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So what's the point of Grizzleheim again?

1
AuthorMessage
Defender
Feb 03, 2009
119
I love the new update! Lots of good stuff! BUT...

What's the deal with Grizzleheim? There's no point is there? I doubt I'll take my Grandmaster through it. I just happen to have a 44 level wizard that's going through it simply because I've already done Dragonspyre and am still gaining experience. But really, it's no different than any other world except it's totally not included or necessary in regards to the overall Mallistare plot of the game.

So why am I going to go through it more than once? Why would I go through it with a new wizard when the other worlds are broken up quite nicely with level progression. Should I go there after Wizard City and be overpowered for Krokatopia? or maybe wait till after Marleybone and make Mooshu a breeze? THOSE worlds you MUST go and complete. Regardless, I'll be well into my late 40's or maybe even 50 by the time I hit Dragonspyre.

I totally don't understand this concept of just adding some random "side" world that has no point or purpose. KI, you really dropped the ball with this one. A MUCH better idea would have Mallistare time traveling (to escape the defeat in Dragonspyre) and launching a new plan to destroy the Spiral from the past by beginning in Grizzleheim. Raise the level cap by ten and give 3 new spells per school. But no, this didn't happen.

Instead there is now this random side world that you can (but really don't have to ) run around in and not accomplish anything except throw the rest of the game balance out of whack. There is no CARROT here KI. Do you see this?

If this idea was to enhance childrens fun and adventure of this game, then why the drastic change to the Boss encounters?

and finally, What exactly is the point of a Limit one, No Trade, No Auction item other than a wasted Boss encounter looking for different drops that are entirely too hard to get in the first place.


Survivor
Dec 16, 2008
3
if you read there discription this is a new world that isnt included in the first chapter of the game (defeat malistare) this implies there will be new over all missions and i think people would enjoy a new world every so often then 4 or 5 at once with a new chapter included it also makes identifying and fixing problems much easier if they introduce one world at a time rather than 4 or 5

Community Leader
Wow. Just, wow.

Look,l I understand you're disappointed. This was a much-anticipated expansion and it's not what you had hoped for. Fine. But understand, not everything in a game has to be linear. No ball was dropped here. Grizzleheim is a separate storyline unto itself, just like Colossus Blvd.

If you don't want to go through it, don't. But dang, there's no need to sound so negative about an update that you don't personally care for.


Defender
May 15, 2009
196
I mostly agree with the original post (OP).

Setting its delivery aside and looking at the points raised:

- Concurrent world vs. linear. Linear is nice, neat, tidy, everything fits, everything works. Movies are linear and they're quite popular. I agree with the point that rabbit-trailing off the main quest-line (which is linear and necessary) runs the risk of making your character over-levelled and, consequently, the game boring, a dud.
-- Colossus Blvd. was optional but it was seamless: integrated well within the game.
-- I don't know what the deal is with Grizzleheim. I did one quest a bear gave me and it ended. I don't know where/when to get the remainder of those quests; it is confusing. I don't see that this was integrated well.

- Boss encounters. There's another thread on this (and I'm sure there will be several). The OP nailed it. Bosses definitely needed improvement, but this is too much. Adults are having a hard time with it and this is a children's game. The game is diverging and the two directions aren't integrated well; it's confusing.
-- The bosses now do things players cannot do (interrupts, multiple casts), putting them outside the game's mechanical design. Its divergent, confusing.

- Item limits. Yes, those are necessary to keep rare items rare (and the game in balance) rather than having them distributed through shared banks, trades, bazaar.

An update/add-on shouldn't be obvious; it should be transparent enough that it looks like it was there from the beginning. Grizzleheim resembles a wooden shed bolted onto a stucco house with a screen door in-between rather than a knocked-out, poured foundation, framed, walled and stuccoed addition. (That visual is a little strong. I don't mean to say that this update is junk, but I will say that pre-update W101 is a solid, top-quality product in every aspect; therefore, the chances of going backward are greater than going forward, so great care must be exerted.)

I would say this update took two steps forward and one step backward; unfortunately the two steps forward are the optional things we could skip and the step backwards was in the game's fundamentals.

Defender
Dec 14, 2008
101
well how would you continue the story? we already beat malistaire so they made this world as a CHALLENGE I was not at all disappointed when I saw this I was found with A LOT of joy :D it is a great world and you are suppose to do in between worlds were it has CHALLENGE imagine an adept which is when you go to grizzlehim for actual quests fighting the rank 3 and rank 4 elites who strangely have alot of life for their level... its suppose to be a challenge for your current level but if you are grandmaster just level through it until jotun.... lets see you beat him with ease

Defender
Feb 03, 2009
119
Look, I'm not trying to be negative. I think the expansion is great! Don't come down on me. I'm not unhappy. You're missing my point. Colossus Blvd. is a STREET in Wizard City. Grizzleheim is a WORLD. Don't compare the two. You'll see what I mean when the flash wears off and you decide to level another wizard.

I can appreciate new worlds...really I can. KI didn't make the game deeper and better, they made it fatter with redundant content. Storyline aside, there's no reason to CONTINUE to go through Grizz after the first time other than different kinds of loot. Notice I didn't say BETTER, I said different. Regardless, the new housing stuff or drops will be easily bought at the Bazaar within a few weeks and Grizzleheim will be a ghost town. Listen to me now and believe me later. Such a waste of man hours creating such a beautiful world. It's a shame really. I sincerely hope the next "World" actually provides gameplay that improves my Grandmaster Wizards. I want to improve my character, not just do more of the same disguised in a new skin.

No, it's NOT all about LOOT. It's about Character growth and improvement. It's about progressing and being imaginative. MMO's aren't about the game necessarily, they are about the characters we create. With this update KI hasn't given us an opportunity to improve our characters through loot, levels or power. They've given us another side quest to do in case we get bored with the main Storyline. It just so happens this side quest is an entire world. Am I unhappy? NO, I love new content. Am I disappointed? yes.

If you don't want to go through it, don't.

Couldn't have said it better my self. Good thing I'm paying for this privilege eh? I wonder if you'll want to go through it again after the first time?


Survivor
May 26, 2008
5
Well it was a tad disappointing for me as well. The armor drops are lvl 20ish the mobs are way easy for my 28 fire wiz and the quest exp is almost not worth speaking of, so I have to agree whats the point?

Defender
May 06, 2009
125
RoloX2 wrote:

-- I don't know what the deal is with Grizzleheim. I did one quest a bear gave me and it ended. I don't know where/when to get the remainder of those quests; it is confusing. I don't see that this was integrated well.


At least this one I can help you with. Talk to Merle Ambrose. He will give you the spiral key to Grizzlehelm.

KI: There needs to be a call from Ambrose for this, it's not obvious to anyone who didn't play on test already.

Survivor
Jan 24, 2009
2
If you did the quest and you are under the level 20 then you have to wait until you are a level 20. When you're a level 20 go talk to Merle Ambrose and he will give you a key. :-)

Survivor
Jan 24, 2009
2
I agree with Arcana. Grizzleheim is a fun new place. They probably made it to give non members a taste of what they are missing and bribe them to getting a subscription. It was a smart idea. :D

Defender
Nov 05, 2008
144
SyphaN wrote:
Dridsuzy wrote:
I love the new update! Lots of good stuff! BUT...

What's the deal with Grizzleheim? There's no point is there? I doubt I'll take my Grandmaster through it. I just happen to have a 44 level wizard that's going through it simply because I've already done Dragonspyre and am still gaining experience. But really, it's no different than any other world except it's totally not included or necessary in regards to the overall Mallistare plot of the game.

So why am I going to go through it more than once? Why would I go through it with a new wizard when the other worlds are broken up quite nicely with level progression. Should I go there after Wizard City and be overpowered for Krokatopia? or maybe wait till after Marleybone and make Mooshu a breeze? THOSE worlds you MUST go and complete. Regardless, I'll be well into my late 40's or maybe even 50 by the time I hit Dragonspyre.

I totally don't understand this concept of just adding some random "side" world that has no point or purpose. KI, you really dropped the ball with this one. A MUCH better idea would have Mallistare time traveling (to escape the defeat in Dragonspyre) and launching a new plan to destroy the Spiral from the past by beginning in Grizzleheim. Raise the level cap by ten and give 3 new spells per school. But no, this didn't happen.

Instead there is now this random side world that you can (but really don't have to ) run around in and not accomplish anything except throw the rest of the game balance out of whack. There is no CARROT here KI. Do you see this?

If this idea was to enhance childrens fun and adventure of this game, then why the drastic change to the Boss encounters?

and finally, What exactly is the point of a Limit one, No Trade, No Auction item other than a wasted Boss encounter looking for different drops that are entirely too hard to get in the first place.




I agree 101% IMO; I think KI needs to rethink the new Boss encounters.
IT IS NOT AT ALL FAIR! for bosses to cast spells out of turn
that can be a lot higher damage and they do NOT even need to have
the PIPS to cast them either!!! and on top of it they can summon
up to 3 help minions to help them, RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BATTLE!! ( and for us wizards trying to chat and get someone to port
in to help YOU in the battle ... FOR GET IT!!! I have tried.
KI if Bosses can now do these things I think that US WIZARDS
should be able to do the SAME THING! very unfair! and even depressing.


this wizard who has been playing since november and paid for a year in january, has a second account that plays monthly, as well as my sons account, who says do not renew, a niece who when the firstr boss encouter meltdown happens will no longer be paid for my nephew who was waiting for his birthday money to pay for his account, he checked out the changes on my account and sid he has better ways to spend his birthday money than on a game were bosses cheat. ki really needs to listen in my family alone 2 accounts gone 3 on the way, that is out of the 5 i have hmmm think the boss cheats are "worth it"

Survivor
Feb 16, 2009
26
If you are asking what the point of Grizzleheim is, then you havent played enough.

Continue through the world and figure out what is going on before you decide you dont like it.....from what I can read....you dont even understand it..

I thought the same thing when I started this world...now that I am almost done, I love it! It is a wonderful place to go to take a break from the regular quests.

Have some patience! The world has been out for all of 6 days! Give it a chance.

Not to mention, that KI released this world early because you were all complaining about being bored...complaining about pvp, and cancelling your accounts.

Financially, you left them no choice but to release early, and now you are not happy.

PEOPLE....make up your minds!

Defender
Feb 03, 2009
119
I stand by my original post. The only point of Grizzleheim is another Training Point.

There's nothing to understand Fizzen. I get it, there's a story in Grizzleheim. cool, neat. I'll play through it once then never need to go back unless I feel the need to overpower my character for the next world within the main storyline or I feel an uncontrollable desire to hunt Grendals and team up with Wolves, Bears, and Ravens.

It is a wonderful place to go to take a break from the regular quests.

People need this? They need a "break" from "regular" quests so they go do..um...different(?) quests that are basically the same in Grizz but that just have no effect or advance the main storyline? The existing worlds already have many quests like this. Now there's an entire World full of them.

People need a Challenge? huh? what? The next linear world is usually challenging enough and as RoloX2 put it...
rabbit-trailing off the main quest-line (which is linear and necessary) runs the risk of making your character over-levelled and, consequently, the game boring, a dud.



Survivor
Mar 19, 2009
24
My disappointment came not in the actually world of Grizzleheim but the disected parts of it.My complaints are as follows:
1) We cant lvl up no more
2) No new outfits except the low lvl and poor stat items
3) There is a building where you can buy housing items but no house
4) Bosses are too hard especially Malistaire ( amount of life is fine ).

I loved this game and would play hrs. on end but because of these new adds or subtractions I find myself searching the web for a new addiction. :( I do agree with the original post KI you really did drop the crystal ball on this one.It appears to me that you are trying to compete with other online games like World of Warcraft. If your going that route whay should I pay to play Wizards when I could play WOW for double your price.This game used to be something I would tell people about and brag about.Now I feel I have lead some people astray. I hope these issues are addressed before I and may other fellow wizards loses interest.

Survivor
Mar 19, 2009
24
Another problem I have noticed is that my death grandmaster has been fizzling way more in Grizzleheim than he had before the new world was added.It also appears that most of the fizzles that I am having only happen in Grizzleheim. Should of named it Fizzleheim instead of Grizzleheim. ROTFL

Survivor
Jun 10, 2009
35
I've not been through Grizz yet, so I can't really say much about it, but i have read several post here and have a thought that could be tossed out like yesterdays trash, but here it is any way.
Malistaire is dead, defeated, or whatever. What if this world is just the beginning of a new, bigger, and more powerful evil. I don't think Ambrose is the kind of wizard that would turn away other worlds in need of help just because his is safe for the time being. Before I judge Grizz, I will play it in it's entirety and wait to see what happens next. Even though spin offs for movies rarely work out, which,from what I gather, is basically what this is, a spin off, I will reserve my judgement of Grizz for now. After reading "So what's the point of Grizzleheim again?" I can't say that you are right or wrong, but I'm hoping your wrong. We'll just have to wait and see.

As for the "new and improved bosses", What the... Why not just give us a message that tells us, "You're Defeated" when we walk through the door and send us straight to the commons? KI you really need to change this. Not necessarily back to the way it was, but definitely not the way it is now. I'm sure your intensions were good by trying to make the bosses more challenging, but there is a difference in challenging and impossible. Especially for solo players like myself. Necromancer=solo, alone, by ones self, without the aid of others, me myself and I. Get the picture?

Community Leader
Dridsuzy wrote:

If you don't want to go through it, don't.

Couldn't have said it better my self. Good thing I'm paying for this privilege eh? I wonder if you'll want to go through it again after the first time?


Look, I understand your disappointment. Really, I do. But paying a sub for a game does not mean that you are entitled to like everything that game offers.

And yes, I will happily go through Grizzleheim more than once.

Defender
Feb 03, 2009
119
Look, I understand your disappointment. Really, I do. But paying a sub for a game does not mean that you are entitled to like everything that game offers.


I realize this, but I am entitled to have an opinion and from the majority of responses to this thread I'm not alone in my particular opinion.

You, on the other hand, haven't really offered an opinion. You've just attacked mine. So if you think Grizzleheim is such a great addition to the game, I'd be interested to know why. No, Grizz being new doesn't count because it won't be new for long.

Defender
Aug 01, 2008
101
ArcanaJayne wrote:
Dridsuzy wrote:

If you don't want to go through it, don't.

Couldn't have said it better my self. Good thing I'm paying for this privilege eh? I wonder if you'll want to go through it again after the first time?


Look, I understand your disappointment. Really, I do. But paying a sub for a game does not mean that you are entitled to like everything that game offers.

And yes, I will happily go through Grizzleheim more than once.


I won't.

Survivor
Jun 10, 2009
35
this wizard who has been playing since november and paid for a year in january, has a second account that plays monthly, as well as my sons account, who says do not renew, a niece who when the firstr boss encouter meltdown happens will no longer be paid for my nephew who was waiting for his birthday money to pay for his account, he checked out the changes on my account and sid he has better ways to spend his birthday money than on a game were bosses cheat. ki really needs to listen in my family alone 2 accounts gone 3 on the way, that is out of the 5 i have hmmm think the boss cheats are "worth it"

WOW! I don't like the new boss rules either, but cancel my subscription and stop playing? No way. Might be a good opportunity here to teach the family that when the going gets tough, work together. Not run away and give up doing something you like and enjoy. Would you give up camping because you get rained on or quit fishing because you didn't catch anything? Probably not. At least I hope you wouldn't. Finding things to do together with a family, as a family, and that the entire family enjoys is not easy. Don't through it away because it "rains" a little.

Community Leader
Dridsuzy wrote:

I realize this, but I am entitled to have an opinion and from the majority of responses to this thread I'm not alone in my particular opinion.


Nobody said you were.

You, on the other hand, haven't really offered an opinion. You've just attacked mine.

Attacked? I said you sounded negative, that's hardly an attack.

Your initial complaint was almost entirely that Grizzleheim wasn't a linear part of the the original storyline.

To which I say, so what?

MMOs are, by nature, a work in progress. There will always be more additions, tweaks and refinements. Not every change is popular (for example, the new boss fight system) and those things don't last long. Personally, I think crafting is too much of a grind, but that doesn't mean the whole system is worthless. It just means that it needs to be refined.

But to complain about an entire added world simply because it branches out from the original storyline? That makes no sense to me.

So if you think Grizzleheim is such a great addition to the game, I'd be interested to know why. No, Grizz being new doesn't count because it won't be new for long.

You're kidding, right? Why should I justify why I like it? I just do.

Survivor
Dec 13, 2008
10
I actually like the addition of grizzleheim.

It is a very diverse in lvl world.

I think it starts out with monsters at rank 3 and ends with rank 10

It is a world where you will probably start to do at lvl 22, beat the first part, then go back to the other quests in krocotopia-marleybone, then go back to grizzleheim.

Defender
Feb 03, 2009
119
No, I'm not kidding. I never said I didn't Like Grizz. My question is what's the POINT of Grizz.

The answer is that there IS no point. It's just more of the same and you can go through it if you want...or not.

The reason I'm upset is that it doesn't advance the game as a whole, it doesn't improve my grandmasters in any way, and it doesn't offer anything new other than a different kind of animal giving me the same kind of quests.

The teleport stones are nice and I'd love to see more of those in the Worlds you MUST go through in order to get the spiral key for the next world. You see, it's not just about the storyline. The game forces you into a linear path by keeping the key to the next world as a final reward. The storyline is actually inconsequential, it's the aspects of required gameplay that I'm talking about. Things that must be accomplished in order to simply continue playing the game. Most MMO's DON'T have this particular gameplay ruleset, but Wizard 101 is built on it. THAT's why I question the point of Grizz.

Perhaps this is but the beginning of a much larger and broader scope for this game. One that can offer a variety of avenues to play and succeed. If that's the case then GREAT! Personally, I think all they have to do is remove the need for Spiral Keys to travel to different worlds. Then the game will truly be opened up to random adventuring and quest tracking. Something I think Grizzleheim is just barely touching on. BUT, this is a kid's game, therefore there's a need for linear progression...handholding, if you will....to help the kid's understand what to do next.

With the implementation of Crafting, Bazaar, and new boss encounters...maybe Wizard 101 is trying to grow up a little and perhaps Grizzleheim is a representation of this. I don't know. But as it stands now there's no real "point" to Grizzleheim and I'm frustrated thinking of all the man hours and resources used to create it. Hopefully it's just the beginning....

Survivor
May 25, 2009
43
Personally, I like Grizzleheim. I like Crafting and the Bazaar. But the new boss fight system is just plain dumb. Bosses need to be challenging, but if one aspect of the game is this difficult, the entire plot and storyline seem to fly clean out the window. :?

Survivor
Dec 16, 2008
4
What's the point of Grizz? It gives the majority of players someplace to go once they discover they can't beat the bosses anymore. Someplace to while away the hours whilst KI gets around to fixing this update. Meanwhile the Grand Masters can play the rest of the worlds.

1