue with the pairing system and again should not be an imposition on the players that PvE... Terrible idea to inconvenience the many (PvE) to satisfy the very few (PvP).

jameson143 wrote:
Yeah, it will help him through Avalon. After all, Level 78 is about the level you are expected to be finished.
Yes, a very good point that gear that offers is level 76 or 78, way after the fact of when you could really have used Conviction.

Adherent
Mar 18, 2009
2737
HatTrick3 wrote:
By this response, it seems you have not been in Avalon, so when you actually get to Avalon you will see... When fighting 4 NPC that start out with 8-9 pips, yes stunning and critical is a BIG ISSUE from turn ONE. Sorry but a 4 pip reshuffle, when you are not balance0 is just another horrible suggestion that will fix nothing for a single Conviction provided by gear. ALL of my wizards currently wear gear from the Waterworks and carry the level appropriate wand that provides the best critical block and still get critical hits more often than I can count on all my fingers and toes...


I've completed Avalon with four different wizards (and working on the next one).

One Conviction Item card might be provided, but there is more than one type of gear that offers it. So you can have at least two (possibly three with Crowns gear too) total Conviction cards in your sideboard with the new Avalon gear.

If you are still wearing Waterworks gear, that is your problem. Waterworks does not have the best critical block stats in the game (some of the pieces don't even have crit block!). Waterworks is the best overall stats, but not the best critical block. Avalon enemies have a higher Critical attack rating than Celestia enemies (so Waterworks is too low), so they critical more often with outdated crit gear.

HatTrick3 wrote:
A PvP issue should NEVER be imposed on the players that PvE, plain and simple..


In the case of Conviction, I would agree. However, there are certain rewards that can only be obtained by being good at PvP (like trophies and pets). For some reason, KI determined that Conviction falls into that category too.

HatTrick3 wrote:
jameson143 wrote:
Yeah, it will help him through Avalon. After all, Level 78 is about the level you are expected to be finished.
Yes, a very good point that gear that offers is level 76 or 78, way after the fact of when you could really have used Conviction.


You might want to reread my post. I am agreeing with you that Conviction should be offered at an easier objective, just for different reasons. My entire post is suggesting that there are some solutions (higher crit block gear and stun shields) right now that can be used to assist you in Avalon, until/if KI ever makes Conviction trainable without the PvP restriction.

Also, Conviction item cards are unlikely to be offered any lower than level 65, since that would cheapen the Crowns Gear.

Survivor
Apr 03, 2009
25
Please take another look at all of the gear that provides one conviction card... It is definitely not up to the same level as the WW Gear.

Also the WW Gear may not have the best Critical block, but it does have the best universal critical block and I much prefer that to critical block to a particular school or a couple of schools that most of the level 60+ gear offers.