Welcome to the Wizard101 Message Boards


Player Guide
Fansites
News
Game Updates
Help

Follow important game updates on Twitter @Wizard101 and @KI_Alerts, and Facebook!

For all account questions and concerns, contact Customer Support.

By posting on the Wizard101 Message Boards you agree to the Code of Conduct.

KI pleas read this: Shatter and TCs

AuthorMessage
Explorer
Apr 10, 2010
78
1. Shatter should destroy traps also so feint 2x + shatter + judge won't auto defeat

2. Instead of flat out banning TC's in PvP, why not set a level requirment on them? This way lower lv guys won' be spamming insane bolt and talos will open up to stronger guys with a myth mastery amulet

Astrologist
Jun 04, 2010
1008
Lucario450 wrote:
1. Shatter should destroy traps also so feint 2x + shatter + judge won't auto defeat


Try cleanse ward instead of simply shielding, or a good old fashioned unbalance dispel. There are a lot of options for that now.

Lucario450 wrote:
2. Instead of flat out banning TC's in PvP, why not set a level requirment on them? This way lower lv guys won' be spamming insane bolt and talos will open up to stronger guys with a myth mastery amulet


While on its surface, I don't disagree, it certainly opens up a big can of worms. Going to a level cap starts making people say, "why aren't all treasure cards limited to the level the caster should be at to have acquired the spell normally?". At that point, the arguments about being a lower level player having to face higher level players (a totally valid argument by the way) pops up and it begins to spiral from there.

Explorer
Mar 27, 2011
58
1. If you don't put in your deck cards to remove/make useless those feints, your lost is your fault..
Then again, i uderstand that a person going second will always be in trouble with this. A while ago i suggested a method of playing PVP where this problem was solved, but apparently it fell in limbo.

2. many people agree with you. I for one find that powerful cards ought to be reserved to the main school only, just so that all schools keep their own exclusive advantages.

Defender
Jun 14, 2010
152
2 feints+shatter+judgement=autodefeat? How?

A judgement with maxed out pips ( about 2000 base damage) can take 7 turns. 9 with feints. 12 with Shatter. So, you have twelve turns to prepare yourself, and who says you can't throw on an extra tower shield after the Shatter? You can kill a person in 12 turns with a few blades from your school and a rank 9, 8, or even a rank 7 spell.

Also, how do you think this would affect Necromancers, or anyone that uses feint? It is the best trap in the game, and having Shatter remove it could end badly. What if they aren't using it for Judgement?

And treasure cards aren't flat-out banned in PvP, only a few overpowered ones. While level limits on stuff like Tempest would be nice, Talos was necessary. A minion with 1000 health that can cast Minotaur should be limited to Myth, a school that wouldn't be nearly as good without it.

Survivor
Sep 11, 2010
4
Explorer
Aug 14, 2011
67
Mimzkat101 wrote:
2 feints+shatter+judgement=autodefeat? How?

A judgement with maxed out pips ( about 2000 base damage) can take 7 turns. 9 with feints. 12 with Shatter. So, you have twelve turns to prepare yourself, and who says you can't throw on an extra tower shield after the Shatter? You can kill a person in 12 turns with a few blades from your school and a rank 9, 8, or even a rank 7 spell.

Also, how do you think this would affect Necromancers, or anyone that uses feint? It is the best trap in the game, and having Shatter remove it could end badly. What if they aren't using it for Judgement?

And treasure cards aren't flat-out banned in PvP, only a few overpowered ones. While level limits on stuff like Tempest would be nice, Talos was necessary. A minion with 1000 health that can cast Minotaur should be limited to Myth, a school that wouldn't be nearly as good without it.


Shatter already does take traps away.

Explorer
Jan 12, 2009
54
elvinlith wrote:
1. If you don't put in your deck cards to remove/make useless those feints, your lost is your fault..
Then again, i uderstand that a person going second will always be in trouble with this. A while ago i suggested a method of playing PVP where this problem was solved, but apparently it fell in limbo.

2. many people agree with you. I for one find that powerful cards ought to be reserved to the main school only, just so that all schools keep their own exclusive advantages.


I agree, but once in a while a spell is made and it is really not the best for thet type of wizard, shatter is it. as myth who is losing faith here fast and i have been pushing myth for years 4. every since shatter was added it has became a myths worest ememy.
how is that you ask simple while other schools got usefully to their wizard, myth got one that was not really a benfit to them. myth only has 1 single trap and it is a plus 25 it takes 2 rounds to add a plus 25, so myths do not even trap. a blade is much better and the double attacks are our best.

shatter is a amazing spell for death, balance, fire life. where they have more time and blades and traps to lay. if it was thier spell everyone would be crying unfair. but since they gave it to myth and none use it unless in team play to open a attack for a diffrent wizard.

I hate this spell it has done more damage to myth than helped.

with amulets like myth people just use treasure earth and shatter.
and dispel myths from doing that. it is not becasue myth will kill them but they do not want to lose thier shields or blades.

this spell must go.

Defender
Jun 14, 2010
160
elvinlith wrote:

Then again, i uderstand that a person going second will always be in trouble with this. A while ago i suggested a method of playing PVP where this problem was solved, but apparently it fell in limbo.


Yes, I remember that post.
It stands out for me out of all the ideas ever posted, because I really feel that you came up with a solid solution. It was a terrific idea, and it's too bad it got lost in limbo..

Pls Elvinlith, repost it!

A+ Student
Mar 02, 2010
1643
Again and again, putting level limits for TC's. Low levels fight high levels in pvp, so it's not going to work out.

Defender
Aug 07, 2010
107
I am a shatter user, and have be shattered on before.

But I do see the people's argument on this issue. While it is a bad card for myth, I usually do not hear myth complain about it. Usually the good ones have it in their decks for 1v1 to get an edge up in a long fight. If they were to stun then shatter and save up for an attack with blades I find that is a deadly combo.

In 2v2, 3v3, and 4v4 it is not really much of a problem, but in 1v1 I see it being used more and more.

A lot of my strategy used to revolve completely around this on my life account whether I went first or second. I would blade up, then use traps (I am part death) so then use feint. Then I would shield while they are using blades and put 1-2 tower shields on me (Ice (since I am part Ice) and treasure card version) and prepare for their attack. Then after they attack I would use triage to get rid of a dot attack or heal if they did attack. I would let them get to 2-3 power pips so they don't focus on shielding. I would then use shatter and then attack with a full out lord and now gnomes sometimes. I do now have another ways to get around shatter and do not rely on it like I have in the past though.

The problem I have with shatter is its devastating if you go second. I don't have a problem if you go second and cast it, but if you go first and cast it and the other person didn't shield that round its game over for them the next turn. I have been in that spot before and was so mad at it. So I know how it feels. If you go first and are shattered you can just shield the next round but if you go second you can't do that. And ultimately will lose as a result most of the time.

I have lost to a death before and went second because I did not expect it. Lucky I got a rematch to him when I went to rank pvp again. This time I went second again and saw he was going to use the same strategy again, I started to shield up and kept treasure card tower shielding every turn he went and has 8 or 7 pips and he wasted all of the shatters he had in his deck. While he was doing this I would then save up and risk not shielding to use a treasure earthquake to stop him from attacking. And eventually by doing this I did beat him in a rematch lol he yelled at me called me a treasure noob then left.

So I understand its a bad card for myth and can be abused and deadly if used right, but isn't that the same for every card? I know its impossible to expect or prepare for and devastating to get beat like that but it is strategy. And like every strategy it can be countered! Though it may cost a heavy amount of gold going second or if you go first it should usually be countered, isn't that just strategy? It's just what you are willing to do for a W. They worked out a strategy to beat you and instead of complaining about it be witty and try to go out and counter it and look at it is a challenge. That's how I look at it.

Also two possible ways to solve that problem I talked about if you are going second would be to make the person who uses shatter not be able to attack the next round or make it so the person is able to cast their spell first the next round after someone uses shatter. I know both of those are not going to happen, but those are two possible ideas.

Anyways that's my opinion....

Blake NightWraith


Armiger
May 10, 2010
2080
Lucario450 wrote:
1. Shatter should destroy traps also so feint 2x + shatter + judge won't auto defeat

2. Instead of flat out banning TC's in PvP, why not set a level requirment on them? This way lower lv guys won' be spamming insane bolt and talos will open up to stronger guys with a myth mastery amulet


Earthquake is the spell that destroys traps, feints, blades, etc.

Shatter is designed to remove all positive wards.

Cleanse ward is designed to remove traps.

Cleanse charm is designed to remove weakness.

Disarmament is designed to remove positive charms.

See how every spell has a function?
If someone places a feint on you, you can cleanse ward it.
If someone places a weakness on you, you can cleanse charm it.
If someone spams shields on you, you can now shatter them.
If someone casts one shield on you, you can pierce it.

Now, on to your next issue, treasure cards.

If you are starting the game and are low level and you give pvp a try, is it possible to do enough damage without treasure cards? knowing that there are heals? probably not.

There are also issues of rank vs level, where if you are a higher rank, you can easily be facing someone with a much higher level. Another reason treasure cards come in handy.

Now, if you really think your ideas work, let me make this suggestion. Take a friend and go to a home that has a pvp arena, and try to low level pvp without any treasure cards. Play fair and smart, see what happens.

Now, once you have done that, play against someone that is say 10 levels above you, play no treasure cards. Is it even possible for you to win?

Explorer
Jan 12, 2009
54
darthjt wrote:
Lucario450 wrote:
1. Shatter should destroy traps also so feint 2x + shatter + judge won't auto defeat

2. Instead of flat out banning TC's in PvP, why not set a level requirment on them? This way lower lv guys won' be spamming insane bolt and talos will open up to stronger guys with a myth mastery amulet


Earthquake is the spell that destroys traps, feints, blades, etc.

Shatter is designed to remove all positive wards.

Cleanse ward is designed to remove traps.

Cleanse charm is designed to remove weakness.

Disarmament is designed to remove positive charms.

See how every spell has a function?
If someone places a feint on you, you can cleanse ward it.
If someone places a weakness on you, you can cleanse charm it.
If someone spams shields on you, you can now shatter them.
If someone casts one shield on you, you can pierce it.

Now, on to your next issue, treasure cards.

If you are starting the game and are low level and you give pvp a try, is it possible to do enough damage without treasure cards? knowing that there are heals? probably not.

There are also issues of rank vs level, where if you are a higher rank, you can easily be facing someone with a much higher level. Another reason treasure cards come in handy.

Now, if you really think your ideas work, let me make this suggestion. Take a friend and go to a home that has a pvp arena, and try to low level pvp without any treasure cards. Play fair and smart, see what happens.

Now, once you have done that, play against someone that is say 10 levels above you, play no treasure cards. Is it even possible for you to win?


It is easy to take everything out of contex you do that very well.

the point is here it is almost all myths that want this spell gone and all other wizards want it, so why do you keep defending it? it is simple you want to exploit how it makes your school stronger than the school whos spell it is.

shatter is a spell that makes arena unfair.

when it is a treasure it is easy to draw and going first it is a win, that is the simple point.

it is not how every a auto win for a myth wizard who does not have the same level of traps other schools have.

even going sceond the chance to have a remove trap in hand the same round you have been shatted is not in the odds.

the point everyone here keeps making is it takes the odds away for the school that made this spell.

in theroy it sounds like a myth spell but it is a myths nightmare.

myth that has 2nd lowest life is a easy target. please do nto go off and say myth has 2nd best defense they do but only 2 percent that hardly makes up for the close to 200 life points the next school fire has over them. 2 percent of a 3000 is 60 points so there is no way that balances out.
also do not go and say myth can save up pips and do strong 2 hit combos, myth has the lowest pip chance of any wizard. so what made myth special was it's spells now anyone can use them and kill them more easy.

also myth has second lowest damage boost. again point to be made here shatter is a bad myth spell as removing shields does not give myth a advantage here. myth already has double attacks very few people shield myth because of this and few play.

people mostly use myth amulet for earth and shatter.

point simple shatter as a treasure makes myth weak, it makes over schools more powerfully.

hope you understand this.

Armiger
May 10, 2010
2080
sparklebottom wrote:
darthjt wrote:
Lucario450 wrote:
1. Shatter should destroy traps also so feint 2x + shatter + judge won't auto defeat

2. Instead of flat out banning TC's in PvP, why not set a level requirment on them? This way lower lv guys won' be spamming insane bolt and talos will open up to stronger guys with a myth mastery amulet


Earthquake is the spell that destroys traps, feints, blades, etc.

Shatter is designed to remove all positive wards.

Cleanse ward is designed to remove traps.

Cleanse charm is designed to remove weakness.

Disarmament is designed to remove positive charms.

See how every spell has a function?
If someone places a feint on you, you can cleanse ward it.
If someone places a weakness on you, you can cleanse charm it.
If someone spams shields on you, you can now shatter them.
If someone casts one shield on you, you can pierce it.

Now, on to your next issue, treasure cards.

If you are starting the game and are low level and you give pvp a try, is it possible to do enough damage without treasure cards? knowing that there are heals? probably not.

There are also issues of rank vs level, where if you are a higher rank, you can easily be facing someone with a much higher level. Another reason treasure cards come in handy.

Now, if you really think your ideas work, let me make this suggestion. Take a friend and go to a home that has a pvp arena, and try to low level pvp without any treasure cards. Play fair and smart, see what happens.

Now, once you have done that, play against someone that is say 10 levels above you, play no treasure cards. Is it even possible for you to win?


It is easy to take everything out of contex you do that very well.


It's context, and have you listened to anything I have said?

What if, feint was only for death only, myth could not use it?
What if pixie and satyr were for Life only, myth could not use it?

Myth is known for removing wards or double attacks, which is why they get this spell. Life is known for healing, which is why they get so many heal spells. Yet, all other schools use life's healing spells. But I am sure you will say there is a difference, which there is not.

the point is here it is almost all myths that want this spell gone and all other wizards want it, so why do you keep defending it? it is simple you want to exploit how it makes your school stronger than the school whos spell it is.


Almost all Myths want this spell gone? I see 2 people actually complaining about shatter. I myself have 2 myth wizards, 1 is Transcended and the other is almost a grandmaster.

Why do I defend it? Because it is a great spell, just because "You" don't like it, does not mean other wizards or other myths do not. Has nothing to do with any exploits, which is a cheap way of making a rebuttal.

shatter is a spell that makes arena unfair.


As is Satyr, as is triage, as is pierce, as is tower shield, as is storm shields, as is Insane Bolt, as is any spell that helps to defeat you.

when it is a treasure it is easy to draw and going first it is a win, that is the simple point.


Myth has earthquake, Myth also has remove ward, so how is it, that just because of shatter, that they have enough blades and traps to defeat you that easily? It's not the spell that is the problem, but your strategy.

it is not how every a auto win for a myth wizard who does not have the same level of traps other schools have.


Feint, is a trainable spell. Just because you have not trained it and used it with your myth, does not mean others have not. Myth can have just as good of traps as anyone else in the game.

even going sceond the chance to have a remove trap in hand the same round you have been shatted is not in the odds.


Same as shatter is a treasure card, you can make remove ward a treasure card and carry it in your side deck. Any more excuses?

the point everyone here keeps making is it takes the odds away for the school that made this spell.

in theroy it sounds like a myth spell but it is a myths nightmare.


It is not a Myth nightmare, it is your own personal nightmare.

myth that has 2nd lowest life is a easy target. please do nto go off and say myth has 2nd best defense they do but only 2 percent that hardly makes up for the close to 200 life points the next school fire has over them.


Actually, depending on the gear, amulet, etc. that Myth and Fire use, there is actually not much difference between myth and fire, certainly not 200. But, if you both use different items, that it can be well over 200, even myth can have more life than fire. And Myth has very good resistance compared to all other schools, is a close second with Ice. With a pet that has spell proof and spell defy, Myth has 46% global resistance.

2 percent of a 3000 is 60 points so there is no way that balances out.

No, not when you only take 2%, but when you have 46% on 3000 damage, you are only taking 1620, that is not even including any shields yet.

also do not go and say myth can save up pips and do strong 2 hit combos, myth has the lowest pip chance of any wizard.


Another extreme exaggeration. Actually, Fire, Ice, Storm, and Myth all have the same potential for power pip chance. It also all depends on the ring and athame you decide to use.
so what made myth special was it's spells now anyone can use them and kill them more easy.

Yeah, and life's spells, now anyone can heal more easily.
Death spells, now anyone can feint.
Ice spells, now anyone can tower.

also myth has second lowest damage boost.


Really? Myth has the second lowest Damage boost? Have you actually checked that lately, because Myth has more of a damage boost than Fire and Ice. Again, I guess this depends on what gear you are using and what gear they are using. Don't blame spells though, because of choices you make.

again point to be made here shatter is a bad myth spell as removing shields does not give myth a advantage here. myth already has double attacks very few people shield myth because of this and few play.

So, if very few people shield Myth and myth has these double attacks and you are not being shielded, how is it, you have not defeated them before they blade, trap, shatter, and attack you?


people mostly use myth amulet for earth and shatter.

point simple shatter as a treasure makes myth weak, it makes over schools more powerfully.

hope you understand this.


Nope, I certainly dont. Myth can use feints and other traps just as well as any other school can. Myth has everything it needs and more. Sounds like you just need to rethink your strategy.

Survivor
Jun 06, 2009
7
lucara wrote:
Mimzkat101 wrote:
2 feints+shatter+judgement=autodefeat? How?

A judgement with maxed out pips ( about 2000 base damage) can take 7 turns. 9 with feints. 12 with Shatter. So, you have twelve turns to prepare yourself, and who says you can't throw on an extra tower shield after the Shatter? You can kill a person in 12 turns with a few blades from your school and a rank 9, 8, or even a rank 7 spell.

Also, how do you think this would affect Necromancers, or anyone that uses feint? It is the best trap in the game, and having Shatter remove it could end badly. What if they aren't using it for Judgement?

And treasure cards aren't flat-out banned in PvP, only a few overpowered ones. While level limits on stuff like Tempest would be nice, Talos was necessary. A minion with 1000 health that can cast Minotaur should be limited to Myth, a school that wouldn't be nearly as good without it.


Shatter already does take traps away.
im pretty sure shatter does not destroy traps but only sheilds because i have used it countless times in pvp

Explorer
Jan 12, 2009
54


Nope, I certainly dont. Myth can use feints and other traps just as well as any other school can. Myth has everything it needs and more. Sounds like you just need to rethink your strategy.

you cleartly do not do you have a myth?

myth with it second lowest health in came would be nuts to add a two +30 traps on them selfs. that would make shatter even more powerful to kill.

you really do it get it.

Explorer
Jan 12, 2009
54
scorpion321123 wrote:
lucara wrote:
Mimzkat101 wrote:
2 feints+shatter+judgement=autodefeat? How?

A judgement with maxed out pips ( about 2000 base damage) can take 7 turns. 9 with feints. 12 with Shatter. So, you have twelve turns to prepare yourself, and who says you can't throw on an extra tower shield after the Shatter? You can kill a person in 12 turns with a few blades from your school and a rank 9, 8, or even a rank 7 spell.

Also, how do you think this would affect Necromancers, or anyone that uses feint? It is the best trap in the game, and having Shatter remove it could end badly. What if they aren't using it for Judgement?

And treasure cards aren't flat-out banned in PvP, only a few overpowered ones. While level limits on stuff like Tempest would be nice, Talos was necessary. A minion with 1000 health that can cast Minotaur should be limited to Myth, a school that wouldn't be nearly as good without it.


Shatter already does take traps away.
im pretty sure shatter does not destroy traps but only sheilds because i have used it countless times in pvp


question are you myth using shatter?

and yes most people know the power of shatter is to leave the traps and take away the shields.